@soix @kalali Yes between the three pre-amps I have heard in my home environment, I like Don Sach's 2 as the best of the 3 , again this is very subjective based on my listening tests and "ears"
Build Quality: better parts, point to point wiring , to me DS 2 is very revealing, no brightness, realism in voices, vocals are good , bass is just about right ! do not hear any tube sloppiness sometimes you get with lower class pre amps, very quite. However the unit is not cheap but considering the fact it competes with higher priced units and is custom built it is perhaps fairly priced at its price point . Hope that helps.
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I think he’s comparing his newly acquired DS model 2 with the VTA and Candela and saying its got much better sound and build quality. One lingering question; did DS also build the VTA-SP14 preamp before making his own brand? I'm still getting the relationship between the VTA and DS units. Sorry if I'm missing the obvious. |
"Since I have had the privilege of having VTA-SP14 in my home for two weeks and also having listened to the Candela Pre-amp. I can tell you the build quality of this pre-amp is head and shoulder above the VTA-Sp 14 the sound quality . No match ! at least 50/60 % better."
Sorry but I can't figure out what you mean here. Can you clarify which has better build quality and sound quality and maybe add what the specific improvements in sound are? Would be most interesting and helpful. Thanks!
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I can elaborate on Dons SP14 with his KT88. After months of swapping cables and tubes my conclusion is that with some minute changes you can improve on what is already a wonderful match.
Enjoy! |
@Kalali , @aberyclark around August 30 a member on audio circle advertised to sell a Don Sach model 2 , with Xlr input and 1 uf Jupiter capacitors after checking his bonafide with Don, I offered to purchase the unit. So instead of a long wait I got this fully loaded unit which is about a year old in pristine condition with walnut wood case and according to the previous owner had about 300 hours of play on the tubes. Since I have had the privilege of having VTA-SP14 in my home for two weeks and also having listened to the Candela Pre-amp. I can tell you the build quality of this pre-amp is head and shoulder above the VTA-Sp 14 the sound quality . No match ! at least 50/60 % better. I will be sending this unit back to Don for some upgrades he has suggested specially Audyn film power capacitors and a extra set of Audiocap theta caps by passed by Teflon in 3 uf value to drive my SS Odyssey Kismet .Complete rewiring of the board to the inputs with Dueland 20 awg wiring and 1 input with Neotech gold & silver wiring. Unbelievable as it may sound it will still cost me less than what I would have a paid Don for a new pre-amp plus a 10 week wait !
I have not heard the Rogue RP -1 although I have listened to a prima luna pre amp at an audio show I have put down my initial listening experience on the Audio Circle forum. @aberyclark I'd be happy for you to come in listen to this pre and compare the Rogue Rp-1 if you want to come down to 95376 Zip code I live in Central California myself
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Good topi c . I have the Rogue RP1. I swapped the stock JJ's for Telefunken Tektronix, huge improvement . Also went to a Silnote power cord . I'm playing FLAC files through a Schiit DAC with Morrow MA5 interconnects . I wish I could find someone in central California with a Sachs pre to compare side by side. I'm not impressed with the Rogues headphone section and I haven't gone back to vinyl YET . But as far as I've gone I'm happy. By the time you get the Rogue , tubes and a power cord you're at $2000, so take that into consideration . Based on what I've read online, Donn Sachs will be my next Pre . I'm also curios about Balanced in and out . I'd go deluxe on the upgrades , so it would still be more than the Rogue . I play the snot outta my system and 18 months in no issues . When I get the Sachs I'm gonna go 100 wpc + tubes or 200 wpc + SS. As I have low power now . I'm interested to hear how this plays out . I'll probably benefit from this thread as much as you . I like the gentleman's opinion about his tube compliment as that answered one of my questions . I tried some Psvane TI power tubes and found the bass light too . I prefer Gold Lion reissue and SED Winged C over them . In the Rogue I've tried Telefunken , Seimens Nickel plates, RCA JAN blackplates, NOS Mullard . They all bettered the provided JJ's. So I wish you the best . Thanks to all and Happy Listening, Mike. What did the Telefunken Tektronix bring to the RP-1 that the JJs lacked? |
Call Don. He's extremely responsive, customer focused to the max, and a hell of a nice guy. My interactions with him have been stellar. |
soix and kalali, have you read the description on Don's site? http://www.dsachsconsulting.com/custom%20line%20stage.htmlAlso I assume the Model 1 was an earlier version no longer available. I got my Model 2 about 10 months ago and the 1 was never mentioned when placing my order. I read one review of the VTA-SP-14 (Audio Asylum) but never heard one. I expect it is a great deal for the money, but not up to the level of Don's. |
soix, great question. Been meaning to ask that too. Looks like the DS2 uses the SP14 basic design but with the tubes mounted on top. Couldn't find a price for the VTA-SP14 though. Sounds like a great deal if its actually half the DS2 price.
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Sorry but I have to ask some stupid questions as a prospective buyer who can't find the answers. What's the difference between Don's model 1 and 2 preamps? What's the difference between Don's version of the SP14 and the VTA version (design, price, options, etc.), and is there a relationship between the two? Thanks for any info.
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@kalali, wont have my DS 2 before November 2017, however a new found friend Via Audio circle spent a couple of hours with me, he brought in his odyssey Candela pre-amp for me to try with my Maggie 1.7i and the Kismet amplifier , sounded wonderful ! (this gentleman owns Tekton Double Impact speakers) after about an hour plus listening we switched back to the VTA-SP 14 , we were surprised by the Soundstage, Clarity and it certainly was not a step backwards ! the DS 2 is supposed to sound about 30% to 40 % better , lets see what happens when I get my amplifier. but again DS 2 twice the price ! t |
Congratulations. a-shah, if possible, kindly please share your experience with a comparison between the VTA-SP14 and the Don Sach's Model2. These two and the Mapletree preamp(s) are on my short list of tube preamps when I get ready to pull the trigger. Won't be long. What amplifier will you be pairing your preamp with? P.S. If you don't mind me asking, how long is the wait time for Dan's preamp? |
I can't comment on Don Sach's custom, but I built the VTA kit that is the starting point for his.
I couldn't be happier, & his can only be better! |
I have also ordered Don Sachs Model 2 in Walnut and extra goodies; many praise this unit as a true reference sounding pre-amp and I'm looking forward on implementing in my system.
Wig |
@jmac7,
I guess, like Kevin Deal of Prima Luna /Upsacale audio claims in his Utube video's the Primaluna Pre-amps weigh more than other Pre-amps, made by other manufacturer's well ! having heard Don Sachs amp the choice was between Weight & Sound quality so I choice sound quality He He He !
at the same price point not to say that prema Luna's are not good pre-amps, I have also heard good things about Rogue Audio RP-1 but have already ordered DS 2 in a Walnut case with upgraded caps , meanwhile I do have a VTA-SP-14(tubes4HIfi.com/SP14) on loan from @whitestix that I am listening to in my system
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Good topic . I have the Rogue RP1. I swapped the stock JJ's for Telefunken Tektronix, huge improvement . Also went to a Silnote power cord . I'm playing FLAC files through a Schiit DAC with Morrow MA5 interconnects . I wish I could find someone in central California with a Sachs pre to compare side by side. I'm not impressed with the Rogues headphone section and I haven't gone back to vinyl YET . But as far as I've gone I'm happy. By the time you get the Rogue , tubes and a power cord you're at $2000, so take that into consideration . Based on what I've read online, Donn Sachs will be my next Pre . I'm also curios about Balanced in and out . I'd go deluxe on the upgrades , so it would still be more than the Rogue . I play the snot outta my system and 18 months in no issues . When I get the Sachs I'm gonna go 100 wpc + tubes or 200 wpc + SS. As I have low power now . I'm interested to hear how this plays out . I'll probably benefit from this thread as much as you . I like the gentleman's opinion about his tube compliment as that answered one of my questions . I tried some Psvane TI power tubes and found the bass light too . I prefer Gold Lion reissue and SED Winged C over them . In the Rogue I've tried Telefunken , Seimens Nickel plates, RCA JAN blackplates, NOS Mullard . They all bettered the provided JJ's. So I wish you the best . Thanks to all and Happy Listening, Mike. |
I have had both the Prima Luna and Don Sachs. Don's preamps are better in my opinion.Better soundstage,clarity,pace, etc. Right now I am using an integrated amp but if I go back to using a preamp,it will be a Sachs. |
I don't have one of Don's preamp, but he did a repair/upgrade on one of my old McIntosh C-20 tube preamps and Don's work was superb. He fixed an ongoing problem that I had taken the C-20 in to three other shops for repair. Two of the shops were McIntosh authorized repair shops.
Don not only fixed it, but suggested a couple of additional upgrades and I now have a 50+ year old tube preamp that has measurably better specs than the published specs from original McIntosh sales literature.
And the sound is fantastic!
Toolbox
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Ok having heard Don’s amp at a friends house considering all other options at his price point I have decided to order his Don Sach’s model 2 pre amp in a Walnut case with remote control and all the bells and whistles thank you all for your feed back and answers |
@radiohead99
Give Don Sachs a call. He's always willing to talk about his builds.
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Is it possible to have them in full balanced configuration (not just XLR in)? Has anyone compared them to much more expensive preamp? |
I have one. Beautiful preamp. I went for all of Don's upgrades (except for XLR). Tube rolling makes a big difference. I originally tried it with 4 x Psvane CV-181z Selects, but found the bass frequencies too 'muddy'. The sweet spot was 2 x CV181z's and 2 x chrome top Sylvania 6SN7's. |
Here's a link with some customer reviews toward the bottom. The last one is from a guy who compared directly to ARC and Prima Luna preamps... http://www.tubes4hifi.com/SP14.htm |
yes I have looked at Tube-o-Phile on A/C , what I am trying to find out is how does it compare to primaluna and Rogue audio pre- amps , since they are priced at a similar price level. I have listened to a Prima Luna amp at the Oakland Audio show 2017, which sounded very good .
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Its actually a line stage. Don also offers a phono stage but that is separate, not as an integrated preamplifier.
I've owned one of his custom SP-14s for several months and continue to be delighted. It is absolutely quiet, offers great dynamics and huge soundstage, and most importantly to me accurate tonalities. In addition, Don will customize any order in terms of parts quality, features, and output load to suit the customer. All this at a very reasonable cost.
Yes, it competes with much more expensive competition.
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You might want to read the threads in the Tube-o-Phile circle on the audiocircle site. |
