Dick's / Dave's picks

I want to whole "experience", warts and all.
I love the long breaks and tunings between songs.

ifmywordsdidglow, 
"It bothers me that the Dick's Picks releases do not include full shows."
Out of 36 volumes of Dicks Picks there are only a few that are not complete full shows... OR are you saying, you wish they were "un-cut", meaning still having the sometimes long breaks and tuning between the songs? I love that on the un-cut boards that are out there.

jond,
Not to get picky here or miss your "generalizing", but --and info for those that may not know-- a matrix recording (AUD and SDB mixed to varying percentages) does much more than just adds crowd noise. A good well done matrix can compleatly change the sound and feel of a show recording.

rbbert,
I kind of agree, as there is magic to be heard in every single Dead show [release] (to keep it with the thread subject)... Personally I am generally a 'one set at a time' listener but often just choose a run of songs to play at a time.

There are some people doing some very nice stuff with matrixing aka adding crowd noises back in to great sounding soundboards.

After over 45 years of listening to live Dead recordings, I'm not in the whole show camp at all (and actually haven't been for a long time!).  There are whole shows I listen to, of course, but probably less than half the time even if I have the whole show available.

JMO of course

excellent points! ifmywordsdidglow & goofyfoot.

Happy Listening!

ifmywormsdidglow (tee-hee) I totally get that. The vibe of the crowd, which city, what decade, these things are definitely compromised.
 

I have a bunch of Dicks Picks but they get lost in my collection of audience recordings and soundboards that I've acquired over the years. It bothers me that the Dick's Picks releases do not include full shows. I prefer listening to full shows because they give you a better glimpse into what the atmosphere and energy was like. Most of the DPs are good quality soundwise so that is a plus but I'll take a good audience recording any day...love to hear and feel the vibe of the venue. You can really see the shape of the venue on some of the better recordings.

Thanks! jond.

Also 5/15/70 which is  Road Trips Vol 3  is totally amazing.

To quote Jerry--- "It can't be done!" (; 

Dick's Pick 4 and I've only hear about five of the Dave's Picks nothing really has stood out to me.

Excellent question- goofyfoot.

Anyone, if you could pick one show from Dick's and one show from Dave's, which would you choose?

Thank You- guys.

Also if you've never torrented before best to get some help from a friend who knows what he's doing it can be pretty daunting.

Just make sure Charlie Miller is in the source info details.

He has done his "clean-up" / "fix-up" work on both SBD recordings and AUD recordings. 

Enjoy! 

TY- jond & rbbert

If you want to get the shows in 16/44.1 or better resolution, archive.org won’t let you for soundboards. There are a number of bit-torrent trackers where the sbd’s can be freely downloaded. www.bt.etree.org, www.shnflac.net, www.gdvault.com, www.dimeadozen.org are a few. www.db.etree.org is a much easier place to search for specific shows and the various recordings of each one. There are built-in links there to the show pages at archive.org and bt.etree.org

Jafant go to archive.org, hundreds of Charlie Miller remasters and to be clear these are all unofficial bootlegs but Charlie has a huge following and is a very good guy.

Guys-

which shows were mastered by Charlie Miller?

Ah, I see... Funny how easy it is for the 'grapevine' to get distorted. With that said --and apart from totally spacing that these particular 77 shows we were speaking about were Betty Boards (duh!)-- there are even a few good ones that Healy has or so Ive been told.

Oh well... As mentioned, the music is all still out there for us but just imagine how David Lemieux and crew must feel. You know they want to continue to give the best possible Dead music to the fans that they can. It must be so frustrating for them, trying to make a deal like this happen with a 'seller' that seemingly just doesn't care.

But it makes one wonder just how long these folk are willing to sit on these tapes? I can pretty much bet that they aren't being collected for the shear love of owning them.

Perhaps not so hopeful, as the owner of the first 2 Betty batches, the ones with the most desirable shows and best physical tape condition, isn't willing to part with them except for a ridiculous amount of money.  That part of your post was unfortunately quite correct.

rbbert, 
thanks so much for completing the story here! That is just what i was hoping would happen. Great news! Or at least better to hear than Healy having the May 77 shows with him, as that would continue to seem hopeless. He does have some but sounds more promising than I had suspected. 

Not to take anything away from Charlie, but he only very very rarely does any "mastering" in the traditional sense.  He will try to clean up recording or transfer mistakes (clicks, pops, dropouts, volume irregularities, etc) but does nothing else (e.g. EQ, compression, etc)

Either way the shows are out there and honestly I'll take a Charlie Miller master any day of the week over official releases. Listening to his remasters of 8/29-30/69 of Family Dog at the Great Highway and holy crap they sound amazing!

It's not Dan Healy who has the reel masters ("Betty Boards") of the missing May '77 shows (and many others as well), but the anonymous buyer of 2 steamer trunks worth of reels auctioned off in 1985 from Betty Cantor-Jackson's storage locker.  Then there is a third trunk which included the Academy of Music '72 shows (released officially from DAT copies of the reels; those reels are also missing from the Vault), and even a 4th batch (!) recently "uncovered", some or all of which may be returning to the vault.

rhyno got it and sent you an email.

"Guys the reason most of May 77 hasn't been released is exactly because so many of those shows are already out there as great sounding soundboards. Official releases would be redundant."

Thats just not true. There are plenty of official release shows that were widely traded and with great sound. It has never stopped Dave and crew from releasing what they want. He has even stated "many of you probably already have upcoming release 'x' but...yadda yadda." To name a few famous ones that were widely traded before being releaced- 2-13-70, 8-27-72, 3-29-90, just to name a few... 

5-8-77 and the surrounding shows would sell like crazy. BUT they are NOT in the vault. Dave has said so himself. Last time it was mentioned, on a "Weir Here" episode I believe, he said " not yet." Eluding to the fact that they were working on it, but I really don't know. And during one of his "seaside chat" vids OR during one of his U-stream chats he used to do, Dave mentioned "we're working on it." I can't recall what exact show he was referring to there but its all in reference to trying to make a deal to get a bunch of shows back.

When Healy left/was fired from working with the band in 93, that was it. He has many many SBD masters that he recorded and belong to him...and he, as of now, is still hoarding them, as far as we know.. For bad blood reasons. [Read the thread on the Steve Hoffman forum for more on the split.]

Years ago, back in the bootleg CD days (meaning those 'official looking' unofficial pressed and packaged CD sets), there was a series of shows put out by bootleggers called "Left In The Vaults". those shows --all very good-- were rumored to be from Dan Healy. He has the masters for some very very good uncirculated shows, along with the masters for some of those famous shows. 

The "house boat tapes" is a great story of some very good early Dead tape masters being found. One or two of them have been released as Dick's and Dave's Picks and I believe a few more are to come. 

I originally brought this subject up hoping that someone would have some updated 'good news' for us about the 77 shows and/or others. Dave's Picks is starting to get juuuust a little hit and miss...

Personally I would LOVE to see and hear them all --known or unknown gems-- given the Deadnet treatment, mixing, liner note booklets, artwork and everything. I love that stuff (: 

also, the OOP 5 show box set from May 77 is a no brainer. other than being OOP of course.  but lately i've been head over heels w/ mydland shows: releases like "nightfall" (amazing) and "wake up to find out" (also awesome) and an 87 bootleg from MSG---good loving into la bamba. ---you want to hear a party in your house, wait til jerry sings la bamba.

jond, sent you a PM. 

I am actively seeking a copy of Dick's Picks #1: 5/25/77 "The Mosque" Richmond VA.

Its not just the Dead, its listening to anything I like: The visceral impact and the tireless involvement I find myself part of when I listen to music on a really well put together system. Last night, I rediscovered The Cowboy Junkies "Miles From Our Home" while driving back from a dinner event. Got home, turned on the "big rig", got out the spectrum analyzer and started up the same music I just heard in the car. Woof! Woof! Woof! (This is almost worse than being a newly horny teenager seeking new experiences...)

Certainly jond however Rhino, or even better MOFI, or even better Analogue Productions, could bring those tapes to a different level than what we're already familiar with. But yes, I remember that Cornell University tape sounding terrific. I can only hope.

Guys the reason most of May 77 hasn't been released is exactly because so many of those shows are already out there as great sounding soundboards. Official releases would be redundant. I have awesome copies of both 5/8 and 5/9 if anyone needs them shoot me a
pm.

Right On! jriggy

there are a cast of characters that have some really good and valuable shows from the GD.  It is really a shame that money, is the dividing factor, and the main reason for not being issued at this time?

Greed would be next in line...

Friends indeed- guys,

tell me more about Charlie Miller- this is the first that I have heard his name?  Happy Listening!

The problem is, as I understand, those May 77 shows are not in the Vault... I don't know if they are ones in Dan Healy's possession or not but he does have A LOT of very good shows that he is not coming off of --they are his property.

There was rumor of him being in talks with Dave and Rhino but last I heard, a few years ago or so, is that he wanted to much money for them and Dead camp and/or Rhino could not afford them AND be able to make a dime.

That May 1977 period is hard to find on a CD that isn't a bootleg. The Cornell show, the Boston show before it and the Buffalo show after are being slighted in my opinion. I wish Dave would find a way to release these on Rhino.

@vicweast The 5/25/77 The Mosque Richmond VA was released as Dave's Pick # 1.

vicweast,

What a neat way to listen and learn the evolution of a song through the years!
I will usually listen to the newest release, then listen to the shows before and after it --kinda like 'doing a run of shows' in my own living/system room (; 
Or, for more casual listening, I will ask my wife to name a song or a year or both, then I'll hunt us something from there. That method is great for the Relisten app to the bluetooth speakers in the kitchen.

Its the weekend, lets all put on some Dead! 

Grate thread! Nice to see so many "friends" here on Audiogon. :)  

I, too, prefer the shows from 71-80.  I don't think you can wrong with any Dick's/Dave's from that era. I'm not much of fan of anything the band did with Brent- unfortunately those were the only shows I got to see. (Until he passed) 

I am definitely an audiophile, but not necessarily when it comes to listening to the Dead. I love Reckoning and own some shows on vinyl but I really love "listening" to the studio albums. They really were/ are special and, in my opinion, under appreciated. 

Like many of us, I fell in love with Dead listening to ratty many-Gen cassette tapes- so fidelity isn't of primary importance to me. There is an app (iphone maybe android?) called Relisten. It has every show- often times multiple copies of each show available to stream. It's almost overwhelming. I use it all the time. The best part is, it's free! 

FWIW, I also "highly" recommend a band called Forgotten Space to anyone inclined to wanting to experience a great interpretation of the band from the 70's era live. They are based in Dallas but do tours through the central states often. As a matter of fact they will be St. Louis, Chicago, Milwaukee maybe Indy this month. Forgottenspace.net or on Facebook. 

@jriggy That Venetta "Sunshine Daydream" DVD/CD set is really a remarkable time capsule. I have listened to the CD several times, and watched the DVD twice since I got it in 2015. 


I also completely dig "The Other One" box set. woof! woof! woof!

Which Dave or Dick's picks? I would not know where to start! The problem is that after 50 years in business, The Grateful Dead have an unbelievable catalog of recorded live shows. Certainly not all are great, but there sure are a ton of incredible tracks and concerts that will keep you busy for years of listening.

I like to get on a specific song kick and then listen to as many versions over the years as possible. What a music participating adventure the Dead brought us.

I am still looking for a copy of Richmond VA "The Mosque" concert... I heard it on Sirius this past year and its in my locater sights... (no luck yet)

Thanks! for sharing- goofyfoot + scott_w
Happy Listening!

Dick's Picks #8 is profoundly good.

I'm all over the place when it comes to live Dead recordings. But at this stage of my development, I'm hoping to collect the Europe 72 box set. Recently, a friend of mine ripped me a version of the Cincinnati Riverbed show from the 30 Trips set. That was a great show for me and I've always remembered it as one of the best I'd seen.
The 'Formerly The Warlocks' box set is very good however that was late Jerry and it gets me a little depressed. But for sentimental reasons, I always go back to 'Skull and Roses' as that was my first ever Dead record and I wore that record out.
Aside from the Europe 72 tour, my interest is in procuring a copy of the infamous Cornell University show which many believe to be the Gold Standard by which all other shows are measured. I can't endorse that view but I do recall that I liked the cassette tape of that show even though I don't remember what was on it or even the date that it was recorded.
Right now I'm listening to 'Rocking The Rhein' (Mr. Charlie). And as far as Dick's Picks, 'One From The Vault' is still a classic. But yes, I certainly need to expand my horizons.

Thanks! for sharing- jond & jriggy.

Good points jond! I'll have to break out my Miller shows and compare. Havnt done that with this system, so I clearly don't know (:

Im at the 79 show in the 30trips box set. Good stuff... 

jriggy to be honest I suck at techno stuff and don't torrent or anything myself but friends of mine do and they pretty much dropbox me stuff. I wish I could be more help but give etree a try. And when I say better than official releases a lack of compression is one thing that stands out to me particularly on Dicks Pick 4, Charlie's remaster is just more open sounding and extended at the frequency extremes.

Yes, to reiterate jond, the shows out there that have been "fixed up" by Charlie Miller are, I assume, all great! I have a hand full of em.
I'm not sure I would say they are better than the work Jeffery Norman does to the official releases but they are very good. 

Is etree the best place to get Charlie's shows?

Someone should construct a comprehensive site of the Charlie Miller shows and DL links! That would be awesome.