I am not sure that Dac with Ethernet port is a good idea if the barrier from the crud that packetized data like Ethernet (and USB) brings gets thru.
The idea behind the SSR I mentioned above is to stop that cold and get to spdif (OK) or better yet i2S. The Transport has been the neglected stepchild for far too long.
Please read the post by Barrows I linked above very carefully to understand the KEY point I am making. |
Winson, I learned from your post, A very good point I must say. |
The problem with USB is two-fold:
1) common-mode noise on the cable that is not completely rejected by the USB receiver
2) poor software on the server device
#1 can be mitigated with filters or galvanic isolation. I have done both.
#2 can be mitigated by using a Linux-based server properly configured with good playback software and CODECs
Short of doing both of these, you will have some sonic issues with USB
If you do both, it will be identical in performance to Ethernet renderer, assuming both are implemented similarly. Implementation is everything.
Steve N.
Empirical Audio |
Audioengr, question for you, Are you going to build a streamer?, one with balanced out's and a volume control is what I need!, to be used straight to amplification, an analog quality volume control would be sufficent, let's talk about this, an all in one box solution like this would win! |
I have been auditioning speakers in the city and had the opportunity to hear some ultra $$$ DAC's as well. I will be hearing a few more in the next few weeks also.
It's SO hard to isolate the performance of an individual component when listening to completely different systems in completely different rooms. But in the end I can give a nod to all of the upstream components if the system engages me and does what it is supposed to.
All were the top level product of their brand: Meridian, Emm Labs, DCS, MSB. I could see any of them in my system but Meridian and DCS both require multi component systems to get the most out of them, while MSB and Meitner are standalone DACs. I will be hearing the CH Design DAC/streamer next Monday along with equally esoteric and expensive speakers.
What I am coming away with is that for most of us, spending $25-75k on digital is not just unrealistic, but unwise. If you spend that money on speakers, amps, preamps or an analog table/rig can last forever and will never truly be outdated. While even the most sophisticated digital nay sound great forever, it will likely be replaced by something better and be outdated within 5 years.
And the Dac of the future will unquestionably directly link to and control an Ethernet NAS drive.
We are at a technological crossroads for DAC's. I think things will change dramatically in the next few years.
And did anyone else just hear that Jay Z's investment company just bought TIDAL streaming???? |
Oops. Type.
Spending $25-$75k is not realistic.
Lol |
Not so sure that Ethernet connection will last. Too many pitfalls connecting to a NAS(ty) for ultimate performance.
Drive capacity goes up as prices fall.
Who wouldnt like their entire library in the top pocket for absolute total mobility?
My 2cents |
What I mean is that the DAC is going to BE the front end. USB memory stick or Ethernet NAS or whatever. Digital front end is transitioning.
The DAC will likely also access Internet streaming sources like Tidal and other on line streaming sources. I think the closer the source gets to the dac, the better. And once a usb solid state drive can hold an entire collection (red book or even hi-rez) things will really get interesting. And we are practically there. |
Ok, two questions then. First what drive unit would you purchase for a 2009 mac mini. Then where would you store it? Do you set up a NAS with firewire or just a double bay hard drive in RAID 1?
Also please share models that you use and love. I can't wait to Steve's DAC up and running in my system, I could use the built in super drive but have been told that a remote usb drive is best as you can buy a much better quality one. Plexor was the name Steve game me, but when I went to their site, they seem to only be for window's systems.
Matt we had this talk last week about servers/DACS and where they are headed. I totally agree with you. |
Regarding storage and playback, I encourage you to read about Paul Pang blog and Jplay.eu forums as well as Computeraudiophile subsection on storage (in this order). Personally I use a NAS system: Synology. I currently recommend Enterprise drives. The top drive keeps changing. I have Hitachi. I also purchased mine through Simplynas.com. This was by far cheaper than individual units through Newegg or Tom's, etc.
I also never thought I would have beyond 10 TBs of music either. The catalog grows quick.
The current trend I read is transferring a sub-section of music to a playback SSD drive that your server draws from. I personally do not do this.
Read these sources and your will be well versed on the topic.
Cheers. |
02-02-15: Ctsooner
I can't wait to Steve's DAC up and running in my system, I could use the built in super drive but have been told that a remote usb drive is best as you can buy a much better quality one. Plexor was the name Steve game me, but when I went to their site, they seem to only be for window's systems. CTsooner, in my experience with external optical drives (which as a disclaimer I'll mention is limited to Windows and Linux operating systems, and to non-audio applications), you would get much better reliability and consistency of performance across diverse media, as well as greater speed if you choose to use it, if instead of purchasing an external USB optical drive as such you were to purchase a standard size internal drive intended for desktop computers, and mount it in a **good quality** powered external enclosure which provides a SATA interface internally and a USB interface externally. I note that the one optical drive Plextor currently offers is that kind of internal drive. Having essentially no Mac experience I can't say this for sure, but my suspicion is that even though it is described as being for Windows operating systems it would work fine with a 2009 Mac Mini when interfaced via USB through an external enclosure. You can find suitable external enclosures at Newegg.com, which is my "go to" place for computer parts and accessories. Here is one such enclosure that looks promising, although I have no experience with this or other currently listed models. If you click on the "see questions and answers" link to the right of and slightly below the photos, you'll find a couple of people mentioning that they are using it successfully with Mac Minis. Newegg also sells the Plextor drive, btw, for $30 in OEM form or $37 in full retail form. I presume the OEM version comes without box, manual, and mounting screws, although mounting screws are supplied with external enclosures in some cases, apparently including the one I linked to. Regards, -- Al |
Audiolab - No plans to build a streamer. I have other projects on my plate right now.
Steve N.
Empirical Audio |
Matt,
I am going to have a full day listning session with the Dartzeel Ethernet dac/Integrated amp (the one soon to be released) in 2 weeks, i will let you know.
USB stick is a no-no for ultimate performance and NAS(ties) have too many issues in terms of signal degrading connections. Packetized data gives problems.
Ultimate performance (IMHO- informed by some insiders I know and respect) will come from optimized SSDs and SDXCs, BUT not sure they should be in the dac box. Given that, all this may end up in the speaker, like Linn Xact, Devialet Phantom or Goldmund Metis lines.
What does Linn Marketing say? The speaker IS the source. LoL
Just MHO and food for thought. |
Thankyou audioengr, that would be awsome if you did make a statement streamer with a quality volume control to be used straight to amplification, you would be the first!, there would be a huge market doing so, I would buy quikly from you if you done this. |
I just received my PerfectWave back from PS Audio. Had it upgraded to DirectStream. It is far and away the best $3,000 I've ever spent on any audio equipment. You said you wanted "Looking for musical, emotional, engaging, accurate , with great dimension. Not looking for analytical and sterile."; IMHO this is it. I have Kharma CRM 3.2 speakers, speakers often deemed "analytical", and before this upgrade I was considering swapping them out for something more "musical". Now I can't get up from my couch. This is one of those rare pieces of equipment that makes you want to listen to your entire library anew. It's simply beautiful.
Lastly, reviews of this unit talk about detail retrieval. This is quite true but not in an aggressive fashion. Your reaction isn't, "Wow! That's a lot of detail." but "Hmmm. I hadn't noticed that."
Post lastly, I've never auditioned or heard another top-end DAC so I may not know what I don't know, so.... Good luck. |
Wisnon, what is the concern for SSDs or other solid state mass storage module housed inside the DAC chassis? |
Guido,
In addition to the constant bit shuffling to facilitate speed optimization, there seems to be power related issue too that you can flesh out from this thread:
http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f10-music-servers/battery-powered-solid-state-drive-tweak-really-works-23292/
SD cards are already optmised for streaming. Just look at the high speed photography/video market. Audio is thus trivial for SD card tech.
Keith, again I remind you that a Streamer is still in the digital domain, so no chance of an analog vol control there. You would need an embedded Dac to first convert to analog. Only analog can go straight to norml power amps. |
audioengr, did you read winson's post to me?, I believe a streamer can be built with a high quality analog volume control with dac built in, the krell kps 25sc unit back years ago was an all in one pre-amp and transport and dac, pure class A on top of that, anything is possible? |
|
Lumin makes a Music Server/DAC/balanced analog out. All you need is an amp I think.
I'm figuring out a lot with music servers. Wow are they different. |
A Streamer Dac is not the same as a pure streamer! I have said this repeatedly. A pure Streamer is a digital device and can have only digital volume control.
I dont understand the confusion here, as I never said a Streamer Dac cant do analog VC. A Dac must be in the chain to get to analog and to thus have analog VC.
Lumin is a DAC, this Krell mentioned above is a Dac. No problem to have analog VC with a DAC, no matter what other upstream functions are in the box.
Devialet amps are Streamer/Amp/Dac and I am pretty sure they have analog VCs. Others like Goldmund have the speakers with built in amp and Dacs an you use a digital processor to stream to them. |
Also, to do a proper streamer Dac, analog preamp, one would need an army of programmers and support staff to maintain, support and inprove the control point software...those neat apps that everyone loves.
Lumin and Auralic have like 20+ such people on their staff. Yes, there are generic version of such software that can be used, but the support requirements would kill a one man operation... |
"A Streamer Dac is not the same as a pure streamer! I have said this repeatedly. A pure Streamer is a digital device and can have only digital volume control."
Wisnon - not sure why your getting so frustrated. No one is refuting your statements. Your information is welcome and, uh, informative. Lol. I was just telling Audiolabyrnth that the component he wants exists already. There are Music server/DAC's available with analog balanced outputs, such as Lumin.
A DAC/streamer (like what Steve will be offering) is different from a DAC/music server (which also includes software to select and control the music from wherever it's stored) like the Lumin. Everyone wants a slightly different product.
For me, I want a music server with built in SSD, linear power supply, audiophile grade through and through. There are actually a lot of these out and more every day. But what many of them lack is the ability to directly access an iTunes folder on my Mac (so I don't have to copy everything already in there to another drive or location), and truly native access within the music server to stream off of services like Tidal and Rhapsody (some have this Antipodes, Auralec, TotalDac I think). The native streaming service will unquestionably be integrated into ALL next gen music servers. The only music server I know that can currently access my iTunes folder is Antipodes (they signed the license with Apple 3 weeks ago to integrate that access). It's a $23- license you pay for with the devise.
So there are already produces from one extreme to the other available. But I think it will take one or two generations for we audiophiles to figure out what we really want and need to have a variety of choices that all do exactly what we want. I would prefer the top tier design philosophy and implementation of the Aurender W20 or the Baetis, but neither has native streaming of Tidal nor access to the iTunes folder directly. And both (Along with the TotalDac) are truly designed for AES or SPDIF output to get their best result. While the Antipodes and Computer Audio Designs are truly designed to work best with a usb DAC like the ODSE or pending ODSX.
Auralec Aries is a very neat little affordable tool that does a lot. It's a temporary solution for many of us. Even the top stores will sell an Aries with a full DCS stack and a Baetis or Aurender server to access streaming on line music. But I don't think it really sounds any better then a properly done Mac mini with external power supply or equally prepared PC server.
As I said, I'm learning and still deciding. As of right now, the unit that, I think, would do it all, is the Antipodes DX. But I don't know how much better it will really sound then my Mac Mini. I'm trying to arrange an audition.
JKMNOP- I have fully auditioned the DirectStream ( read way back in the thread) and I admit it is a great product. But to my ears the ODSE is in a completely different class! |
Wisnon, operating an external Samsung 850 Pro connected via some SATA cable through a DC battery might improve some audible parms... I contend that eliminating the cable all together will improve time coupling by a couple of nanoseconds if nothing else... And a DAC-wide battery power or even better an ultra-cap PS would benefit the entire DAC device.
As for the bit twiddling, it is performed because of general purpose machines doing mountains of read/writes that tend to fragment the storage map. in our case, such background storage management demon need not be activated at all. |
Hi Guido! How goes the Flugelhorn'ing?
The Aurender W20 is completely off the grid. Totally battery driven... Intriguing, isn't it. And I was just told that they introduced native TIDAL control within its proprietary ipad app at CES...
Just not sure I want to spend more then $10K on something so, uh, outdatable... |
Hi Matt, flugel (Kanstul 1525) and trumpet (Adams A4 Large Bore) are totally amazing... These days I am experimenting with mouthpieces: Curry, ACB, and soon Flip Oakes. MPs make an enormous difference on the total sound of a horn, without any of them necessarily being the "best"... Each creates a unique Nirvana.... And with prices ranging from $56 to about $350 a piece, you can experiment without too many adverse reactions from the "Bposs".
Btw, this is what my A4 sounds like, using a relatively shallow ACB TA-3CS Heavy mouthpiece:
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/53640097/ACB%20-%20Adams%20A4%20trumpet%20brushed%20silver%20plate%20--%20192K.wav
On battery supplies... Batteries are a draconian way to isolate a line level device from AC grundge... But is it the best way? For one thing, ultra-caps are superior at delivering broad/fast transients... Furthermore, a well designed AC supply should be able to isolate the device as much as a DC battery supply... Case in point is your/my Criterion... Sounded identical in my system, whether I fed it from batteries, or through its SMPS.
G. |
Matt, will you please text me your number again. I'm in FL as my dad is dying, but I wanted to touch base when I get the chance as you are I are on the same page and I wanted to speak with you about it, but I'll go off on a tangent on the board, lol. Thanks. |
CTSooner - so sorry to hear that. My sympathies and thoughts during your hard times. I lost my Dad while I was in Med school, he was only 49. Hardest thing I ever had to deal with. PM sent with phone #.
I've been researching music servers like crazy.
Guido - great to hear from you. I couldn't open the link on my iPad. I'll try it on my computer later. I agree with your feeling on battery, ultra caps, etc. Even a well implemented robust linear power supply can make a unit sing, as long as it gets a healthy supply of clean and relatively unrestricted electrons. I am fortunate that my new room has very clean AC to start with and with a 4 gauge run from main panel to dedicated sub-panel and isolated 10 gauge runs to each outlet, there is practically unrestricted power getting to each unit. Battery power done wrong can actually limit power supply, so as we all know, just putting batteries in doesn't make it better.
My room is hopefully going to be ready in about 2 weeks. I'm waiting on my 9m XLR interconnects to arrive and my side wall baffle diffusers which were on backorder a few weeks.
Then I can start to pursue some more DAC evals and maybe try borrowing a music server or two. |
I have been enjoying my new PS Audio DirectStream DAC now for two months, and it never ceases to put a smile on my face!
Almost every album I listen to now has content I was not enjoying before, it might be a quiet guitar on one channel, some backup singer, a small amount of percussion, etc. This unit really brings out the detail I find is lost with other DACs.
I'm very happy with this unit.
Like other comments on this forum, I was concerned about buying the unit "sight unseen", but if you purchase the unit from an authorized dealer, you have 30 days to return the unit to PS Audio.
If you are like me, you won't think of returning it! |
Guido - Sounds awesome! But we want to hear YOU play it!!!! grins…. |
Sorry to hear about the paternal losses.
I lost mine last year and have not been the same since. You really lose a part of you…
Best wishes to both of you, even you Matt after all these years…the pain never fully goes away.
CStooner, treasure the remaining moments. |
Thanks guys. Got to spend about 2hrs with just my dad and two siblings yesterday. I don't think he'll be there in a few hours when we go back. Family flying in from CT today and daughter in from Univ of New Hamp also. Purple heart from WW2 and just a stand up guy. Started in audio when we went to a local dealer at age 9. All Pioneer gear when it was decent. I just tuned up that TT for my brother and it still works, lol.
Matt, thanks, I'll call when I can. I want in on this server deal, but like we said, until more companies get involved the costs will stay very high. That's why I went the mac mini route properly done. I went to a few dealers and they too are kind of waiting on better servers at lower costs. I think we cold see the choices double or more over the next year. My concern is that many of these units will still be the all in one deals. That's going to be great for folks who's systems don't need dedicated servers. I wan to hear what Linn has done as I know they have a few and I'd also love to hear what Naim has done as I haven't heard Naim gear in over 20 years. |
Ctsooner, you will be in my thoughts. I lost my Dad over the Christmas holidays and he was career Army/National Guard. It is a tough time, even when they are older. I was impressed with the quality of friends and comrades that showed up to pay respects. For me, the military honors were special as they reminded me of the sacrifices made by those who serve to keep us safe, and how proud of them we should be.
On audio topics, I remain interested in servers and I am where you are with a dedicated tricked out Mojo Mac mini, with external linear PS, external AV drive, internal SSD, 5V USB power isolation (do not use power from the mini), and filtered USB. I am currently looking hard at Antipodes but I agree the better/best servers seem expensive for what they are (basically computers). The main benefits of the best servers, like Antipodes, over our minis seem to be running the Linux OS, a few optimizations of noise that are not feasible with the mini (no fan, etc.), and better isolated USB outputs. I have not jumped yet for the same reason as you, because pricing is likely to come down, and sound quality up, as manufacturers figure out what folks want and how to best deliver it. I would like to see a really good server made in the USA and the main options I am aware of are the Baetis and CAPS servers.
As you guys explore and hear options, it would be nice to have an active thread dedicated to servers. I started one in August titled, "State of the Source: Server, computer....or what? and while a few folks provided input it eventually fizzled out for lack of interest. |
Hi audioengr, Hi Steve, I was hopeing that you would give some thought's about what I have been asking about here in the last few post, please give your opinion's, thankyou. |
AL - It is certainly possible to build such a server/DAC, but good SQ is expensive. Lots of isolation and separate power supplies required.
I'm not in the computer assembly business. I think my new Ethernet interface goes a long way to make the server a non-issue.
Steve N.
Empirical Audio |
I've had the Antipodes DX for close to 3 months. I became interested in it last year when Steve (audioengr) won "best of show" using it with his DAC and commented on it positively. If there is no objection I'll post some of my thoughts about it on this thread over the next few days. |
Steve, what isolator? What does it do? Is that something that we should all be looking at IRT our mac mini servers? Thanks so much for the help and thoughts in this thread. |
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On the contrary Mrpaul... Please do tell us your detailed impressions of the Antipodes DX. G. |
Mr Paul- I am on the verge of pulling the trigger on said DX. I eagerly await your impressions!!! |
Hi Mrpaul, I just purchased the Antipodes DX and will be able to directly compare it to my Mojo Mac mini server. I am interested to hear your thoughts on the DX but respect your "if no objection" comment, since this is Matt's thread on DACs.
Matt, please let us know if you consider discussions about servers consistent with the topic(s) you intended for this thread, or if you would rather limit the discussions here solely to top tier DACs. |
Thanks guys. I welcome talk about servers, streamers and DAC's. They are all essentially part of the same larger discussion - how to get the best sound out of red book 16/44 files.
I think this thread has turned into an enormous resource for me and many others regarding DACs and all things digital. The more we discuss and the more Info we get from everyone involved, the better this thread gets!
410k views guys. People are interested and want to know what we are discussing. Thanks to everyone for making this as much fun as it is!! |
Regarding music servers, here is a list of the ones I am considering and have learned about, with quick little blurbs of what I see as the advantages and disadvantages (totally all IMO):
CAPS Server - probably a great product. I would imagine it comes out of a shop very similar to Steve's; audiophiles of passion. It is based on the Intel NUC, I'm thinking its a short lived product. And very DIY. Could be great for some, but not for me.
YFS - a windows based server designed for high end use. It's essentially a windows computer Moded to the gills for audiophile performance, in both form and function. Probably sounds awesome and has Flexibility. But in the end it will either need to morph into a true dedicated unit or disappear. It's high end DIY. But for, it's probably amongst the top tier of what's available.
Moded Mac Mini - Mac DIY. External power supply and other mods. It's great and is a terrific inexpensive entry. Again, once the dedicated server gear hits mainstream the mac minis will go bye bye. Dependent on USB audio out. It requires the right DAC to really shine (ODSE, Computer Audio Designs, etc)
Auralic - not truly a music server. More of an intermediate product but revolutionary in what it is. It's the first of a new generation of streamer that gives affordable audiophile sound and accesses all of the music on a NAS or computer, along with accessing Internet streaming services and providing spdif, usb output. They hit a home run with this product. It's a temporary solution, but the ONLY thing that currently does what it does.
BMC/Burmester/Meridian/Linn/Naim - the first gen product of the next big thing. Some are very expensive and all are high end. For me, they are going in the right direction. Gen 2 or 3 will be home runs. All are fighting for the proper control software, Inverness music streaming and output options. If you have the money and don't mind spending on something will be be woefully obsolete In a few years then you will get great sound and convenience. Once the big players have solid product we will see if the current Music Server top players will survive.
Computer Audio Design - not available in the US. You can get them, but import only. Usb only for Input. Probably in the same class as the ODSE. But as long as it doesn't have a solid US presence, I'm hesitant to look further.
The BIG players currently:
Lumin - standalone Music Server with top tier parts, excellent ipad control software and flexible expansion for NAS memory. It offers everything and comes in several levels. It's iTunes integration is not there yet (still doesn't access iTunes folder directly). And you are paying for a DAC that you may or may not need. I don't need the DAC. I'm looking into Lumin very seriously, but I dont know how their usb output is.
Baetis - a Microsoft based system but displaced from the DIY concept to a totally new unit specifically dedicated to audio. AES output is soldiered directly to the mother board. Great integration and control. No built in Internet streaming access ($14k and you still need to buy an Auralic to get Tidal music service), no access to iTunes folders. This unit is specifically designed for AES output and needs a DAC that can take advantage of that. If you have that (DCS, MSB, Berkeley Reference, etc), and are OK with no native Tidal/Rhalsody or access to iTunes folders then it's a no brained. Sounds amazing, I've heard it in a truly reference system.
TotalDac D1 server - probably amazing. No USB output, Spdif/AES outputs. Not really a huge presence In the U.S., like CAD. Reasonably priced and probably should be better known in the U.S. It would be at the top of my list if I wasn't dependant on USB input to get my best sound, and if it had a solid importer in the U.S. I might be wrong about that, but I don't think its currently available stateside except direct from manufacturer. I am still looking into it more though. Everyone who owns one or has heard Totaldac raves about the experience. I reached out to the company and they were very responsive. I may still try with a buy, like I did with many of the dacs I auditioned. But some of my other options are really good...
Aurender W20 - reference music server requiring a DAC . About $17k fully loaded. Sort of unique and strange architecture. Very hybrid. Spinning hard drive for mass storage but uses SSD for short term playback; obviously NAS compatible. Battery power/backup and linear power supply for all music components but a switching power supply for non-audio related parts - huh? Why not just linear throughout? Amazing ipad control and integrated/native Internet streaming like Tidal/Rhapsody recently introduced. Can not directly access iTunes folder. Also spdif/AES outouts. Has USB but I don't think it's considered it's best output. I think it would sound best with AES or spdif out to a top tier DAC. Again. I'm thinking DCS, MSB, Berkeley Reference. A true contender. Also with a well known serious group of programmers to back the company and provide support and updates. Well established US brand.
Antipodes - USB outout, dependant on a USB DAC. Good control using modified Squeezebox software. All SSD storage plus NAS compatible. This is the only unit available that is currently compatible with and can directly access your iTunes folder without needed to copy the whole damn thing to another folder. Integrated/native Internet music access like Tidal/Rhapsody. All linear power supply. Built in CD ripper (some others obviously have this to, I just forgot to mention it). Also with a solid group of programmers and well established in the US. Not obscenely expensive at $7500- fully loaded. Currently very very high on my list; honestly #1 right now.
I'm sure some of what I said is not 100% accurate, but I think oat of it is pretty solid info.
I welcome input, experience, manufacturers comments and user experience to help us all with this daunting list. |
Matt,
The Aries will also play from a connected USB HDD, so its can be a complete Server!!! The app is great and there are several tweaks that can can done.
I will let you know how the modders get on. I am expecting one to be a slam dunk! |
Thankyou matt for allowing us to talk about streamer's, Thankyou Wison for your continous contribution, and audioengr, Guidocorona, and many other's, It is my task to get a balanced analog out full volume control streamer to run direct to amplification if I have to waite a long time, my entire time in this hobby, I have alway's run a one box solution, may go through many to get tonal balance and transparency, and the ever so important sound stage presatation that is incredible, sometime's the most exspensive and so called state of the art is not what it's billed to be on my system, like now, I have a tube cd-player that beat out player's that costed many times the price, no, it might not be a complete one box solution for connecting other equipment, but is run's direct to amplification none the less, and the cool thing is I can roll tubes to get a more profound sound, like wison's referal of the 12ax7 mullard 10 M, and 12au7 10 m tubes, cbs ect... |
Thanks Wisnon for clarifying. Yes, the Aeris is a server in that it has its own native control software to access, manage and organize the music files. To me, that is the defining characteristic of a server (no matter if the files are stored internally or remotely on the net).
The units I listed all have native control software. They are all servers.
Steve's net access solution is exceptional, but does not incorporate any control software. It's a high quality audiophile solution alternative to USB, spdif or aes as I understand it. Steve, please correct me if I'm wrong.
As I said, the Aeris is revolutionary. First affordable unit of its kind.
Keep us updated Wisnon. |
Audiolabyrinth - don't both LUMIN (to your exact needs) and Divialet (complete, including an amp) both give you exactly that?
Do they make an ampless Divialet? |
Matt,
A-L wants the Lumin with ANALOG volume control.
I agree that Devialet with AIR streaming built in is the most "one box" solution out there as it even has power amps at the end. Streamer/Dac/Integrated amp all in one box. Very attractive bling box too.
Matt, what no Laufer teknik MEMORY Player?
http://www.thememoryplayer.net/ |
Hi Matt, It took me two year's and $4,000.00 to modd a Krell 700cx, I know it's old, but my amp is new inside and out, and modded, so no, I do not need that kind of one box solution that includes and amplifier. |
I am tired of cd's in general, all the skipping etc.., etc..., unlike most here, I am tring to build to the best standard I can afford, and then ride off into the sunset, I have a way's to go, I have to get better speaker's, the streamer I want, and a few this and that. |
