Beautiful Vicoustic's flagship Wavewood panels for room tretment. Anyone?
Not in my room yet, but definitely the most beautiful acoustic treatment i’ve ever seen. Wavewood panel is made from a combination of acoustic foam and wood. Its instantly recognizable design results from unique research based on the acoustic properties of the wood and foam combined with non-linear sequential cavities that enable Wavewood to act as both an absorber and diffuser. The Expo Panel System consists of panels that are 3/4“ thick that are perforated following an optimal binary sequence that determines where holes are and where they are not. This scientifically proven approach eliminates the possibility of absorbing excessive high frequencies while preventing lobing effects that are common among many uniformly perforated surfaces. Damn, i need some of these in my white room!
Has anyone tried them? Normally room treatmentis so ugly, but those two solutions are just WOW
2) but i was very impressed by this test, expecially how the vocal sounds with and without pannels in the room (awful choise of music, but anyway): https://youtu.be/XVKR20ecm-0
I use 8 Extreme Bass panels in the front wall’s/two corners. I’ve had them for a couple of years. In my small room, they are instrumental in making it into a BIG room while taming bass nodes. HIGHLY RECOMMENDED!
When you get the bass right, everything seems to fall into place.
Pictures with Vicoustic panels in interior taken by Mika K (from Finland), here is a thread about evolution of his his system. However, there is a little info about wooden panels, speech is all about different speakers.
I really like those Vicousitc panels, but only visually at the present time. My local distributor does not even have a demo units to touch or to check, only to buy new by pre-order :(
Well it sounds like no matter what you do, you will pay to ship leftovers might be a lot less expensive seattle hi-fi has a fair bit of investment in inventory... of course emailing them is free...
Here is a German source for Vicoustics with nice interface to see all of them. What i’m not sure about it the right placement of them in a room, my room is not symmetrical. I think the right place for Wavewood Absorber or Diffuser is (at least) behind the speakers (and super bass extreme traps in the corners behind) ?
I have zero experience with room tretment, the floor is natural wood parquet with various carpets, the rest is late 50's brickwalls with thick plastering on it.
Another vote for Vicoustics. They transformed my room from average to outstanding. They give you the option of using their computer software to map the room. I preferred that method versus guessing as they have specific measured areas to place each specific panel. I heard the biggest improvement with the diffusion/absorption panels on the ceiling which usually gets overlooked.
Using their software is free bonus when you're buyin from them ? Or it will cost extra ?
My local dealer does not provide this important option... :(
I use a product from Vicoustic, Wave Wood. It is similar to the new GIK diffusort panel, the Wave Wood is wood over absorbers, and serves as both a diffusor and smaller absorber. All I can say, after may years of experimentation, this is the best combination that works for me. Of course, some environments will require a lot more absorption than others and integrating diffusors into those types of room may be challenging. I would strike a balance between the absorbers and diffusors. In most rooms I have treated, I have had positive results using this formula.
This type of panel based on a perforation pattern is a tuned absorptive product.RPG Expo is design around optimal binary sequences – these begin to scatter frequencies above ~4KHz.RPG is the only company that has a method behind this type of digital surface approach.With the right mounting condition they are excellent for the right application.
Let us know how they work out. The main reason I never tried the Wavewood panels was the way they needed to be installed. (with the adhesive). If it were me, I’d get some Command strips with the appropriate weight limit for the initial try-out. Then I discovered the Stillpoints Aperatures….WOW!
The only reason I could guess on the subject of reviewers not having room treatments may be for (true to life reviewing of equipment)?
Hey @slaw Yeah, gluing maybe not the best solution for people who wish to change the location of the pannels from time to time, but Vicoustic offering a frame now which can be used as alternative for some of the pannels.
I'm living in a white room surrounded by plants, i think i will glue them to the walls behind the speakers and behind my listening chair and i hope they will be there forever.
I have checked stillpoints aperture and the price is insane (imo). One stillpoint pannel cost $749 and this is more than i paid for 10 vicoustic wavewood pannels including international shipping, they are quite big !
After receiving 10 x Wavewood panels i decided to go for a complete Room Analysis and was shocked how cheap this option is for Hi-Fi Listening Room. Believe it or not, but it was just $50 for my 33 m2 room. Some companies asking thousand dollars for room analysis, but anyone can upload all data on vicoustic website to get full analysis, i think it’s absolutely amazing! There is an option "project request", it took about 2 weeks to get 3D model of my room will all recommended products for the walls, ceiling etc. They even said the first correction is free. Analysis comes in PDF file, but with special app we can download actual 3D model of the room.
I want to recommend it to every audiophile, the price is nothing compared to what you will get. I really paid only $50 (hard to believe).
There are three main areas where acoustic treatment should act on:
1. Reverberation Time (RT); 2. Early Reflections; 3. Sound Field Anomalies (room modes, flutter echoes, etc.).
Highly recommended! No, i do not work for them :)
There is another guy on youtube who explained how he did that, it was very helpful for me. It will cost more for Home Cinema room etc, but for Listening Room it was almost free
@slaw Relatively small Stillpoints panel is $800 each which is a typical High-End price tag for something that available 10 times cheaper from some other manufacturers specializing in acoustic treatment. Any panel for $800 is definitely not for me, sorry. I just don’t believe they can do any better than studio panels (absorbers or diffusers). A wooden frame with acoustic foam or fiberglass can not cost that much anyway. DIYers are happy to make them.
For my 33 square meters room i need about 70 panels of 5 different types according to the actual 3D analysis of my room made by Vicoustic engineers. Using acoustic panels without proper analysis of the actual room make no sense in my opinion. We gotta know where do we need acoustic tretement and why do we need them. They must be in the right place and must be effective.
And while the Stillpoints charge $800 per panes some other respected manufacturers charge $60 per panel (or $600 for 10 panels), i can see many of them, some looks great, some looks ugly.
Last night i’ve glued Vicoustic Wavewood panels on the wall using their Flexy Glue, this glue is removable like this without any damage. I watched these guys before i decided to buy mine, and it was pretty easy to glue the panels. I will continue next week.
I'm building a new listening room (new home) which has a limited size (interior-16'w X 19.5'l X 10'h).
In my prior listening room which I had 39,000 LPs/78s on solid MDF shelving cabinets and on the floor and CDs in steel cabinets, with up to 11.5' high vaulted ceilings, multi-pane casement windows at first reflection and front wall, dual layers of drywall, etc. Not a great sounding room with plenty of slap echo. I treated the room with 2 pairs of Shakti Hallographs and 32 Synergistic Research HFTs. The slap echo was ameliorated during music playing and sound frequency spikes were diminshed (greatly). No problem with bass though. This current room sounds better than 95% of the 100s of rooms I've heard at audio shows and audio salons.
In the new listening only room (storage in an adjacent room), I'm building out the exterior walls with carbon filter absorption panels which are extensively built products unlike GIK cheap materials. What looks like an interior room solution room is quadradic diffusion along the front and rear walls. I doubt that the Stillpoints Aperture (I use only Stillpoints isolation products) would accomplish the same as these big, well built all wood products https://www.acousticfields.com/product/sounddiffuser-acousticdiffuser-qd13/ Yes, they are expensive, but once installed, don't have to be moved or augmented. If I get to build my larger listening room, I would move them there. The goal of the QD is to smooth the frequency distribution resulting in a room sounding twice as large as it actually is. That's what I've been told. Also, no more drywall on interior facing walls, only natural finished wood (plywood). I anticipate that I will be able to duplicate my 40% current larger room with my smaller new room and add smoother mids and highs.
The room acoustics is half the sound. So many forums are concerned with small differences in sound for high priced equipment and tweaks. I'm starting with the acoustics first. I already have the equipment.
@fleschler nice, i was thinking about those wooden things, especially if they could be made locally (DIY), but in terms of design some of them are a bit ugly for a living room, but great for the recording studio.
Why i have mentioned the Vicoustic is because of the $50 option of the Room Analysis they are offering for everyone, based on 3d model of the actual room. So i got it from them.
But i want to double-check it using a trick with a mirror (see the next link)
For most of us (not specialists in room treatment) it’s important to understand the basics first. Long time ago i’ve noticed that the bass responce is way different in the middle and near the rear wall in my 33 square meters room. This video about standing waves is so funny. So the standing waves ... damn.
Something that i need in my room to treat it good:
@chakster You have a reason to use specific color and materials for your listening room, like my living room requirements (only SR HFTs permitted for good reason as it's a formal room with my small audio system.
My new room is being built into a double garage; unfortunately, as the City of Los Angeles passed an anti-mansionization ordinance last year cutting in half the buildable lot area to 20% for RA zoned lots (most big lots in the City) over 20,000'. They permitted large homes at 45% of the lot area for R1 zoned lots above 7,500' and 50% for smaller lots, which allows large homes on small lots still. Super stupid planning as it halted development of new large homes on large lots.
So, I can design the room freely as to color scheme and materials. I'm going with carbon filters in the walls/ceiling for bass treatment. Dennis Foley of Acoustic Fields did an analysis and will supply me with building plans, installation instructions, etc. for $2,500 (50% rebated towards the purchase of materials). Vicoustic's $50 analysis appears to be similar but they give basic information and not as much support.
The Aperatures are diffusion, resonator & absorption in one relatively small panel. If I was privy to the internals, of coarse I could make my own. As far as I know, no other manufacturer has this type of 3 in 1 product. I did not pay any where near $800 for mine. Yet, still they aren’t cheap.They are however, very effective!
The Aperatures are diffusion, resonator & absorption in one relatively small panel.
Hey @slaw i am not an expert, but when a single panel is a combination of absorber/diffusor exactly like this Wavewood it depend on the effective fequency range. This particular panel is also act both as an absorber and dffuser and effective in treating medium and high frequencies (also can be used as bass traps in the corners).
In the beginning i was thinking that i can only use this universal panel for my needs, but after i got the actual 3D model of my room from from acoustic specialists i realize that separate panels such as primary bass traps or multifuser are much more effective when we can to cover a wider frequency range to make a room much closer to the ideal acoustic room. Unfortunately one multifunction panels is always a compromise. Also bass traps can not be small.
They made a similar looking panel Wavewood Premium which act primary as diffuser comapred to the different Wavewood absorber/deffusor/basstrap. There is a graph for each to see the frequency range they are covering, they are different.
I think it’s impossible to make one panel to act like 3 different panels effectively.
Wow, been away for a minute and missed some great discussions about something that really interests me.
@chakster I like the Vicoustic products and when I initially purchased them, they were at the forefront of combined bass and diffuser products. Now, RPG, and GiK are in the fold. As far as I know, there is no US dealer for Vicoustic anymore. We would have to pay exuberant shipping charges for their products from Europe.
That being said, GIKs newest bass corner with diffusion seems like a great alternative for folks in the US. Thinking about experimenting with two for the front walls. The Vicoustic corner bass trap with diffusion looks like very good quality, and with sound R&D to accomplish its goals. That is why purchased my Vicoustic products when I lived in Europe, but left them behind in the media room for my tenants :(
How do you post picks here? I have a mix of Vicoustic wall diffuser and GIK absorbers right now.
As far as I know, there is no US dealer for Vicoustic anymore.
Hi, I think they are everywhere including the USA as i can see on the map, anyone can check here. There is a video from US representative.
Yes, GIK & RPG is an alternative for those who are not in Europe or near like me.
Not suere where you’ve been using them, but the Vi line of products for Hi-Fi has been updated, some nice stuff. The Vari Bass looks interesting and an alternative to the classic corner Bass Traps. I’m still not sure which one i will buy (Bass Extreme or Vari Bass).
Finally i’ve done 50% of the acoustic treatment of my room according to 3D project and room analysis i got from Vicoustic (Portugal).
Recently i have discovered a better looking panels, for some reason they are not availabe from my German supplier, but can be special ordered.
The most attractive is this Vixagon and i’m gonna use a few boxes of them on side walls (probably in white and grey color combination). Instead of traditional square panels this Vixagon is so much better in terms of interior design. Technically it’s the same as the Flat Panel M1 FS, but much more attactive design. Both are absorbers for mids and highs.
As for diffusers there is another very interesting solution, can be located on the walls and ceiling. I’m gonna use a small block on the rear wall. Look at this Flexiwave. This is acually a diffuser and absorber.
All of those options are beautiful. The sticking point is, once you buy them, there's no going back. I'm referring to the mounting (option) = glue. I suppose one could buy dozens of Velcro or Command strips?
All of those options are beautiful. The sticking point is, once you buy them, there's no going back.
The reason i ordered full acoustic analysis of my room and received realistic 3D computer model of my room. Liquid nails is what i'm using, pretty easy. Panels can be removed (it will require restoration of the surface of the walls or ceiling, not the big deal, but dirty job). But i want to nail them only when i'm sure it will be nice, that's why i;m going step by step.
@slaw, I too have the PI Group diffusers in my sights. PI offers two models, a 2-D and a 3-D, priced $20 apart for a box of four (two pair of mirror-imaged diffusers). And they are CHEAP! However, they are not 13-root designs, but something of their own. GIK offers true 13-root diffusers, made of the same EPS material as those of PI. A box of four is about the same price as the PI’s, but half their size (2’ x 2’ vs. 2’ x 4’). PI will paint them any color you want, GIK sells them in white only (but you can do it yourself with any water-based paint).
I'm watching Acoustic Fields channel on youtube and their products are very impressive, top quality, but very expensive. However, i think this Japanese style Absorbing Panels for glass doors or windows is great idea!
I ended up with Vixagon Premium FS panels for my side walls, this is the most attractive design of absorbers i have ever seen. So i slighlty changed the project, because i do care about interior design in my listening room. I made a special order a few weeks ago and i will have to wait for about 7 weeks to get them. There are two size (and many colors) available, but mine are white and grey MINI. They are so easy to compile together in so many combinations. This is an old line of Vixagon, new looks different, i like the old ones.
You must have a verified phone number and physical address in order to post in the Audiogon Forums. Please return to Audiogon.com and complete this step. If you have any questions please contact Support.
