I have extensive experience with the Bose 901s originals (now called series I) and experience with the Super Bose configuration and even the big Bose 1801 power amp. Bose can project a nice wide sound stage but it is a totally artificial concoction and only works with certain recordings. In most cases the sound is spread too wide and singers sound like they are 12 feet wide. Add the lack of full frequency response and the result is not even approaching anything near hi-fi.
If you like a wide sound stage and good 3D imaging without the loss of pinpoint location, a panel speaker will get you way more satisfaction. On your budget an Onkyo 9555 and a pair of Magnepans would work. If you must use Bose 901s the Onkyo is still a good choice. Happy hunting. |
01-07-12: Loomisjohnson
"almarg is unquestionably the smartest person on these forums. possibly in the world. therefore, you should follow his counsel."
Sometimes I just scan down the thread to almarg's post to get the answer. |
almarg is unquestionably the smartest person on these forums. possibly in the world. therefore, you should follow his counsel. |
Save your money very bad choice. |
As with any audio advise especially speakers, let your ears be the judge. That being said, I used to own the 901's powered by a Yamaha receiver, sounded great to my ears back in the day. Beat my Harvard speakers and Pioneer system hands down. Time moved on and my audio tasted changed, I hope for the better. But truly enjoyed the 901's and the Yamaha gear. If they sound good to you, that is the best way to go for you. Happy listening. |
01-07-12: Johnnyb53
There are other things I don't agree with. For example, Amar Bose arrived at an 11/89% ratio of direct-to-reflected sound based on his measurements of Boston's Symphony Hall. The thing is, Symphony Hall is one of the most reverberant concert venues in the world. I would add that there are problems with the 11/89% ratio in at least two other respects: 1)A recording of a performance in a hall will already have captured both direct and reflected sound. And if the recording is well engineered, that will have been done in a reasonably proper ratio. 2)A given ratio of direct to reflected sound that is produced by the speakers and the listening room will be perceived completely differently than the same ratio would be perceived in a concert hall, because the delay times between direct and reflected sound arrivals are vastly different in the two cases. Putting aside issues related to quality of implementation, the basic concept itself is fundamentally flawed IMO. Disclaimer: I have never heard a Bose speaker. I also have no desire to. Regards, -- Al |
i get a good laugh when ever i think back to my 501 and 901 days. had a carver receiver pushing them and thought they sounded great.
i was wrong =) |
There are certain things in the Bose 901 design that are desirable, especially crossoverless full-range drivers and an array designed to interact with the room. There are many speakers designed to interact with the rom to good effect. Examples include omnis from MBL, Ohm, Mirage, and Duevel, bipolars from Def Tech, and dipoles from Quad, Alon, Martin-Logan, Magnepan, and others.
There are other things I don't agree with. For example, Amar Bose arrived at an 11/89% ratio of direct-to-reflected sound based on his measurements of Boston's Symphony Hall. The thing is, Symphony Hall is one of the most reverberant concert venues in the world. Mirage, on the other hand, has over 25 years research into psychoacoustics and they arrived at a 60/40 ratio of direct-to-reflected sound for their Omniguide-based speakers. I've been living with a pair of those for nearly 4 years and still find them to be engaging and timbre-correct.
I think the Bose concept could be a lot better than it is in the 901 format. Bose has improved their 4" driver somewhat over the 43 years they've been in production, but they could do better. GoldenEar's 4" driver has a cast frame and is light and fast enough to have usable response out to 20KHz. What if Bose made a floorstander with GoldenEar-quality drivers backloaded with a transmission line? What if there was a curved front baffle to angle 5 of these drivers for optimum dispersion and 4 drivers on the back for ambience? With a light, fast driver and transmission line loading, the active equalizer circuit wouldn't have to work so hard and would presumably be less intrusive regarding phase relationships and whatnot.
That said, I have to admit that I haven't listened to 901s for a long long time, and certainly haven't listened to Series VI, so I have no business saying exactly how good or bad their current product offering is. For all I know they've made significant improvements in how resolving and how wide the bandwidth is in their 4" drivers, but I don't know. The current driver still has a stamped frame and the cone material is still blue paper like the Series III as far as I can tell. They've evidently improved the baseline bandwidth, however, because the current active equalizer isn't compatible with Series I-IV. |
Everyone should buy what they like. However, all of us, if we are honest and we can still remember that far back, made a lot of costly mistakes finding our way. In those days it was much easier to turn your product back into the market place than it is today. So decisions made now are harder to correct than they were when we were fumbling.
Smart people learn from history and the mistakes of others thereby sparing themselves the expense, disappointment and inconvenience that an emotional or otherwise unwise purchase can cause. This is why we read Consumer Reports and ask for advice on this and other forums. Apparently many, maybe most, of us believe this to be true.
That being said, it is also true that we only know what we know and, in most cases, can't see how little we know vis a vis the whole body of available knowledge. To overcome this handicap, I strive to locate and emulate the individuals who impress me as well experienced and intellectually sufficient enough to guide me by the way they spent their money. That removes much (probably all) of "personal agenda" questions from my evaluation of their selections.
So --- please find me an amplifier manufacturer who involves their company with Bose. The potential to hitchhike a partnership with a sales monster like Bose would be very tempting, I would think. But no-one does it. Could be because of the credibility bruising they would suffer from embracing a product which the majority of audiophiles denounce -- or --- it could be because Bose really is that bad relative to the various and sundry other alternatives available. I suspect the latter, having owned 901s for 4 years in the 1970s and having sold hundreds of pairs of them during that time. Quite by accident I found myself using a pair of $100 AR speakers back then and being amazed at just how much better they sounded than my prized 901s.
What a shock that was. It took me awhile but I got over my ego and my staunch evangelical recalcitrance and sold my 901s. Got a pair of B&O S-45 speakers and never looked back.
For what it's worth - that's my answer to your inquiry.
Incidentally, I own and use daily a pair of horn hybrid loudspeakers nowadays that outperform anything else I've ever heard anywhere. And I drive them with a Yamaha A-S2000 integrated which is very well up to the task. So you are on the right track amp wise in my opinion but you should look elsewhere for speakers if you value nuance, tonal accuracy and timbral fullness. Bose doesn't do that stuff. There's no harm in buying them and there's the chance that you will like them for awhile, but the most likely scenario has Bose going down in your personal experience as an unnecessary detour. |
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HenryJudy, I see that you are very new to Audiogon. You will find out soon enough that a lot of knowledgeable people on this forum disagree on just about every topic, sometimes they vehemently disagree. I suggest you take in all of the opinions that you read, then go with your ears, gut and wallet in choosing a system for yourself. You are the one that has to live with the system. What one guy recommends for you might not sound good to you in your room. I am not making a recommendation for or against...I'm recommending you buy what you like. You should be able to buy a good set of used 901 series VI for about $500. That way you get to try them in your home to see if you like them. If you don't like them, you should be able to unload them for little or no loss. If you like them and just have to have a new set, sell the used set and buy yourself a new set. Don't fall for the audiophile snobbery. When it's all said and done, it's YOUR money.
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With all due respect guys, for a $3,500 price for a set of speakers and an integrated amp, you are suggesting that Bose 901s are the best choice? Sorry, I am not buying it.
Henryjudy - you can do a lot better than the 901s for your system. At least, listen to some other options before making a decision. In my opinion, the idea that 901s are the best you can do in your price range is, quite frankly, ludicrous.
Remember, I have 901 series VI in my attic for a reason. I listened to them for years, not at a party for an evening. |
Two friends of mine used to Bose 901 & Yamaha based c.d. only systems, they sounded that good to me that it started me questioning my Quad ELS 63 based system. Definition and depth of field being much better with Bose.
Think you'll be more than happy. |
The end is surely near. This is a sign that the apocalypse is upon us. I think it all started when people began using "party" as a verb.
Next I'll be reading about Wendy's gourmet restaurants. |
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I was at a party in an apartment about 20 years ago when I first heard the Bose 301. They sounded really good. A few years later, I heard the Bose 901 in someone's home, they sounded really good also. Both times I heard them, I was not doing any critical listing, but I do remember it being a pleasant listening experience. I am considering getting a set of Bose 901 series VI for the front speakers in my home theater.
When I joined Audiogon, I was surprised to find out that Bose was a no-no. When I started to assemble my main 2-channel system, I dared not consider Bose, mainly because of the opinions I read on Audiogon. For the most part, most of the advice that I've followed on Audiogon to build my system has been spot-on with no complaints.
My advice to the original poster, if you've ever heard the 901's and you liked them...buy them and don't look back. buy what you like and enjoy it.
The 901's come with an equalizer. Make sure the preamp you buy is compatible and has the correct connetctions to work with the Bose EQ. You can go to the Bose website and check out the Owner's manual for the 901 to see if your preamp is compatible.
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Rrog, there's more than "Bose bashing" when it comes to this sort of thing. Believe your ears first and everyone else second.
When it comes to audio people either rave or rant and often without feet planted firmly.
Years ago I heard about a speaker called The Carver Amazing. It was a huge ribbon speaker with multiple subs in each panel. A audiophile friend commented that they got little love, but that most people had no clue about what they could really do when properly set up. I ended up buying a pair for an amazing 1200 dollars here in NY. To this day I've never had more fun with a pair of speakers. They played LOUD. They imaged and had depth. And they soaked up wattage like a sponge and created all kinds of room reflection issues while failing to be continuous from top-to-bottom. My current pair of Merlins are infinitely more refined; a more mature product in every respect.....but WOW those Carvers were a great time and I miss them. There has never been a speaker since to even come close to what they could do for the money, IF set up well.
Hearing those 901's blasting away reminded me of those Carvers. There's room for all kinds of speakers out there, folks!
Rob |
I have never owned Bose speakers, but I have heard them in stereo shops a few times. I did not hear anything objectionable about the sound although I was not critically listening. I have owned too many speakers, amplifiers and preamps to mention including both tube and solid state designs and I have enjoyed each one for their own set of strengths. Because there is so much Bose bashing among audiophiles I am seriously considering the purchase of Bose speakers to find out the truth. I believe too many audiophiles are bashing equipment they know nothing about and have never experience first hand. Why not try them. They are rediculously inexpensive. You can buy used Bose 901s for $500-$700 used including stands and matching equalizer. I have spent that much on stands alone for so called audiophile speakers. I still have the stands, but the speakers are long gone. I would like to hear Bose speakers with some really nice tube electronics. The stores usually demo them with a Japanese receiver. I would like to hear Bose speakers with a high quality front end and cables selected to get the most out of the system. Maybe I will like them and maybe I won't, but there is no way of knowing until you have experienced it for yourself and it could be a lot of fun. Isn't that what it's all about? |
Dpatterson, Maybe you were ignorant back then. You should take the knowledge you have acquired over the years and apply it to a project of getting the best sound from a pair of Bose 901s. You might be surprised. |
I sold Bose back in the day and owned a pair of 901s. I would highly recommend you go in another direction. I would agree with Dtc's comments. |
+1 on the Bose 901's. For years I read in forums as audiophiles bashed these famous speakers, but had not heard a new pair until recently.
FYI, I run Merlin TSM-MXr speakers with Manley tube amp, so I'm certainly nowhere near the "Bose mindset."
BUT....Guess what? The 901's I heard were a ton of fun. They filled a large room with clean musical sound that really impressed me. They were not set up for critical listening, but were well powered by Adcom stuff. I put my upturned nose away and said, "Those 901's actually sound good!" And they did.
Cheers,
Rob |
the yamaha will be a better match with 901's. enjoy. |
Henryjudy, You will probably have a ton of people telling you Bose are not good and the funny thing is the majority of those people probably never heard Bose speakers let alone assembled a system around them. If you are a music lover go with the 901s, but you will need a big room. You may want to consider Bose 301s if you have an average size room (15'x20'). I think the Yamaha will be a good match with any of the Bose speakers. If you are buying from Crutchfield ask their advice. The 901 is a speaker with practically no box to resonate, the drivers are of the same voice, there is no crossover, comes with an EQ to help tune the system to your room and shares direct/reflecting with high end speakers like MBL, Martin Logan, Magnepan, Quad Electrostatics, Mirage and many others. Or you can get on the merry-go-round and start listening to the equipment instead of enjoying the music. |
Sorry - that is Totem Sttaf. I always mis-type that. Sttaf is just not a natural spelling. |
Honestly, dump the 901s. I have a pair in the attic (series VI also). I loved them 25+ years ago. But by todays standards, they just do not cut it.
For the money you are talking there are lots of great options. The last system I set up was a Naim NAT i-2 integrated and Totem Staff speakers, which match your price new and you could get them for half that used. That system will kill any Bose 901 systems.
It is time to move forward. There are lots of options of there. If you can, go to a local shop and listen to some $3K speaker and amp options. And, figure that used you can do even better. |
