The best sounding amp I've ever owned is the single ended tube amp I'm using currently…it weighs a massive 15 pounds and puts out a mighty 12 watts per side. Mighty. |
a half ton is 1,000 lbs! i wonder how many pounds would the mcintosh mc2k amp weigh with it's 3 units? |
"A pair of monoblocs weighing right at a half-ton...amazing"
The post says a PAIR of monoblocs! The pair weighs 900 lbs...which is "right at" a half ton (1,000 lbs).
...geez, nitpickers. |
a 1/2 ton weighs 1,000 lbs. not 500 lbs. lol. |
I go by sound alone i now have a Audia Flight Strumento #4 MK 2 that weighs only 210 Â pounds it sounds much better than my Pass 350.8 at only 148 pounds.However they are both great amps and sound much better than any class d amp i have ever heard.So in the end its sound not weight that makes the difference for me.
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@ noble100,what a great since of humor!that was cool!cheers! |
Audiolabyrinth,
OK, you talked me into it. We'll swap my class D amp for your Krell 700cx for a period not to exceed 30 yrs.
Sounds good, send me a pm when you're ready to swap and we'll work out the details.
Thanks,
Tim |
@ Guidocorona,thankyou for your list here that you provided,as you may see,a class D amp would be for a second system,my Krell pure class A fpb 700cx will be on the main system,this amp with the Taralabs zero gold i/c and omega gold speaker cables has one of the best sound to my ears I have ever heard in my life!,thats saying alot if you knew the many price no object systems that I have listened to,audition,or owned!the marriage between this amp and cables is stunning!,you to are a gentleman for you to take time and provide this info on class D amps,again,thankyou.cheers! |
@ noble100,I like pass amps,however, I like krell better,I own a legendary Krell fpb 700cx,this amp will never be sold or traded,Its that good!,krell may make a better amp,From what I have read on the gon forums and other sites,the evo E series are these new wideband amps that can be very bright sounding if you do not use a cable system that compensates for the resolving power of these new krell amps,I am interested in class D amplification for a second system that I want to improve and finish building,and btw,thankyou very much with the list here you provided,you are a gentlemen indeed! |
Hi Labyrinth, in your general price range, I warmly suggest you have a listen at the following three amps, all based on the Hypex Ncore NC1200 module:
Acoustic Imagery
ATSAH monos
Status: released
Price $8999 per pair
Distributed in US by: Tweak Geek of Denver (CO), phone: 888-998-9335
Merrill Audio
Veritas monos
Status: released
Price $12,000 per pair
Call Merrill at: (415) 562-4434
Mola-Mola monoblock amplifier
Status: probably to be release in 3rd WQ 2013
Price: TBD (probably quite a bit more expensive than Veritas and ATSA)
Distributed by: On A Higher Note, phone: 949Â 544Â 1990
Mola-Mola is being developed by a company by the same name, owned in part by Bruno Putseys, original creator of Ncore technology. Mr. Putseys is also the lead designer of the complete amplifier.
From a purely engineering point of view, I conjecture that Mola-Mola will be the most sophisticated implementation of the three, with ATSAH being the simplest. But do not be fooled by the word "simple"... all signs point to The Ncore NC1200 module by itself delivering a very high sonic musical standard as a starting point.
There are a couple of intriguing products soon coming from Rowland.... A bridgeable amp called M525 slated for April, based on a Pascal class D module. The device should cost approx $4500 for one unit and can be bridged to mono operations... If I remember its power ratings correctly: 250W / 8 Ohms, 500W / 4 Ohms, 1000W bridged to mono.
The same company will also release an integrated amp based on a different Pascal class D module, to be called Continuum S2, priced at $9500. Power rating: 400W/ 8 Ohms, 800W / 4 Ohms.
While I am usually fond of the Rowland sound, I freely admit that have never heard any amps based on Pascal class D modules, so I have no idea how these Rowland products will sound.
G.
G.
|
Labyrinth,
Here's a list of class D amps. I copied this list from an AVS forum (Seriusly Cold created it). Does plaigerism apply to the internet? Hope not. This was compiled a few years ago, so added Abletec, Class D Audio, Pascal, Merrill Audio and Rowland, but I probably missed some, and I also deleted AVS123 and Murano(out of business):
Abletec Scandinavian OEM amp module manufacturer
Newer proprietary class D
Acoustic Reality http://www.acoustic-reality.com/
eAR202, etc (ICEPower)
Aivin http://www.aivin.com.cn/
DT300 (Tripath)
Analog Research Technology http://www.analogresearch-technology.com/
Arion Audio http://www.arionaudio.com
MK1000 (proprietary)
AudioArt (NL) http://www.audioart.nl/
Van Medevoort MA240 (Hypex UcD)
Audiodigit http://www.audiodigit.com/
MC 8x100 (Tripath)
AudioResearch http://www.audioresearch.com/
150.2, 300.2, 150M (Tripath)
Axiom Audio http://www.axiomaudio.com/
A1400-8 (ICEPower)
B&O http://www.icepower.bang-olufsen.com/
(ICEPower)
BelCanto http://www.belcantodesign.com/products.html
Evo (Tripath) eOne (ICEPower)
Bertram http://www.audiokabel.dk/eng-main.htm
(ICEPower)
Blacknote http://www.blacknote.eu/
DSA 100, DSA 150 http://www.blacknote.eu/products/dsa.php
Bryston http://www.bryston.ca/
D250Z multichannel power amp
Carver http://www.carverusa.com/
300.2, 700.2, 1200.2
Cary Audio http://www.caryaudio.com/
A 306 power amplifier
Channel Islands Audio http://www.ciaudio.com/
D100, D200 (Hypex UcD)
Chapter Audio http://www.chapteraudio.co.uk/
Couplet Power Amp (proprietary WMP class-D)
Class D Audio www.classdaudio.com
DIY kit modules and completed amps(proprietary class-D)
D-Sonic http://www.d-sonic.net/
Magnum (ICEPower and Abletec amp modules used)
Devialet http://www.devialet.com/
D-Premier (Hybrid, proprietary)
DIYCable http://www.diycable.com/
Exodus (Hypex UcD)
Egosys http://www.egosys.co.jp/
Audiotrak DrAMP (Tripath)
Elan http://www.elanhomesystems.com/
D1200, D1600 (12 and 16 channel power amps, Tripath)
Electronic Visionary Systems http://www.tweakaudio.com/
EVS-2 (ICEPower)
Flying Mole http://www.flyingmoleelectronics.com/
(proprietary class-D)
Genesis http://www.genesisloudspeakers.com
Genesis Reference GR180 (Hypex)
Gilmore Audio http://www.glacieraudio.com/
Raven, Raptor, Dragonfly m/ch (looks like ICE)
H2O Audio http://www.iceh2oaudio.com/
M250, M500 (ICEpower)
Halcro http://www.halcro.com/logic/home.asp
Lyrus
Huygens Audio http://www.huygensaudio.com/
MCD-1202, MCD-1802 (MHz Class-D)
Integra /Onkyo http://www.integrahometheater.com/
DTA 9.4 7x120W 8Ω
Jeff Rowland http://www.jeffrowland.com/
Model 501 (ICEPower)
Jjaz Audio http://www.jjaz.dk/
(ICEPower)
Kharma http://www.kharma.com/
MP150
LC Audio http://www.lcaudio.com/
Predator SE (ZapPulse)
Marantz http://www.marantz.jp
Opsodis ES-150 (D2Audio) 2ch virtual surround
Marten Audio
Scandinavian firm utilizing newest class D (Abletec)
Most expensive monos at $40K/pr
Medius [DK] http://www.medius.cc/
A II, A III
Meridian http://www.meridian-audio.com
G95 DVD receiver system (Hypex UcD)
Merrill Audio www.merrillaudio.net
Veritas monos(Hypex nc1200)
MG Audiolabs http://www.mglaudiolabs.com/
Symphony (Hypex UcD)
Midgard Audio http://www.midgardaudio.no/www/
(ICEPower)
MindCraft (NL) http://www.mindcraft.nl/
Media Amp One (Hypex UcD))
NAD http://nadelectronics.com/ NEW
M2 Direct Digital (Zetex)
NHT http://nhthifi.com/
Power2, Power5 (ICEpower)
Nuforce http://www.nuforce.com/
Ref 8, Ref 8b, Ref 9 (nPhysics proprietary class-D)
NuVo Technologies http://www.nuvotechnologies.com/
NV-P2100
Onkyo http://www.onkyo.com/
A-1VL, A-9755, A-9555 (Proprietary)
Pascal Audio www.pascal-audio.com
Denmark
OEM amp modules for pro amps and powered spkrs
Proprietary UMAC class D
Primare http://www.primare.net/
CDI10 (Proprietary Ultra Fast Power Device (UFPD))
PSAudio http://www.psaudio.com/
GCA, GCMC, Trio A100 (ICEPower)
Red Dragon Audio http://www.reddragonaudio.com/
(ICEpower)
RedWineAudio http://www.redwineaudio.com/
Clari-T, Lotus (Tripath)
Rotel http://www.rotel.com/
1077 (7x100), 1092 (2x500) (ICEPower)
(Jeff)Rowland Design Group www.jeffrowlandgroup.com
Seymour AV http://www.seymourav.com/amps.asp
Ice Block Amps (Ice Power)
Sharp http://www.sharpusa.com/
SM-SX1, SM-SX100
Sonneteer http://freespace.virgin.net/sonneteer.audio/bronte.html
Brontë (Tripath)
Sony http://www.sony.com/
TA-DA9000ES, TA-FA1200ES (S-Master)
Spectron http://www.spectronav.com/
Musician, Troubador (int amp w digital inputs)
TactAudio/Lyngford http://www.tactaudio.dk/ http://www.lyngford.com/
Millennium & others (Equibit)
TEAC Esoteric http://teac.co.jp/av/esoteric/
AZ-1 pre-main (translated), AI-10 (Texas Instruments)
ThetaDigital http://www.thetadigital.com/
Virtu PowerDAC (Zetex class-Z)
UniwaveTek http://www.uniwavetek.com/
Anaco II
Wyred4Sound http://www.wyred4sound.com/
STI-500, STI-1000 (ICEpower)
Virtue Audio http://store.virtueaudio.com/
One.2, Two.2, Sensation M451, Sensation M901 (Tripath)
ICEBlock M5001 (ICEpower)
Yamaha http://www.yamaha.com/
MX-D1
Quite a few choices but I still probably missed a few.
Thanks,
Tim |
@ Minorl, very good point with your last post!,you hit my concerns on the nail head! |
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@ Guidocorona, My current class A amp retailed for $14,000.00 so I suppose $20,000.00 and down would be adequate! |
Mapman; No I haven't heard any class D amps with my Martin Logans. I would be very interested in hearing some. If Jeff Rowland amps are Class D, then I know he did it right. Switching power supplies are not new. They were/are used in auto amps because the voltage was 12VDC and to get the power needed without large current, you had to increase the voltage. P=IV=VxV/R=IxIxR. So, if for a auto amp you wanted 100 Watts, then 100=IxV and therefore, I=100/12 = 8.33 amps. Thats it! So to get stupidly high power out of auto amps, you need to step up the voltage to keep the current low and still produce high power. this eliminated large heavy transformers and storage capacitors. But, the drawback was that the switching power supplies generated a lot of noise that had to be filtered and this was really difficult to do. For home amps, the process is the same. They probably use switching power supplies with lots of large power transistors to eliminate the need for very heavy and expensive transformers. Otherwise, I can't see a reason to do this. You only need large heat sinks if you are operating in real class A. I.e. output devices biased on all the time at rated output power. That takes lots of amps and makes heat that must be dissipated. So, Class D, is to get the voltage up to a high level so that the current will be lower and to eliminate the large expensive transformers and storage capacitors. This is off the top of my head. As long as the power ratings at load along the frequency range is as advertised, I really see no difference. power is power. Either by high voltage and low current or low voltage and high current. But to drive say, 8 ohm speakers, then you need current for power. remember P = IxIxR. or lots of voltage gain for the outputs instead. P= VxV/R. |
Audiolabyrinth,
On an earlier post, you requested a list of class D amps that sound good. I am not, by any measure, an expert on class D amplifiers. I'm just a fellow music/audio lover who is always striving to assemble the best system I can for both 2-channel and ht playback. I've recently been reading all the forums and reviews on various class D amps.
I discovered the competence of class D by chance and as a result of a misfortune. My old Aragon class A/B 4004 broke down this past January. When the estimate to repair the leaking power supply caps was estimated at $300-500, I had a decision to make; should I repair it and get back the very good sound this 23 yr old amp had provided in my system for the past 10 yrs or take this opportunity to upgrade my system? Due to the amp's age, I decided to buy a replacement amp, either new or used. To further complicate matters, my budget was limited to $1,000 or less.
So, I was looking for a high powered ss (400 or more watts@4 ohms) stereo or pair of monobloc amps for less than $1,ooo. I knew this would be a difficult quest so I scoured the online markets and read various audio forums. The forums piqued my interest in class D as a solution. I eventually wound up buying a new Class D Audio SDS440SC stereo amp that puts out 440 watts@4 ohms that was priced at $630 with free shipping. I am more than pleased with this amp in my system(cd source, tube preamp and Magnepan spkrs).
I'm not ready to say the CDA amp is a worthy substitute in sound quality to your Pass amp. But I am willing to swap amps with you for a few weeks, months, yrs or decades if you'd like to find out.
I think we need to know your budget,preamp and speakers to properly list class D amps you may want to audition. Others will likely chime in with their suggestions as well. Also, I live just north of Indy if you prefer we make the amp swap in person.
Thanks,
Tim |
Lab,
I can comfortably say that Class D amps can sound "good". The ones I use sound as close to perfection as pretty much anything I have ever had expectation to possibly own. And they are alredy one or two generations removed from most recent products. That the Bel Canto ref1000m amps are still a current offering in their product line after several years says something about their viability.
The question is always what works best for and sounds best to an individual. Personal tastes and preferences make all the difference there and there are many flavors of quality products to choose from. Class D will not change that, though I suspect their popularity and application will only continue to grow and even accelerate over time as they become more widely accepted for sound quality as well as the other more unique benefits. |
Audiolabyrinth, what is your budget? |
@ mapman,I really do not know eanything about class D amps,If they do sound good and are cheaper,of course I will jump on the band wagon!,can eanybody name brands of class d amps that actually sound good that I can audition?,mapman,thanks for understanding that I do not want an investment to go south because the technology came and went!cheers! |
Minor1,
Have you heard any Class D amps with your Martin Logans?
I have not heard Class D with electrostats. My gut says it does not sound like the most symbiotic pairing, but maybe with the right around it it might work.
I guess my point is that I like to compare what gear is capable of when set up to play to its strengths. I am not a fan of reviews that swap one speaker in for another willy nilly and assess the two based on that, for example. |
Kijanki: You will get no disagreement from me. At present I haven't heard a Class D amp that I really liked much. However, I haven't heard the New Jeff Rowland equipment lately. But, I have always really liked Jeff Rowland equipment anyway. Well designed and definitely well built.
enjoy |
Smaller, lighter, cooler, cheaper and ergo more convenient; those attributes always succeed. |
Lab,
I know what you are saying.
I predict the value proposition of Class D to far exceed that of SACD and that it is a technology that will only grow in application, not shrink.
We'll see....
Cheers! |
Wow , thats heavier than some safety box. But the most important thing is...Does it sounds good? or just looks good? |
@ mapman, I was stateing that class d amplification is another passing fad like sacd was,and that we all have seen good technology come and go like the way of vhs video cassets and etc...,if class d amplification does not catch on, like sacd,dvd-A,etc... did not!thou these technologys were good,they faded away in the dusk!cheers! |
to all those the like class d amps,i say go for it. if and when they prove to be the best sounding of the bunch,then i will look at getting one. in the mean time, im keeping my pass amps and b&k and parasound and odyssey. and my $1,000 jolida tube amp seems to sound very fine also. |
03-18-13: Mitch4t
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"Tim, I love the sound of my Pass amps and I'm in no hurry to change. However, I have no loyalty or sentimental attachment to them. If I hear a set of switching amps that outshine them for less money, I'd change in a heartbeat and never look back. To me, its all about how an amp makes the music sound...and nothing else. For me, the best sounding amp wins, period."
Mitch,
I agree with this approach completely. Even though I'm loving my new class D amp, I wouldn't hesitate to switch to another amp either if I thought it sounded better, no matter the amp type. I'm even considering building a set of kit monoblocs using the Hypex NC400 modules available to DIYers. I would love a set with the NC1200 modules, but they're too expensive incorporated into finished amps and not available to the public as modules.
Tomtab,
As to your question about class D amps handling low impedance speaker loads; I know my SDS440 and the SDS470 CDA amps can handle loads atleast to 2 ohms and possibly even lower. The 440 drives my 87db efficient 4 ohm Magnepan 2.7s to extremely high db levels without clipping or any loss in sound quality(louder levels than I would ever care to listen at). Many other brands of class D amps are low impedance freindly,too (W4S, Merrill, Hypex). But I'm not sure all are.
Mapman,
You make a very good point about the great combination of tubes with class D possibly giving a boost to tube equipment makers and suppliers.
It is ironic that the oldest technology paired with the newest produces great sound at affordable prices. I don't want to see any of the established big name hi-end companies go out of business. I wish them all the best but they'll probably need to either join in or atleast adapt to what I consider the new technological reality.
Thanks,
Tim
|
Lab,
I don't see a relationship between SACD and Class D amps. Joe listener moving to a Class D amp if desired is a piece of cake compared to what a move to SACD involved. Plus there is a potential significant cost/efficiency benefit to moving to Class D. Moving to SACD just meant more cost and marginal value. |
Guido,
I just bought a Class D Audio SDS440SC. But I've been thinking of building a pair of monoblocs from the Hypex NC400 modules or even Abletec modules if they're available. |
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Tim, I love the sound of my Pass amps and I'm in no hurry to change. However, I have no loyalty or sentimental attachment to them. If I hear a set of switching amps that outshine them for less money, I'd change in a heartbeat and never look back. To me, its all about how an amp makes the music sound...and nothing else. For me, the best sounding amp wins, period.
Congrats to you for making the leap to a switching amp. I agree with you that having tubes in the chain could help warm things up. I should be fine in that area if I should go with a switching amp since I have tubes in my preamp, cd player and phono stage.
. |
I would agree. A decent tube pre-amp + Class D amp is a hard combo to beat for overall versatility and good sound.
Maybe the Class D trend will ironically provide a fresh boost for tube based gear as well. That would be ironic. Could be just what high end audio needs though, an effective blend of the best of the old and new that people might actually want in their homes and be able to afford to boot.
450 pound monoblocks are a very cool statement, but is there any doubt the market for 450 pound monoblock amps is limited? |
Hi Noble100, what barand and model is your current class D amp? Guido |
I was hoping for some comments about my 3-17-13 post,I really believe what my previous post said!Happy listening! |
03-17-13: Tomtab
"i was told many years ago in audio that if you bought by weight alone you could never go wrong.i guess im old school."
Tomtab,
I, too, would recommend you use your ears when choosing an amplifier, not heft.
I hope you're not using this old school method when choosing a wife or significant other. Choosing a mate by heft could result in poor choices.
Sorry Tomtab, but I couldn't resist, no offense intended. |
your right charles, when the new class d amps sound better,i will buy one |
Tomtab,
You wrote"I don't care how good they sound" here's where I'd disagree. All that would matter to me is the sound (what else is more important).I believe quality transformers and linear power supplies are crucial and will produce superior sound compared to the newer light weight amplifiers. If I'm proven wrong then that's fine and represents progress(no problem admitting that). I've yet to be persuaded based on what I've heard so far.I prefer lower power simple circuit amplifiers built with premium transformers and very stiff power supplies, this means increased weight. The final verdict is sound quality, which ever technology sounds best is what I'll own.when the light weight amplifiers sound better to me than the traditional approach, I'll happily buy one. |
are the class d amps able to drive difficult loads into say 2 ohms. the big monster amps can put out power into 8,4,2 omps without breaking a sweat. thats what im concerned about. sure, a efficent speaker into 8 ohms,no problem. but what about a speaker at 86db, 4 ohms or less. is a 15 pound amp going to have the stiff power supply to get the job done. my weight alone comment was that you were probably going to get a quality piece of gear if you ended up with a heavy piece. not that the heavest piece was the best. hey,come on. some guys like brawn over finesse. |
"Hey Tim, I think you are right on the money. I believe with a decent amount of money thrown at R&D, the switching amp could be to linear amps what digital cameras did to film cameras."
Mitch,
Excellent analogy.
The R&D funding and progression of class D is happening right now. It started with the I.C.E. modules/amps, moved on to the Hypex modules/amps and the latest is the Abletec technology from Norway and Sweden. D-sonic is supposedly using this latest version in their top of the line monoblocs.
Major trends are probably identified more easily when looking retrospectively. It's much more difficult to distinquish between a major trend, as oppossed to a passing fad, when all of us are in the midst of the fast paced technology changes. My money is on later generations identifying class D as a major trend and paradigm shift in home audio. It's too good to be just a fad.
I recently 'put my money where my mouth is', replacing a 23 yr old Aragon 400 watt class A/B 65lb amp with a Class D Audio 440 watt SDS440CS amp that is 1/3rd the size and weight. My system, for both 2-channel and ht, has never sounded better. This amp has no problem driving my older magnepans and I've never heard them reproduce better bass. I do think, though, that pairing class D with tubes in the chain(preamp,DAC,phono stage, CDP) is important to acheiving the magic. Class D amps seem to be inherently very detailed and neutral, which is perfect for some but I prefer more warmth and dimension.
However, I just took a look at your very nice system. I would completely understand if you're not in a hurry to replace those Pass amps. Maybe you should wait until the next latest and greatest class D incarnations come out.
Thanks,
Tim |
. i was told many years ago in audio that if you bought by weight alone you could never go wrong Tomtab, a lot of people were told the world was flat, tomatoes were poisonous, and the mean old lady that lived in the big old house across the street was a witch....did it ever occur to you that whomever told you to buy amps by weight alone could be wrong? The operative phrase in your post was 'many years ago'. A lot has changed and improved since 'many years ago'. The 21st century is here and it's moving forward with a vengeance. I currently have huge monoblocs in my system, but I'm certainly willing to...and will explore this new switching technology. I have nothing to lose if it doesn't pan out...and a lot to gain if it works out. . |
03-17-13: Tomtab
"i was told many years ago in audio that if you bought by weight alone you could never go wrong.i guess im old school."
Tomtab,
I would recommend using your ears in choosing an amplifier, not heft.
I hope you didn't follow this old school advice by choosing your wife, or significant other, by heft alone.
Sorry,Tomtab, but I couldn't resist. No offense intended. |
It is worth pointing out that not all class D amplifiers run necessarily as cool as cukes...
There is in my opinion the possibility that as design elaboration of amplifiers based on new generation class D technology increases, some future -- and totally hypothetical implementations -- from any number of manufacturers -- may potentially generate fair amounts of heat, and therefore benefit from hefty chassis, fins or other heat dissipation mechanisms.
Even in retrospective, we can find examples of heat generaating class D amplifiers. For example, the withdrawn Rowland Continuum 500 integrated, a 44 Lbs midrange class D design based on the ICEpower 1000ASP module, generates a considerable amount of heat, and runs quite toasty to the touch.... And no, the device has regretably no cooling fins.
In this particular case, I conjecture that two circuit elements in C500 may be major contributors to heat generation... a bunch of bulk output capacitors, and a 1500W PFC-based current rectifier.
As usual, only time will tell what the future brings... Oops, I suspect I just spewed out a repetitively redundant tautology... I meant... Oh well, never mind *sigh!*
G. |
i was told many years ago in audio that if you bought by weight alone you could never go wrong.i guess im old school. my real point is im sure the new class d amps are good in their own right. i myself would rather have a 350 lp pass or 400 lp krell. 15 pounds of amp just dosent sit right wirh me driving $10,000 speakers. and i dont care how good they sound. |
@ Tomtab,good point with your post 3-16-13,I believe class D amps is essentually the same to me as sacd technology,it came,it was good,it went the way as vhs video tapes!gone!,class D amps may be good,I do not doubt that!,I am saying,however,That it may be a passing fad,we all seen alot of technologys over the years that were quite good!,they slowly faded away!cheers! |
.
Hey Tim, I think you are right on the money. I believe with a decent amount of money thrown at R&D, the switching amp could be to linear amps what digital cameras did to film cameras.
Bill, thanks for the explanation.
. |
03-16-13: Tomtab
"I'm betting the 450 lp amps will toast the 15 lp amps' what would you rather have running you speakers, a v12 1000 cubic inch engine with 300 hp or a 4 cylinda 90 cubic inch engine with 300 hp?? think of who would last longer."
Tomtab,
You may be right, the 450lb class A amp might 'toast' the 15lb class D amp, but only if you placed the class D close enough to the class A so that it's within the amp's 'toasting' heat radius.
I'm not understanding why you think most people would prefer a gas/electricity guzzling V12 1,000 cubic inch motor to drive their speakers over a gas/electricity sipping 4 cylinder motor, especially if they both produce the same 300 horsepower.
I knew there would be oppossing opinions to my viewpoint. But, if your statements represent the best reasoning in support of class A,A/B and tube amps, then these old technologies may be in worst shape than I thought.
|
I am very interested to see, over the next 2-10 years, how the established big names in high-end audio react to the already very serious threat that class d amplifiers represent. From my perspective, the writing is on the wall as far as the future direction of high-end technology for power amplification:
1. The current class A, A/B and tube amps are large, heavy, expensive, inefficient(20-55% efficient) devices that emit copious amounts of heat. This 450 lb Boulder monobloc amp may merely be the latest epitome of this group. These amps are probably nearing the end of their life cycle.
2. The current class D amps are small, light, inexpensive or relatively so,highly efficient (approx.90% efficient) devices that emit very low amounts of heat. These amps are at the onset of their life cycle and future improvements are likely.
If you owned a high-end amplifier company, which technology would you stake your future on?
Mapman made a very good point earlier in pointing out that the leaders in class D will probably be newer, less established companies. There are a few amp manufacturers, like Rowland, Rogue and ARC for example, that have read the writing on the wall and have begun offering class D amps of their own recently. I would not be suprised if a few others venture into class D,too.
But, as we all know, in the end it will come down to which ones sound the best. I'm going to refrain from commenting on this since we will all be voting on this soon enough with our ears and our wallets. But I will say that it looks like the class D train is just pulling away from the station.
Just my 2 cents.
Thanks,
Tim |
That's great news! Now all that's missing is some ineffecient multi driver speakers with wicked phase angles to make things complete. |
im betting the 450 lp amps will toast the 15 lp amps' what would you rather have running you speakers, a v12 1000 cubic inch engine with 300 hp or a 4 cylinda 90 cubic inch engine with 300 hp?? think of who would last longer |
Mitch4T, the short answer is that M725 and M625 produce a not inconsiderable amount of heat.... Yes, I have M725 in my system, and M625 runs even a little hotter than M725. And yes, their interiors are relatively crowded, particularly M625 stereo... Just do not ask me what they look inside.... I am blind and do not enjoy rooting inside chassis and zapping myself by fondling undischarged capacitors.
While M725 contain some interesting technical solutions, like 4-pole capacitors for post rectification current smoothing, and ceramic boards, it will be fascinating to assess how these, and other relatively traditional designs, will stack up against the upcoming stream of new generation class D amps, regardless of weight, heat dissipation, inside crowdedness, or... cooling fins inventiveness.
After all, like Igor Stravinsky said.... We judge a tree by its fruits, not by its roots.
G. |
