Phono Stage upgrade to complement Dohmann Helix One Mk 2


Thanks to the recommendations from many users on this Audiogon blog, I think I was able to make a more informed purchase of a turntable, the Dohmann Helix One Mk 2.  I've really been enjoying the turntable for the past month!  

The next phase of my system now needs attention:  the phono stage.  Currently, I'm using a Manley Steelhead v2 running into an Ypsilon PST-100 Mk2 SE pre-amplifier (into Ypsilon Hyperion monoblocks, into Sound Lab M745PX electrostatic speakers). 

I've been told that I could really improve my system by upgrading the phono stage from the Manley Steelhead (although I've also been told that the Manley Steelhead is one of the best phono stages ever made).  
Interestingly, two of the top phono stages that I'm considering require a step-up transformer (SUT).  I'm not fully informed about any inherent advantages or disadvantages of using an SUT versus connecting directly to the phono stage itself.  

I suppose my current top two considerations for a phono stage are the Ypsilon VPS-100 and the EM/IA  LR Phono Corrector, both of which utilize an SUT.  I don't have a particular price range, but I find it hard to spend $100k on stereo components, so I'm probably looking in the $15k - $70k price range. 
Thanks. 

drbond

@drbond , The Hi Fi News Analog Test Record. You will know when you hit the resonance frequency because the tone will warble. You might even see the tonearm shake.

Off topic a bit. I have been using ESLs since 1979. I now have 8 foot 645's. Roger West calls them 645-8s. ESLs HATE making bass. They will do it in a very lumpy fashion but it adds significant distortion to everything else. You get away with it only if you listen to less aggressive music at lower volumes, less than 80 dB. However Pink Floyd at 95 dB, forget it. You really need to get 4 subwoofers. It is a PITA and you have to make some other changes but I would NEVER use ESLs without them. It is like putting turbos in a 911. 

Back on topic. You really need to look into the Channel D Seta L 20 Phono stage. It is an insane piece of gear. It has the lowest signal to noise ratio of any phono stage on the market, a lot lower. It will run any cartridge made in either Voltage, Current or MM mode. It will use digital RIAA correction and you can record anyones special records to a hard drive in 24/192. Everyone I have run an AB between the vinyl and it's recording can not tell the difference. I have The Seta L Plus the L20's little brother. Just because I am running very low impedance cartridges in current mode, it is the best sounding phono stage I have ever heard in my system. The L20 is 12 dB quieter!! That is just a stunning figure. I have trouble running the MC diamond running into noticeable noise at higher volumes. I hope to get myself an L20 in the future. Channel D will give you 80% of the price on trade in. The L20 is $50,000. My problem is getting it by the wife. I will have to give her a detached garage, new windows and a new paver driveway first. My Atma-Sphere MA2 amplifiers cost me a hot tub with landscaping. Being married is very expensive. Being alone is worse. 

 

From Channel d website:

Seta L20 mk2 MSRP $63,000.00 / Factory direct price $42,000.00

@mijostyn those new windows for the wife are now almost free! 😉

@mijostyn 

Just to clarify:  the LP test record has a track with various frequencies, and when the frequency that is played causes the stylus warble, that's the resonance frequency?  (and each change in frequency is annoted on the LP?)

I personally only listen to acoustic/classical/jazz music, and the bass provided by the SoundLabs is just perfectly realistic:  just enough vibration from the tympani, double bass, etc.  (I also prefer a naturally aspirated 911 to a turbo!)

Yes, as you know I purchased the CH Precision P1/X1.  Just out of curiosity, it would be interesting to compare the CH Precision to the Channel D, but I don't know that it would be any better.  Once you get your new driveway and Channel D, let me know, and we'll have to find a way to compare them!  

 

Mijo wrote, "A given cartridge is going to require an arm of a given effective mass." My only point was and is that the cartridge and the mounting hardware ARE part of the effective mass of a functioning tonearm, their mass must be included if you use the equation for resonant frequency.  An atypically heavy cartridge, like some of the Benz cartridges and others, can add ~10g and more to effective mass, turn the 17g Schroeder into a 27g effective mass, because of course the mass of the cartridge is directly on top of the cantilever/stylus. (That's assuming that Schroeder makes no allowance for the cartridge weight when they state the EM of the CB tonearm at 17g.)

@lewm , quite correct. You have to factor in the weight of the cartridge. The single best way to do that is by measurement. If the resonance frequency is off, too high, mass can always be added. This is the advantage of having an arm on the light side. It is much harder to remove mass from a heavy arm. The Schroder arms have cartridge mounting plates of three masses and counterweights of three sizes. They can be adjusted for just about any cartridge. 

@drbond, the CH is a fine phono stage. It is not the Channel D Seta L20. I have a naturally aspirated 911, a Speed Yellow C4S.  You only drive around at 40 mph. I prefer 100 mph. Above that in New Hampshire is classified as reckless driving which takes speeding to a whole other level legally. You would still benefit from a proper subwoofer array, just not as much as someone who listens to Metallica at 100 dB. It is not just the added bass but the lower distortion everywhere else. Any bass note in a full range speaker is going to Doppler distort everything else the driver is trying to reproduce. If you can see the diaphragm moving it is Doppler distorting all other frequencies. I have observed naked ESRs on numerous occasions. You can see diaphragm excursions up to about 100 Hz. Which is where I cross over to subs. Even at 100 dB you can not see my diaphragms move. The difference in sound quality is exceptional. 

Where do you live?