Anyone famaliar with the manufacturer,and in particular this pre amp.The credentials and testimonials seem impressive.The advertised 10 day audition is appealing.
LA45, Are you waiting for the preamp to arrive or the break-in to arrive? The preamp as received from Joseph takes about 48 hours to smooth out. It will gradually improve over the next few days. I recommend that before you start looking into tweaks for the preamp, just listen to and ejoy it for a while as is. The better you understand how it sounds in your system, the more you'll appreciate the minor tweaks available for it. I would also recommend that you tweak your room acoustics, and make sure that you have the best interconnects and power cords which will make bigger improvements for your system vs. tweaking Joseph's preamp. The tweaks which you can do to the preamp such as tube rolling and iec subs,IMHO, will be subtle compared to other things in your sound room. Have fun, though with your tweaking, but don't go crazy with it and miss out on just enjoying the music from your system.
Any news regarding the Preamp break in time? I am still waiting for it to arrive. I am reaching out to a few leads for the Siemens and also considering using Oyaide AC connector hoping to max out the preamp.
Also thought I should mention Joseph's Harmony Premium cord is outstanding!
Rx8man, I like your idea very much and was most interested in your post. I left the top off my preamp after tube rolling and feel it does sound a little better. I can't explain it and perhaps I am crazy, but I do like the sound better.
Rx8man I very much apologize if I was part of your feeling your idea was rained on. I truly meant no offense, just asking new comer questions. Your custom top sounds very elegant and given it is bit of work to do it right was wondering what you noticed in terms of sound. Best wishes
Gammajo, I felt my idea was getting rained on, so I was going to drop outta here.
As far as this safety issue : There are many tube amps that run "wide open" no chassis top, bottom or sides to speak of, with big hot driver tubes staring at your face, my VAC monos are an example, what's safe ?
Sherod, that's a great place, I've talked to Jeff G. many times, he knows speakers and crosssover designs like nobodys business.
Another material I have four sheets of, is called No Rez from GR Research, the other speaker genius Danny R.
I'm gonna put my lid on and shut off, good luck guys >>>>
I would like to know what brand of damping strips or material you folks suggest and where to get it. I would like to apply this damping material to the cover plate.
As Gammajo notes, safety is one very good reason to leave a cover on the preamp (or any electronic device with 120V running into it). Joseph has told me about another benefit of keeping the cover on the unit: it helps the signal to noise by minimizing radiation distribution within the unit. If all other factors are held constant, the signal to noise will be better with the cover on the preamp. The Audio Horizons chassis is quite rigid. I like, especially, the welds at the chassis corners which greatly enhance the rigidity. I have not sensed any audible vibration from the cover of my preamp. However, if that is a concern to you then do use some adhesive backed damping strips. Doing so can only enhance the benefits of the preamp.
Audio Horizons Lovers. Tried asking this question at cable section but dont get much response. Maybe U can help. Have anybody try changing Exactpower Conditioner or APS Purepower stock PC to Transparency PC and observe any improvement in their system? I m from Malaysia, so borrowing it for a 30days trial I dont think is applicable to me. Yr input is much appreciated. Happy listening
We should probably note that there may be safety concerns in having the top removed, for the unit and for the cat! I am not sure that it would lessen vibration effects. But there is plenty of room to try vibration dampening material pasted to the underside of the top metal piece. RxMan I admire your experimental curiosity. I am tempted to cut a piece of plexiglass and compare it to a piece of real glass - both should be easily made to seat with the nice rim around the top. But how about heat disipation from the tubes?
La45 Congradulations - let us know initial impressions and the how you like it after breakin. Bill thanks forthe Amperex Bugle Boy report. I am also interested in trying the The Amperex PQ white label tubes versus the cca's
Ok another 3 hours of listening tonight with the Amperex's. I like them better in my system then the Siemens. No doubt. Goodness the music was so special tonight. My Proceed PMDT died and my sense is it would sound better with the Siemens as it had a full, deep sound.
My new transport is a tad more transparent and forward and it seems to like the Amperex's. I know it is based on ones total system matching a likes. I am in sonic heavewn today with these Amperex's however. They are staying in!
I have been listening to the AH pre with Amperex Bugle Boy tubes instead of the tubes sent with the unit - Siemens Gold Pin. After a couple of hours I like the Amperex's very much indeed. The highs are a tad sweeter and the mids a little more full. The bass is not as deep and powerful.
Stage size and fullness of sound seems much improved with the Amperex's. May have lost the last bit of clean/transparency however.
I will need to listen more. The Amperex Bugle Boy tubes can be had on Ebay for about 1/3 the cost of the Siemens and to my ears sound very musical.
I will listen more.
I also placed an order for the Herbie Audio Halo tube dampers and Myrtle wood blocks.
I would be curious to hear Victor's or Joseph's view on popping the top as well. Obviously, removing the top would be to eliminate vibrations, so why wasn't this issue looked at by Joseph in his initial design? Wouldn't taping some anti-vibration( dampening) material on key locations of the inside of the top be accomplishing the same result as removing the top? I haven't yet taken the time to try mine with the top off.
When you pop the top for tube rolling, or for plain visual curiosity, listen with the metal lid off for a while (hours) and tell me if there's a difference to your ears ?
I'll tell you my impressions after I hear yours, just to confirm if I'm not crazy !
Great advice. Joseph just informed me that the preamp is on the way and I thought to post query on this board. Your advice remind me of how one would taste a fine red wine for the first time, slowly sip and gently swallow while savoring the experience.
I just thought that while I was on a roll tonight, I'd put in an addendum that as good as Joseph's preamp is, his vintage tuner upgrades are equally impressive. If by sheer luck that any Audiogon members happen to live in an area where they have a good NPR( National Public radio) station which is minimally compressed, have a decent antenna, and if you like some really great live jazz and classical broadcasts, and you just happen to have an old decent tuner either sitting idly in your system or gathering dust in your closet, send it to Joseph for his $350.00 refurbishing and be prepared to have an enlightening experience and a new regular source to listen to. Until I find another Chinchilla for my cd player, I've been staying up many late night hours enjoying my Joseph-tweaked 1977 Citation Eighteen tuner.
By the way, the best analog interconnects that I've ever found and unfortunately they aren't well known, are the silly sounding Chinchilla interconnects from Von Gaylord Audio. They are expensive and a used pair are rare( I'm looking for one more pair for my Cd player if anyone has some for sale)The best power cord so far that I've found to mate with my preamp is the Electraglide Epiphany X. Here is a review of the Chinchilla interconnects:
I agree with Gammajo. The stock tubes in the preamp are very good and provide wonderful musicality. The upgraded tubes do make an improvement, but depending on the resolution of the rest of your system, the difference isn't huge. For me, the early 60's Siemens grey plate CCa tubes just fine-tuned the overall sound to give me the ultimate tone and timber of instruments. The preamp is so transparent that cable and power cord additions can clearly be heard. I recommend that you start out with the stock tubes, or Joseph's upgraded Siemens, then live with and enjoy the sound for a while. Experiment with tweaking the cables, power cords, and room acoustics until you've extracted the best sound possible. Then find a hopefully good deal on the early Siemens CCa( preferably in tube locations 1 and 3) and you'll hear the magic of Joseph's preamp more clearly. Enjoy the journey and happy listening.
LA45 I found the Siemans they sent with the preamp to be wonderful, and in fact the stock EH tubes are quite good too. The unit is just so awesome that I wanted to try the NOS tubes suggested just to see if even more performance is possible. I will be trying my NOS and will report the comparision in about a week. Sherod and others may already be able to answer your question in more detail but the preamp definitely sounds great without the NOS treasure hunt. If I played it even with the stock EH it was a dramatic improvement over any other preamp I had heard.
Thanks for the info. Does anyone find the Siemens upgrade offered by AH good enough? Preamp sounds like its great without having to spend extra for esoteric tubes, right?
I am going to try some Amperex Bugle Boy's this weekend and compare them to the cca's. They can be had on Ebay, used and strong, for $68 a quad. That is what I paid.
I used these in my CJ Premier 16 and they were great. I will now play with them in my AH preamp.
I watched several pair go on Amazon and at dealers for way more than I wanted to pay, so I searched audiogon threads for members that seemed to like the cca's, and who were knowledgeable and helpful in threads. I then wrote them asking if they might have a pair at a reasonable price. I recieved some very kind responses with the fellow I got them from selling me his last pair,as he is using Amperex more right now. I got my gray plate 88cc's from him as well at excellent price by being willing to go used rather than NOS.
Thanks for the positive feedback, Bill and Mark. my plesasure to help spread the word. Yes, if Joseph builds it, we will come! Just ordered cca's for postions #1&3 and early 60's gray plate Siemens for #2&4. Plus Herbie tube dampers. Will be interesting to see what that does. Also I have been getting great results with a strange tweak. Instead of the myrlewood blocks under the preamp, I am using a tweak that cost me about 20 cents. From Lowes, I obtained a six foot length of polystyrine pipe insulation (a spongy black tube). I cut 1 1/2 inch rings off of this and placed four of them under the preamp. I also have them under my DAC and Transport. My oak shelves are not isolated well from the floor. This wells well for me in this situation.
Gammajo, wonderful review. Your words are well chosen and I am enjoying the very same experience with this preamp. Nice job.
I could not agree more with your comment that I love this preamp not because it is different, but because it does not sound like a stereo. It does sound more like a live performance.
Best preamp I have ever auditioned or owned in my systems over the years.
No reason not to try one as AH offers a trial period that is no risk. If a preamp exsists that sounds better at even triple the cost, I have not heard it.
Baranyi, I have owned the Cortese and Syrah preamps from Supratek and both are very good. I did not use the phono sections however. As a line stage the AH preamp is superior to my ears to both these units. It is more dynamic,much more quiet, more powerful bass, more neutral, equal in rendering of natural tone. The AH far exceeds the Supratek units in terms of clarity, intimacy and imaging. It sounds more live and engaging!
If you don't need phono, the AH unit is the easy choice. Joseph is also here in the USA with a 3 year warranty.
Well, I have over 300 hours on the Audio Horizons preamp, so it is time for a mini review. I hope it helps folks considering the preamp. I welcome comments and questions. My musical taste favors classical, pop, and rock. I play piano, sing and listen to live music often. The most important aspect of sound in descending order for me would be: natural and non-fatiguing, excellent portrayal of timber, detail, ability to convey instrument and hall decay, accuracy, fast dynamics, bass fullness and slam, and stage width. Less important for me is stage depth and height. The worst thing a system could do is to be strident, harsh, cold, thin, or muddy.
My version of the preamp has the capacitor upgrade and the gold Siemens tubes with only the output transformers upgraded, so I guess you would call it a TP 2.0n1/2B. The unit is attractive to me and wife with nice wood knobs, blue LED, black faceplate,and a solid look and feel. Inside is very clean and carefully laid out. My electrical engineer brother was impressed with the layout. For purposes of this review I mainly used Franz Liszt Transcendental Etudes, Kissen on RCA CD because this piano work is challenging in dynamics, frequency range, transient attack and decay, and compression due to complexity of signal. I also have a grand piano in the same room as a reference, though I can not play to Kissens level! My equipment is perhaps not as resolving as some of the folks owning this amp but this review may be useful for those who have a decent if not ultimate system.
The main thing I notice with this preamp in the system is increased changability much like live music, rather than a here we are listening to the stereo again feeling. For example the contrast between low and high volume that is so dramatic that the volume changes surprise me on well-known pieces. The preamp easily conveys music by turns thrilling, poignant, tender, energetic whatever is called for with a greater difference in these different tones than I ever heard on a system, and moves instantly and effortlessly between them. Also there is more noticeable difference between different pianos, violins, and artist styles etc, not only in timber but also in overall gestalt, so that all instruments and artists have their own personality.
Added to the delight of contrast are many other wonderful attributes. The unit possesses tight, controlled, dynamic, and accurate bass, a wonderfully open, natural and slightly warm midrange, and extended, airy, easy highs. There appears to be zero compression even at high volume with complex music. The main feeling to the sound is sparkling, full-bodied, nimble, beautiful, and non-fatiguing. There is a sweetness and naturalness that is heart opening, much like live music. Sound emerges from a very black background, ultraclear and resolving, but with no trace of stridency, harshness, or grunge. It maintains a good bit of the excitement and delight even at low volumes. Soundstage width, depth and localization are all excellent. As mentioned in other posts, now almost all of my CD collection is listenable at higher volumes without fatigue. Vocals, rock, and New Age are all conveyed well. Male vocals are particularly right. Dense choral works and brass ensembles both are much more interesting and enjoyable to listen to. Hall ambience is conveyed very naturally. I can easily see why some have traded in well-respected and much more expensive preamps in for this baby. They were not just after something new. I would very willing to say that in my system this pramp lacks "X" but I truly at this time can not find anything. It has helped me take a giant step toward fulfilment. Next to speakers it is probably the biggest improvement I have experienced in my system.
Finally I have truly pestered Joseph the designer and Victor his representative obsessively before and after the sale. I would guess there had been nearly 100 emails and repeated phone calls. Victor has taken much time teaching me about tube selection and buying. They have always remained responsive, clear and helpful. I rapidly felt that they were friends who were truly interested in my satisfaction and shared my perfectionistic passion for music, not equipment.
Associated equipment: Aragon 8008BB 200Watt per channel dual mono SS amp, NorthStar 192 DAC and CD Transport, Guerrilla Silver IC and woofer cable, copper to the mid/tweeter biwired, Audio Horizons XRL preamp to amp.
An excellent source for NOS tubes is Brent Jesse, brentjes@audiotubes.com.Incredibly helpful and very fast turn around time.And hey,welcome to the most exclusive pre amp club in town.
Rgd, Victor can recommend some good dealers for you. Joseph and Victor both prefer the sound of Siemens CCa in this preamp, however, one owner that gave a testimonial in Joseph's web site liked some NOS Amperex. The preamp comes stock with EH( Electro Harmonix) tubes, which sound very good in Joseph's excellent circuit. Joseph's upgrade is, I believe, a 70's Siemens E88cc, which will give you a little better sonic picture. The ultimate tube for this preamp is an early 60's Siemens CCa, but they are getting rarer and very expensive. One nice thing to consider is that there are only four tubes in the preamp, and basically only two of them which are fairly critical in the audio signal path( tube locations 1 and 3 ). I was able to find a good pair of Siemens Cca for these locations and am using some late 60's,early 70's Siemens E88cc in locations 2 and 4. My recommendation is that when you get your new preamp, allow it to warm up for a few days to break in the preamp and get an idea of how it sounds in your system. You might just like it so much with the stock tubes that upgrading might become an alternative that you can wait on for a while. I lived with my stock preamp very happily for a few months before I got the urge to try some upgraded tubes in location 1 and 3. I hope you enjoy the preamp as well as I do. Happy Listening.
in the event one would like to upgrade the stock tubes without purchasing them from the manufacturer (as in I already have a new unit delivered on Friday) what tubes and from where should I be looking?
My impression (no science here) is that the myrtle wood is particularly good at draining vibration off and away from the audio gear. My audio shelves are suspended from the wall. I can jump next to them and not disturb a turntable playing. For this reason, I perceive the value of the myrtle wood blocks as "vibration drained away" rather than as "vibration prevented from reaching." It might work both ways - I can't tell. Perhaps I should add that my shelves are wood, too - plywood with many coats of paint applied.
Cedar, using the myrtle wood directly under the unit, do you then also have something to kill vibrations into the shelf from the ground, protecting the unit from outside vibration?
Gammajo, I use mytle wood blocks under the Audio Horizons DAC and preamp. It is decidedly better than a softer isolation material. The myrtle wood benefit is a lower noise floor.
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