Analogue Productions SACDs

@goofyfoot 

All these complications with SACD players

The complexities are largely hidden from the user and are there for backwards compatibility.  Firstly, compatibility with CDs, then for those who only want 2-channel playback!

It is a bit like the multiple generations of USB and Ethernet, driven by the desire for more bandwidth.

Of course, the Direct Stream Digital (DSD) format employed by SACD is far simpler than the Pulse Code Modulation (PCM) used in CDs and Pure Audio Blu-Rays.

DSD is a stream of bits which just nudge the sound level up one or down one.  All you need for playback is a low-pass filter in the mega-Hertz range.

Mathematically, PCM can be derived exactly from DSD, but not the other way round.  The pioneering immersive sound label 2L.no archives its recordings in very high frequency DSD so they can be converted into multiple derived formats.

I acknowledge that DSD is difficult for editing and even more difficult for mixing which explains why very little pop / rock appears on SACDs compared with classical music.

2L.no uses floating point, not integer, master files for mixing.

@richardbrand My DAC has DSD capability up to 258 cycles but streamer maxes out at 126. Anyway, downloading DSD is easy and I have downloaded about eight titles. I can see the argument for buying an SACD player since there are more options on disc form but they’re expensive and hopefully, aside from streaming, DSD downloads are the future. Acoustic Sounds used to offer DSD downloads but they flaked out. It seems that they believe more consumers will choose to buy their hybrid discs rather than opt for downloads. Native DSD probably has the best selection of DSD downloads but even there, they’re few in number.

Issue solder SACD players is probably a LICENSING THING and less frequently a LASER thing. 

You repeat without any qualification that the Redbook layer is

very likely to sound better on a decent CD player or transport and DAC than the SACD layer will on a universal player that supports SACD

In my experience that is completely untrue.  My evidence is that I could tell that my Reavon universal player had obvious problems with its TI Burr Brown DACs - it was down converting DSD to CD quality and it was so obvious I wrote to Reavon seeking clarification.  My previous Marantz universal player sounded wonderful on SACD.

The fact that you haven't experienced this with your awesome player designed for "The best possible picture and sound technologies for an incredible home cinema experience" doesn't make it untrue. 

I have experienced it, and what I'm sharing is actual listening experience, not hypothetical ramblings.  

I have heard incredible sounding Redbook CD playback in my system and at least two others (one with Jay's Audio transport/DAC and one with a nice Ayre CD player).  That's not to say that the same disc as an SACD wouldn't sound any better, only that many people are not aware of the potential of CDs to provide excellent sound quality. 

I am primarily a vinyl guy myself, but it's been great to be able to pick up CDs for 3 or 4 bucks and have them sound fantastic.  I also have a relatively small collection of SACDs and some of them are amazing.  

@goofyfoot 

 I can see the argument for buying an SACD player since there are more options on disc form but they’re expensive

Your DAC already has DSD capability, so all you really need is something that acts as an SACD transport, that is to say, no analogue output is needed.  Sony make a universal disk player, the UBP-X700U, which you can probably buy new for under US$200.  That’s right, only two zeros.

It only outputs over HDMI - one is dedicated for audio.  So if your DAC accepts HDMI natively (not I2S using an HDMI cable) that’s all you really need.

This transport is not built like a tank, but it supports Blu-Ray up to 4K, SACD, DVD and CD.  Apart from SACD, it supports other high resolution audio formats including Pure Audio Blu-Ray and Dolby Atmos.

If you are into classical music or jazz, Presto Music | All things musical… on your doorstep has over 6,000 new SACD titles listed.  They also have a streaming service which offers downloads at no extra charge.

By the way, DSD on SACD takes samples 64 times more often that CDs, so it is often written DSD64.  You DAC does even better at DSD256 while your transport is probably DSD128 capable.  But for SACD you only need DSD64.