I am enjoying this thread and look forward to hearing about more comparisons leading up to your final DAC choice Matt.
I feel fortunate to have started with the Metrum Hex which, at about $3.5K fully loaded, I believe may represent a sweet spot between outclassed lower priced DACs and the higher priced state of the industry DACs being discussed in this thread. I did try the Lampi L4G4 with Duelunds but, in direct comparison, I liked the sound of the Hex better.
I will be interested in hearing about your Rowland vs. Overdrive comparison since my next DAC upgrade will likely be another solid state unit. I will also be interested in hearing whether you believe the Offramp improves the sound of the DACs in your shootout. |
Matt, thank you for the time you are putting into sharing the results of your DAC testing with us.
I read your 6/7 round 1 results with interest because your conclusions were strikingly similar to the reasons I chose the Metrum Hex over the L4G4. I am not suggesting a SS vs. tube comparison, or even implying virtues of NOS, but I do suspect the Lampizator DACs have a "house sound" that many here find to be near-perfect, but not everyone. Lukaz should be applauded for creating a line up that appeals to many, and gets better as you move up the product line. However, at those levels, the choice is not so much right or wrong, but personal preference that can be influenced by sonic attributes as well as other factors.
You have some other great choices coming up so I look forward to hearing your continuing impressions. |
What I would rather do is a preamp with a combination of active gain and transformer coupling, so I get low output impedance, galvanic isolation and true balanced output. Sounds a lot like my preamp, except it is buffered not active, but can have +6dB from the Lundahl transformers. |
I find the mac mini issue interesting, particularly since Matt's source is a Core Audio Modified Mac Mini with a linear power supply and I assume other modifications/optimizations. Since switching to a Mojo optimized mini with a linear PS, outboard HDD and internal SSD the sound of my system does not seem to lack for tonal density or dynamics. I have not heard the Antipodes units that Steve is talking about but if it were a year ago I might have gone that route for the $4K their mid-level unit costs. One benefit of the mini is that you have a lot of choices about which software to use and how you implement memory play, upsampling, eq, etc. |
So Steve, is it your suggestion that one should always use the inside USB port on the mini, e.g., furthest from the edge? |
If the $1800 BMC PureDAC sounds so good, how much better is their top model, the $4,900 BMC DAC1? Anyone heard it? |
This seems to be a good place to throw out a question about a possible "top tier" DAC;
Have any of you heard the Aqua La Scala Mk II?
Darko and Srajan at 6moons both called it the best they have heard in their systems, "without the shadow of a doubt," and The Ear gave it 5 stars.
At around $6K it doesn't even begin to enter the ultra priced market but rather competes price-wise in the same arena as the OD SE, Lampi Big 6, and Metrum Pavane to name a few.
Issues include no DSD, two tubes, and no distributor or dealer that I could find in the USA. |
Hi Mrpaul, I just purchased the Antipodes DX and will be able to directly compare it to my Mojo Mac mini server. I am interested to hear your thoughts on the DX but respect your "if no objection" comment, since this is Matt's thread on DACs.
Matt, please let us know if you consider discussions about servers consistent with the topic(s) you intended for this thread, or if you would rather limit the discussions here solely to top tier DACs. |
Hi Mrpaul, I do have a few operational questions;
1. Do you connect your Antipodes DX to your home internet router using an ethernet cable,
2. What is the best/fastest method of transferring files you already own to the DX, and
3. Have you been successful in downloading music directly from iTunes and/or other sources?
Thanks |
Thanks Steve, I appreciate the information. It seems your experience is that the Hex can be improved on by using the S/PDIF input through the Off-Ramp vs. the Hex's onboard USB. It would be an easier decision if the USB on the Hex was crappy, or even mediocre but most say it is one of the better implementations on a DAC so I have to think hard about whether to try to improve it with a different input, or to simply upgrade the DAC. I suspect part of the improvement through the Off-Ramp is the additional clocks before the DAC?
I am interested to see if the DX straight into the Hex is an improvement over the mini, and then I will give the DAC issue some more thought. For the money, I may be just as well off to upgrade the DAC but I have some stuff I should sell first. I understand the front end of your ODSE is pretty much equivalent to running a USB through the Off-Ramp and then into a really good DAC. I will consider that, but one step at a time, for now. |
The Antipodes DX is up and running today.
A couple of early impressions are how easy it was to get the hang of the operations, and how much I enjoy the interface. Another thing I like is how easy it is to rip CDs. Mine are only taking about 5-8 minutes to rip and I can fully play music while ripping. All you do is put the CD in the front slot and wait until it pops out. The music is automatically added to your playlist. The remote interface with iPeng is very easy, versatile and works great.
So far, I wouldn't say the DX sounds better than my Mojo mini but, based on Steve's comments, I will give it time. It is certainly in the same ballpark but maybe a touch less resolving and a touch less dynamic than the mini. There is no edge or glare whatsoever, but my mini also does not display those undesirable traits. The DX displays a somewhat more evenhanded presentation than my mini, which seems to do a little more with regards to attack and decay. At this point, the DX also displays a bit of lower midrange or midbass warmth, which could be affecting the perception of resolution and speed.
These are very early observations and do nothing but show that both the Mojo mini and Antipodes DX are very good sounding source components. I will not be surprised if the DX gets better with time, or even if it surpasses the mini, but I will be surprised if it ends up being substantially better than the mini. I already knew the mini was good last year when I decided to sell my $7,500 CD player. |
Mitch - as I said before, it is a good USB interface that makes the Antipodes rise above everything else. Ok then, in generic terms (without listing manufacturers) please describe what makes a good USB interface. What are the important factors of a "good interface?" Is it converting USB to S/PDIF ahead of the DAC, having additional clocks before the DAC, filtering, or all of these? Is there more? |
I relearned today that when something isn't working, and it should be, just keep moving stuff around and see if it changes.
I couldn't figure out why this Antipodes DX music server that everyone is raving about was not sonically beating my Mojo Mac mini. The DX sounded good, but not great, although it was a touch smoother, but it was certainly not as dynamic as the mini, or as extended, or with as much resolution...bummer.
I received some Furutech fuses yesterday and proceeded to put two 2A Furutech fuses in the DX (yes, it takes two), then I remembered that when I first set up the DX, I did not have enough power cords so I had used an old 14awg SJT Belden cord with molded ends. Therefore, I took the time to build up a power cord from bulk Neotech NEP-3002, an 11awg cord made with UP-OCC copper wire. I used Furutech FI-25(G) connectors.
Well, to cut to the chase, the DX now sounds waaay better and yes, it rocks. I am sitting here listening to "Blues for the Lost Days," "Kids Got the Blues," and others from John Mayall's 70th birthday bash at head banging volumes, and I doubt whether I have ever heard this stuff sound better in my system. For something a little more acoustic, Warren Haynes' Benefit Concert #4 with Sons of Ralph, and many others, is also sounding very nice.
The DX is tonally rich and has an analog-like coherency. It sounds controlled at all volumes. With the new fuses and cord, it now seems plenty extended and well-balanced. For some reason the mini previously sounded more dynamic and had more bass drive. Things are now closer, but the mini is still louder at the same volume setting for some reason. Bass from the mini is very hard hitting while from the DX it is a bit fuller but perhaps not as well defined, hopefully this will improve. The DX reminds me of my former MUSE digital player in that it is well balanced across all frequencies but seems more focused on the midrange, which is dense and vibrant. The very high end and low end seem to be supportive of what's going on in the middle octaves. This is not a bad thing and in my experience is a good characteristic for long-term satisfaction.
The Mojo mini server still sounds great, and I have more comparing to do but, for the first time since the DX arrived, I suspect I have a new server. More to come. |
Mr. Paul,
How did you decide on the CAD USB cable? I have been looking at that very cable for a short run from my Antipodes DX to the Metrum Pavane. Have you heard the CAD USB cable with other DACs? Any feedback on that cable and how it compares to others would be appreciated. |
Thanks Mr. Paul. I have decided to try the CAD cable based on your comments and very positive reviews from several others. I too am awaiting construction of a new DAC so hope to have the cable arrive about the same time. |
Hifial, are you talking about the USB REGEN by UpTone Audio? Is this not just a reclocker? Sounds interesting but it seems all this add-on stuff like converters, ifi galvanic isolation, filters, etc. are always supposed to be the next best thing. Do you have one in your system?
Regarding DACs, I will have the Aqua LaScala MkII here to try this weekend. I am very interested in how it will sound, particularly since there are tubes in the gain stage. I was not a fan of the tubed Lampi L4G4 when that was here, but that was a different design so hopefully this LaScala is a different sound. Metrum's Pavane is supposed to be here in a few more weeks so I will have a chance to hear a couple of pretty good DACs in the near future. |
Thank you Hifial. I am certainly not opposed to trying something that only costs me $175, especially if it is made for USB connections, which is how I connect my server to my DAC. I will look into this further. |
Bill K, the LaScala is here and making beautiful music. Very early impressions are;
1. Good drive, throughout most of the frequency range and particularly in the mid-bass,
2. The treble is clear, smooth, and is just to the good side of "reticent,"
3. Absolutely beautiful midrange with spot-on tonality, not just because it is smooth sounding but because it sounds real, like you are at a show, or like the singer is in your room, and
4. A touch of softness and maybe a slight lack of focus/definition in the bass...
This is a DAC that will be killer for those who value midrange warmth and bloom....sounding a bit like analogue. This DAC will be a friend to those many less than stellar quality recordings out there.
These are first impressions after only a few hours of warm-up, although the "demo" unit came to me already burned in. I am listening through the SMc Signature DNA-2 LAE amp and associated (almost-VRE) preamp, and will switch to the AI Atsah amps this weekend. I can certainly understand why Srajan and Darko liked this DAC so much. More to come. |
It would be fun to have several of these top DACs all together for comparison at the same time. I suspect the result would be that the performance of most of these "flagship" DACs would end up more a matter of being "somewhat different but not meaningfully better," although some may mate with certain equipment better. Listening to the LaScala here today and it may be complemented a bit better through the Atsahs, which seem to have an iron grip on the lower registers. The LaScala has tons of drive and the music is clear, full-toned and as loud as you want it without any sign of strain. Through the SMc DNA-2 LAE, it may display a bit better dimensionality but it is beautiful sounding through both amps and more of the "total package" when played through the Atsahs, because of their grip on the bass. The distributer suggests trying something other than the stock power cord, which I will do later today or tomorrow. The Hex seems to sound a little better through the SMc amp. I would really like to hear the Bricasti and the ODSE but like 4425 says, Can't imagine meaningfully better performance, at least through my system. I will have the Pavane through here in a few weeks so that should be interesting too. |
Matt, if you are using your digital set-up 75% of the time in your speaker auditions, IMO you should consider replacing the Mac mini with a dedicated audio server before making your final decision on speakers.
The difference between using a tricked out Mojo Mac mini with outboard linear power supply, and just about everything else that can be done to a mini, and changing to an Antipodes DX server was so significant in my system that I suspect the mini may be limiting the true abilities of the speakers you are trying, particular at the level of resolution your system displays.
To try and explain the differences, I would say the DX sounds more natural, and certainly more enjoyable, because of the absence of a bit of edginess displayed by the mini, in comparison, and because of improved body, tonal density and depth displayed through the DX. It is not particularly night and day but the last 5-10% rarely is. |
Hey Matt, if you make it to room 537 to hear the Kii Audio powered speakers I would enjoy hearing what you think of them, particularly after all the comparison listening you have done lately. There are several things that stand out, in addition to simply being powered speakers, such as how deep they are said to go for a standmount and how their use of drivers on four sides creates a controlled, cardioid dispersion pattern that reduces the negative effects of early reflections. I have linked an introduction below that explains it better than I can and also provides a link to their website. GTT Audio & Video is the new US Distributor and I believe may be hosting the room. Enjoy your time at RMAF. Kii Audio |
Glad you had a good day at RMAF Matt, and thanks for the observations about the Kii. |
Thanks for the update Wisnon. This product holds promise for folks who want high-end sound without a wall of equipment. Bring a source and you are good to go! That it tackles room boundary issues too is a real bonus. This could be the perfect solution for younger apartment dwellers, older downsizers and everyone else who wants to keep it simple. The WiSA (Wireless Speaker and Audio) input will offer yet another level of convenience. I don't know much about it but I hope the WiSA "standard" will also support wireless for two-channel audio, because they seem to be focused on "surround audio in home theater and commercial environments." WiSA |
The best scenario is to move to the basement, give my wife back the office, and get my OWN room. I need to start hinting to the boss a win/win solution... I suspect you would like a move to your own room. I found a concrete floor much better for medium to large speakers and the higher ceiling in the basement could also be an advantage. Running wiring should be easier as would running dedicated lines if you haven't already. You will be able to add room treatments as you see fit without affecting domestic serenity. In my case, I found it easier having a room where I did not have to weigh each decision against a component of "how will this affect the family space." |
Ctsooner, you will be in my thoughts. I lost my Dad over the Christmas holidays and he was career Army/National Guard. It is a tough time, even when they are older. I was impressed with the quality of friends and comrades that showed up to pay respects. For me, the military honors were special as they reminded me of the sacrifices made by those who serve to keep us safe, and how proud of them we should be.
On audio topics, I remain interested in servers and I am where you are with a dedicated tricked out Mojo Mac mini, with external linear PS, external AV drive, internal SSD, 5V USB power isolation (do not use power from the mini), and filtered USB. I am currently looking hard at Antipodes but I agree the better/best servers seem expensive for what they are (basically computers). The main benefits of the best servers, like Antipodes, over our minis seem to be running the Linux OS, a few optimizations of noise that are not feasible with the mini (no fan, etc.), and better isolated USB outputs. I have not jumped yet for the same reason as you, because pricing is likely to come down, and sound quality up, as manufacturers figure out what folks want and how to best deliver it. I would like to see a really good server made in the USA and the main options I am aware of are the Baetis and CAPS servers.
As you guys explore and hear options, it would be nice to have an active thread dedicated to servers. I started one in August titled, "State of the Source: Server, computer....or what? and while a few folks provided input it eventually fizzled out for lack of interest. |
Steve, one of the questions I had about the Antipodes unit was how their "Uncompressed Flac Paranoid-mode" format, which is standard from the internal ripper, would sound compared to the uncompressed AIFF format I use with my mini. It is my understanding that FLAC is a compressed lossless format and I have read forum discussions with folks on both sides of whether the "uncompressed" characterization (i.e., "Uncompressed Flac Paranoid-mode") can be accurately applied to FLAC. Users of the Antipodes devices don't seem to be concerned about it so it must sound good. Any thoughts?
I was told the Antipodes will also store other formats but if you use the internal ripper you get FLAC. To store and play the other formats, you apparently need to download them from the internet or rip them on another device and transfer. I will have some things to learn when my unit arrives later this week. |
Thanks Mrpaul, I am glad to hear the DX plays all formats since the dealer loaded some hi-rez music before he shipped the DX unit to me, and the music in the outboard drive attached to my mini is stored in AIFF format.
I am really looking forward to hearing the "USB Audio 5V Off" output from the DX to my Metrum Hex, which uses its own internal PS for USB. I currently run the USB cable from my mini into an ifi Power but only come out with the signal side of the cable thus removing computer power from the USB cable. After the ifi Power, I run the signal only USB cable into the ifi filter, which I attach to the Hex.
Audioengr, short of switching from the Hex to the ODSE (which I am still considering), do any of your products enhance the connection between an Antipodes device and a DAC like the Hex, which has internal USB power? |
Matt,
I believe I read the Antipodes software is based on Fedora Linux.
With the Hex, there is no need for anything to "sever the USB power" to the DAC, since the Hex does not need or use USB power from the source because the Hex has its own internal USB power supply. Also, the Antipodes DX provides two USB outputs, one that is powered and one that has no power (which is the one I use with the Hex). For now, I also run the (non-powered) USB through the ifi Power for galvanic isolation (not sure if this is needed but it doesn't seem to hurt), outputting signal only, and then through the ifi filter then into the DAC. With the Mojo mini set-up, I also took the USB power out with the ifi Power to feed the Hex only the signal side of the USB.
Ctsooner,
I have actually been using a mouse and screen to run the Mojo mini. I use the Pure Music player because I thought it sounded better than the other two and I like how it interfaces with iTunes. There is no particular reason why I have not switched to a remote control to run the mini, since I have both an iPad and iPhone. After using the remote (iPeng8) with the Antipodes DX, I will probably go ahead and download a remote I can use with the mini, while I further compare the two servers. |
Why did you choose the Antipodes over an Aurender? As it shakes out, those would be the two companies I would look at if I were looking to purchase something today. I looked into a few others but found reasons not to pursue them. I like the minimalist Linux set-up used by Antipodes and how it is optimized ot operate extremely quietly. There were three reasons I chose the Antipodes; 1. Good feedback - At the time I was looking, their top model (DX) had just come out and all of their lower models had excellent reviews based on sound quality, and Steve Nugent (Empirical Audio) said it was the only unit he had used that bettered his special 2009 mini with Hynes PS, etc., 2. Expandability - At the time, they had an "extender" that could be used to serve music to any room/system from the main DX unit (they discontinued that and are supposed to be coming up with something "better" but it is taking a long time), and 3. Availability/Price - I was able to purchase a 2TB SSD DX at a discount from an outgoing dealer (they now have new USA representation and are adding dealers). Since I purchased mine, there have been several rave professional reviews of the DX citing excellent sound quality. If I were to purchase today, in addition to the DX, I would look at the Aurender N100 or the Antipodes DV Zero, both of which are set up to play music from a NAS. My DX is also capable of playing music from a NAS if I choose to implement a "direct playback" set-up, but, for now, 2TB is more than enough solid state storage for lossless FLAC files. In addition to great sound quality, I like the Antipodes because of the easy on-board ripper, just load a CD disc and 5 minutes later it is copied, stored and cataloged. Dave Clark complained about the Vortex Box interface not being compelling enough in appearance, but it looks and works just fine on my iPad. I haven't seen the Aurender interface, maybe it looks cooler. The DV zero, when properly set-up, is apparently equivalent in sound quality to the DX, but at a lower price. Here is what they say; By eliminating internal storage, the DV Zero has been specifically optimised for 'direct' playback from a NAS. The DV Zero achieves a sound quality level that comes close to the DX, therefore offering the ideal solution for people with large music collections demanding the best possible sound quality. I will close by saying I am completely happy with the sound quality of the DX and happy I purchased one instead of continuing to try and improve my system around the mini. BTW, you can purchase the DX with a SSD up to 3TB in size. |
I was thinking of my response and then read what Guido wrote and realized I would say the same thing. Al articulated further and I agree with what he added and with his summary that warmth is frequency related.
The lower midrange emphasis is most commonly associated with warmth but it can also come with slightly suppressed high frequencies and bass that is either, or both, rolled off at the very low end and perhaps a bit "fat" or somewhat less than detailed/defined. IMO a rich sound is all about tone and harmonic structure and is always a good thing. I also find the terms "dark" and "bright" interesting but different in that I would characterize them as describing a frequency shift either lower (dark) or higher (bright) that can be independent, or in conjunction with, being warm or rich.
All of these are preferences and Guido makes a good point that a system can sound both neutral and rich, which I find a very good combination, but would add just a touch of warmth and darkness to achieve the sound I enjoy. |
Sometimes I wonder how we would each enjoy our systems if we never spoke with each other and never read any reviews. Is our capacity to enjoy different and are our happy buttons different then they would have otherwise been? I believe "yes" Matt, and thanks for the reminder that what we hear, and the level of enjoyment that brings to us, is what really counts and not bragging rights, audio reviews or internet consensus. Many years ago, when I put my first system together, before the internet, and before I had ever read a single audio magazine, I went to a couple of different shops and in both cases the salespeople simply let me listen to gear in my price range and make my own choices. I ended up with a NAD 3040, Thorens TD166 MkII and ADS L810s. 35 years later, the NAD still powers my outdoor system. After owning and listening to them for over 20 years, selling the L810s and Thorens were two of my earliest audio transactions and two of my biggest mistakes. I believe the longevity of that first gear was because it represented equipment that sounded good to me, without outside influences. |
I also bet that Ayre will be coming out with a newref DAC within the year too and probably sooner now that they have the Twenty series gear out.
ctsooner, is that statement speculation, or have you heard something? I find it interesting their only DAC is a 9-series product. |
ctsooner, did you and Matt hear the same Antipodes DX server? I ask because neither of you were impressed, so I am curious whether there may have been an issue with the unit you heard. Stranger things have happened. I am not saying it is the the greatest thing to come along for digital music, but I do hear it like Steve does, and over here it was clearly fuller, richer and more musical than a very well-appointed, and good-sounding, Mojo Mac mini with all the bells and whistles. It has the ripper you desire, so easy, you put in the disc and it rips and stores the file as lossless flac for immediate access in your library. |
Nice review Marc. Your words pretty well mirror what I have been hearing for the past year of owning the Pavane. I don’t know whether it is an "absolute top tier dac" but it certainly makes listening fun. The combination of Pavane and Antipodes DX results in the best sounding source I have owned. |
Hello Ketcham,
I am glad you are enjoying your SX DAC.
I am curious whether you are using the DAC’s volume control and/or Steve’s Final Drive, or do you run your DAC to a preamp?
Have you tried either (the volume control or the Final Drive) and if so what did you think of them?
Thanks for sharing any insights. |
I have been pretty happy with Metrum's Pavane, which bests all the DACs and disc players I have owned or auditioned in my system. I am interested in Metrum's new Adagio DAC, which reportedly goes beyond being simply a Pavane with volume control.
The volume control on the Adagio is implemented by changing the reference voltage of the dacs, which seems similar to the technology used by Empirical Audio for their volume control. Metrum has modified the DAC boards and increased the maximum reference voltage by 3 times resulting in a reported noise floor of -155
dB and improved linearity. The Adagio uses
30VA transformers for each channel (double the Pavane)
and 16 ladder dacs
instead of the 8 used in the Pavane.
I look forward to hearing whether the DAC with volume direct approach will sound better than sending the signal through
the AN tantalum resistors in the volume control of my zero gain, buffered preamp. It would also be fun to try the Adagio with and without the Final Drive.
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Guido, are you running your Aeris directly to your amps or are you using a preamp in-between? If you tried it both ways, would you share any comments about the relative strengths and weaknesses of each approach? Sunseekerespana, to your questions:
Is the no gain pre-amp a passive or have valves as a buffer? The preamp is buffered using solid state devices, very similar to this; http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews/smcaudio/vre1.htmlI use a passive (pot and source switch only). It works really week, but the thing to watch is the DAC has;
1 Enough gain My current DAC, the Pavane, has an output voltage of 4V, which is more than enough to fully drive the amplifiers. 2 The output impedance is low (less than 500 ohms) If it is higher along with capacitance in your interconnects you may get loss of dynamics and bass roll off. The buffering reduces output impedance and eliminates loss of bass or dynamics. 3 You can sit the DAC and Passive Pre very close to the Power Amplifier This is always good practice when possible and particularly with passives. My ICs from preamp to amplifiers are I to 1.5M. When I compare my buffered preamp with a passive preamp I own (Goldpoint) I never use longer than 1M ICs. I also have Endler attenuators, which connect directly to the amplifiers and actually sound pretty good. I am curious about the variable voltage volume control in DACs like the Overdrive SE/SX, Aeris and now Metrum's Adagio, and whether those have any negative effects (relative to usking a preamp) on things like bass impact, dynamics, staging or other desirable sonic traits. I was worried about these issues when I went to a zero-gain buffered preamp but it seems to be the best of both worlds with excellent bass and dynamics plus the clarity/purity passives are known for. |
Hi Guido, Your comments remind me of what I hear....
Aeris by itself yielded a subtle amount of greater resolution compared to having Criterion in the chain reminds me of removing my preamp and using one of my passives, either a Goldpoint passive preamp or Endler attenuators direct to amp, and with Criterion in the chain, you would experience a subtly warmer presentation that admittedly is quite intoxicating which is similar to what I hear through my preamp, which is a no gain, buffered unit with external choke power supply and Shallco discrete resistor volume control constructed using Audio Note tantalum resistors. The main difference from your situation is my preamp doesn't add noise. It seems most here end up preferring a preamp in their systems, including those who have used a volume control implemented by changing the reference voltage of the dacs, such as with the ODSE. One reviewer, Steven Plaskin at AudioStream, slightly preferred having the Ayre KX-R preamp in his system to running the ODSE direct to his Ayre MX-R amps, even with the Final Drive buffers in-line. Not using the volume
direct to amps approach would make a jump to the Adagio less attractive, even though it is said to sound better than the Pavane because of the significantly increased reference voltage and doubling of the number of dacs. I really need to find one to audition to find out for sure how much better it sounds and whether I could live with it direct to my amps. For now, I will be happy to replace the mac mini I have been listening to for the past couple of weeks with my fully upgraded Antipodes DX, which arrives on Friday, with Roon and the option to use the newly added S/PDIF output instead of USB. Kudos to Antipodes for supporting existing customers with upgrades and for staying at the forefront of server technology. |
Have Metrum's Adagio DAC/preamp burning-in over here. I have been pretty happy with their Pavane but the thought of an all-in-one DAC/preamp with volume control was interesting to me. The volume is implemented similar to (the same as?) the ODSE in that it adjusts the reference voltage while the signal comes straight from the dacs.
In addition to the ability to function as a preamp, the number of dacs is doubled over the Pavane as is the overall voltage. There are dual outputs so I am able to also drive my sub from the DAC/preamp and the outputs are adjustable to either 0 or -10 dB. At 0dB the output is 6/3 Volts RMS for XLR and rca outputs, respectively. Very early impressions are of excellent drive, clarity and naturalness (as with all Metrum DACs). I will be interested to hear, after this has burned in for awhile, whether my zero-gain, buffered, SMc preamp with the tantalum resistors will sound a bit more "fleshed-out and romantic" even if the resulting sound may be slightly less precise. If that is the case, the question will be whether there is an advantage (over the Pavane) to keeping the Adagio and running the signal through the preamp. They say there is no detriment to that set-up, sort of like the choice to run the ODSE through a preamp or not, as several reviewers have done. The trick with these high resolution pieces is to provide the resolution and drive while maintaining the musicality.
It would be great to have a few contenders in one place to try as I did with my recent amplifier shoot-out. It seems that is the best way to really get to the heart of the differences. In particular, if I had my wish I would have Aqua's Formula (probably more than I would want to spend) and their LaScala (already tried it and preferred the Pavane but it was close), as well as a solid representative from Lampizator. My only trial with Lampizator was a couple of years ago with the L4G4, which I thought had an overblown soundstage and somewhat overly loose/ripe bass. That and the somewhat DIY appearance of their units at that time were turn-offs for me. They have come a long way with their newer units. |
Thank you bill_k for the suggestion to check out the new LaScala III DAC.
After a day of Ayre's glide tone, the Adagio (using the on-board volume adjustment) is starting to flesh out and sound pretty good.
klh007, I do not have a "link" to the shoot-out because I have not publically published much about it other than a few comments in various posts. The shoot-out as I called it, basically consisted of a comparison of primarily four amplifiers in my system over a period of about 2 years, along with a couple of other amps I did not consider contenders because they simply could not hang with the primary four. You can see a picture of three of the four amplifiers on my system page under the title, "you can never have enough power"
In short, the amplifiers included Ncore NC1200 monos, Lamm M1.2 monos, Clayton M300 monos and a McCormack DNA-2 LAE stereo amplifier upgraded to Signature status by SMc Audio. The Claytons remain in my system.
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Hi Matt, as the owner of a Mojo Mac mini, I agree with you that the better "audiophile grade dedicated standalone servers" improve on the sound of even a purpose-configured Mac mini server, and I respect your opinion that "Aurender easily stands at the top of the pile (of)......full standalone music servers with renderers built in." However, I remain curious about your audition of the Antipodes DX server. As I remember from your posts, you didn't care at all for the sound, which so far off from what most others hear that it makes me wonder whether there were problems with the unit, stored files, or interface with the DAC you were using at the time. Last year, my Antipodes DX received the Generation 2 upgrade with full Roon capability. John Darko at DAR compared the Gen 2 DX with Aurender's N100H and found, "Antipodes Audio’s flagship DX, ....a cut above its rival in price and performance." Dave Clark at Posi+ive Feedback said of the
original (Gen 1) DX, "I loved the sound. I mean LOVED. The Antipodes presents music with such scale and density that it is scary good. Space, presence, texture… extension, detail, resolution… absence of any, ANY, glare, grit, brightness, hardness… but a lot of nothingness between the notes and within the music. Damn. Stuff just happened. The music played… it flowed... washing over you like the waves of the sea. Engulfing you… engaging you… sweeping you away. The Antipodes brought out the best, but did not editorialize or color the sound. What was there was there, but with the better the recording, the better it sounded… and yet, poor recordings took on a higher level of sonic pleasure—the Antiopdes dug deeper into the music letting the beauty come out, regardless of the quality.....my highest recommendation." John Atkinson, of Stereophile, reviewed the Gen 1 DX and concluded, "Highly recommended. I said highly." In addition to the folks listed above, others who hear lots of digital gear, such as Steve Nugent and Michael Lavorgna also really like the DX. I have not yet seen anything less than a stellar review of the Antipodes DX, or of any Antipodes server, and my own experience is that the Gen 2 Antipodes DX is easily the best-sounding digital source I have used in my system.
So, while I am not questioning your opinion, I am questioning whether there may have been a problem with the DX unit you auditioned. If not, then I would chalk up your observations to personal preference. The reasons for my post are to encourage you to find an opportunity to hear another (preferably Gen 2) DX server, and also
to encourage the other readers of this thread that there are (at least) two top choices when considering a stand-alone server. http://www.digitalaudioreview.net/2016/06/reference-grade-roon-with-the-antipodes-dx-gen-2/ http://positive-feedback.com/audio-discourse/audio-ramblings-the-antipodes-dx-music-server/ http://www.stereophile.com/content/antipodes-dx-reference-music-server#BTSLL31HoQZV9o0i.97 |
I agree with you ctsooner. All of this is just opinion based on personal preference and a whole bunch of other factors that are not the same for any two of us. It is the same for professional reviewers. That is why absolute statements rarely if ever apply for all.
One thing about your affinity for computer-based servers, depending on the player used, it is easier to add your own "special sauce" and tweak the file not only with upsampling but also using EQ to adjust for the room and/or the speaker used. That is one fun aspect of using the computer. My Mojo mini does sound good and depending on player settings and source material it can come pretty close to the sound of the DX. |
Call Michael at Tweek Geek for Aqua.
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I have been interested in the CAD stuff since I read the first review of the CAD 1543. I like his approach to design that emphasizes galvanic isolation, power supplies, and NOS, and I suspect their gear is very musical. I look forward to hearing about your impressions.
Stopped short on the CAD myself mostly because of the single-ended only outputs, cost, and inability to easily audition one. Instead found Metrum and am currently satisfied with the musicality/performance from my Level 3 Pavane and DX server. |
nitewulf, I own a Metrum Pavane Level 3 and I think it sounds great in my system. This thread is typically devoted to the significantly more expensive DACs
Matt is auditioning. |
I owned the Adagio and
have had
the LaScala here in my system for an audition. I agree with gibalok about the Adagio, which I found to be very clean and resolving but with a bit less body and tonal density than I enjoyed from my Level 1 Pavane. I could tell the Adagio was more resolving than my Level 1 Pavane but after sending my Pavane in for the upgrade, I found the Level 3 Pavane to be more to my liking than the Adagio since it was close in resolution and IMO displayed superior body and tonal density. I have a very high quality unity-gain, buffered preamp so do not need or want to go direct from the DAC to my amps. I could live with the Adagio, but preferred the Level 3 Pavane, even when I compared them by running both through my preamp.
I preferred the Level 1 Pavane to the LaScala although that opinion may be in the minority. I would definitely prefer the Level 3 Pavane to the LaScala. I have not heard Aqua's Formula but would like to. |
audiotroy, I auditioned the Aqua Hifi La Scala MKII, but not the recent Optologic version.
gibalok, my pre was custom
made by SMc Audio - Steve McCormack, and is very close to his VRE-1. It is a unity-gain, buffered preamp with the VRE-1 outboard choke power supply, a Shallco volume control with AN Tantalum resisters, and Lundahl output transformers that are wound with Cardas copper wire.
For more about the Metrum DACs, I suggest reading Srajan's 6moons reviews all the way through the March 2017 Adagio review and his comparison of that DAC to the COS, LaScala, and Formula DACs. |
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I think I may like the Boulder more, but I can’t tell if it’s better or just different.....with the Boulder in, it sounds like I’m in the recording studio proper, with the performers. With the Davinci 2 it sounds like I’m in the mixing room. One is cleaner, the other more full and balanced......
The Davinci 2 is mind blowingly good! So for the Boulder to be “better” is sort of boggling my mind. Is it possible? Or am I just willing it to be? I need others to confirm since I’m on the proverbial fence.
Reading your words, it seems that for first time in your journey there may not be perfect alignment between the consensus "best" DAC and the DAC that sounds most enjoyable to you. Obviously, both must sound fantastic but the question then becomes what you value most from your system. |
Matt, you said "I will plug a space heater onto it for a month and let it burn in." Considering your future is likely to include trying more equipment and presumably also cable changes, why not purchase something like the Audiodharma Cable Cooker so you can condition your cables over the course of a few days, instead of a month with a space heater. Your first task for the cooker could be to condition the Romex you plan to use in the wall, as well as the GTX outlet. Just a suggestion. https://www.thecablecooker.com/how-does-the-cable-cooker-work/ |
