Walking Into A Brick & Mortar High End Audio Store

To echo Charyo's remark, I think we all owe each other a little respect. I come on this forum, either to get information, or to provide it when I can. I'm not a PC type person, but I was the one who called out CZ on his remark, and from what I gather, he didn't intend to be mean-spirited. Frankly, although I'm jewish, I'm not a very religious jew, and am not unduly sensitive to a good joke, which often pokes fun at stereotypes. But, having said that, my concern was perpetuating a stereotype that is offensive. Macro- I'm not sure there is a legacy of prejudice against well diggers, so the analogy doesn't work, but as I said when I first brought it up, let people say what they will; I'm certainly not into censorship or making people toe the line in terms of PC sensibilities (or whatever you want to call it).
I have no interest in perpetuating this aspect of the thread; I made my contributions to it in substance on the issues of dealers and courtesy. I also think that public statements can be tricky, which is why I usually try to keep it light. If CZ meant no harm, I'll take him at his word. But word do have consequences, as we see everyday in the media.
Not trying to play gotcha here, but since I was the one that raised the issue with CZ's remarks first, I thought it fair to give you my perspective. No snark intended.

Just a follow up to a statement made earlier. In my opinion and experience, everything is negotiable. If you allow salespeople to convince you otherwise, then you have fallen for the trap. Cars, home appliances, clothes, watches, expensive audio equipment, etc. The prices are limited somewhat by what the manufacturer allows dealers to sell their items for, but, there is some float on most things. Especially demonstration equipment. Anyone that walks into a car dealership beliving that the invoice price is what the car really sells for or worse, is what the dealer actually paid for the car (or leased), didn't do their homework. In my experience, once you have established a good relationship with a dealer, and they know you are serious about a potential purchase, they will deal with you on price. Again, they can't give it away, but they can negotiate. I tried to teach my Daughter to always ask for a least a 10% discount on most things. Most stores can actually give such discounts if requested. Also, with respect to the name calling and sensibilities regarding phrases and words here, lets just slow down, calm down and think a little. Everyone is not the same. Some people have very thick skins (can take a lot before becoming offended) and some have very thin skins and have low tolerance. Some people have never experienced prejudice or hatred in any form and others have. That said, there are reasons why some people are insensitive to certain phrases and some are vey sensitive to them. Both may be very good people. However, if someone tells you that a word or phrase you are using is offensive to them. Stop trying to convince them otherwise and listen to them. It offended or hurt them. period. Stop using that phrase around them. They have their reasons why it offends them. Respect that. A person's right to smoke ends at my nose. A person's right to rediculously loud music ends at my ears. people can talk about women and certain aspects of women's bodies until the cows come home. However, the moment a woman hears that and is offended, maybe that person should take a step back and realize that just maybe it was offensive and you are in the wrong. Almost every company has harrassment, discrimination and sensitivity training for a reason. In my company, we have to take this very long course every year, and you know what? That is a good thing. Stop trying to explain yourself and why you are sticking with a certain aspect of your character. If someone is offended, leave it at that and stop. I'm offended when a dealer looks me up and down as if I'm not worthy and doesn't give me the time of day. Sometimes it is funny, sometimes it hurts and sometimes it is just sad. I also realize that money is the same color (in America), and my money is just a good as the next person's, and if they don't realize that they are going to lose out on a potentially large sale because of their rudeness, insensitivity, lazyness, lack of respect, lack of consideration, ignorance, or maybe, just maybe, they don't like my race, color, religion, etc. Then you know what? They can go pound sand. I can go elsewhere. But, fortunately, this is not so much in the open anymore. I've also found over the many years that how I initially treat and address some people determines how they will treat me. So some times, it starts with me. Get pulled over by a policeman. You can be angry and obnoxious to them or place your hands on the steering wheel in plain site and stay calm and quiet. you will get a totally different reaction most of the time. So, please don't expect everyone to belive in what you believe in. Don't expect everyone to look like you, talk like you, live like you and especially, like the same equipment (tubes vs solid state), or same type of music. I'm older and come to expect a degree of courtesy. If I don't get that or if a saleperson is rude, etc. I can walk out (which I typically will do) or/and write a letter which really does have an impact on most companies. But, sooner or later your choice to not do business with that store will be cumlative and will have a very negative impact on that store. The problem is, they will not know why their sales are failing or why they are going out of business. But, enough letters will help document the problem that they can refer to and hopefully fix before it is too late for them. Many high end manufacturers don't allow their products to be sold on the internet. Some are coming around to that potentially large consumer market. However, if they do, they do not want to put their brick and mortar dealers out of business and therefore, they are very strick on internet and B&M prices. Also, if one wants to buy new on line, you really need to be very careful because it may be grey market and not come with manufacturer's warranty.

So, please, enjoy

Whart,Bill .You are a true gentlemen Have you gone west? Looking forward to meeting you one day.

Minorl,
I completely agree, but insult with no ground has no excuse(and it actually delivers a pain as per above mentioned not neccessarily physical) unless it comes from one with either mental birth defects or low-life with chicken IQ that needs no audible or visual attention.
Realizing and identifying categories mentioned above is good weapon to cease the insult.
After mentioning a few times about my GOOD intentions same people didn't understand and continued to sink in their dogmas delivering insults... Therefore I made a proper conclusion about their lack of normal functional IQ and comprehensive attention and let them be how they like to be.

Czarivey, your first remark was ill considered, you're follow-up comments about people's intelligence strikes me as immature. If you continue in that vein I can only conclude that you're not a gentleman.