New PrimaLuna versus used Audio Research preamp?


As posted previously, I'm shopping tube preamps.

Have an opportunity to buy a friend's ARC Reference 5SE, as he upgraded to a new 6SE.

Alternatively, a new PL EVO 300 or 400 is also on my radar, and even new would cost 20% to 30% less than the used 5SE.

Anyone here experience both units and brands?

Thanks!

bobbydd

Big Greg the PL will not lose that much value especially buying used.  I sold a PL Dialogue Premium integrated a few years ago for not much less than I paid for it new. Currently I have a EVO 400 preamp and it's been a joy so far. One of the best things about it I can roll tubes to change the flavor somewhat which is something ARC can't do with the 6H30 based models.  A dealer did tell me and take it for what it's worth,  several of his customers were trading in their Ref series preamps for the EVO series. How high up the Ref chain I do not know but I'm guessing Ref 5SE and down.  

@samzx12 It looked like the OP was weighing a used ARC vs. new PL.  That's great you got most of your investment back when you sold your PL.  Typically, you're lucky to get 50-60% of new price on most items.  I think Primaluna has a lot going for them.  I prefer the looks, sound, and build of the ARC.  Others might like the PL better for the same reasons.

You need to look in the box when you buy a preamp.  It's where manufacturers make margin, and bullshit abounds.  Go to a restaurant, and it's $9 for a burger and fries, and $3.50 for a Diet Coke.  Coke is water and syrup. 

Preamps are the Diet Coke of audio. Take a company that flags itself as the "Preamp Specialist"  Put aside the silly auto biasing tubes and new power supply designs, look at an internal picture of their $4500 preamp which, by the way, is a "Factory Direct" price.  

There are no magic boxes in preamps.  It's parts and engineering.  If they espouse the "minimalist design" B.S. then it should cost less, not more.  That's why someone may want to be a "preamp specialist". 

More like "margin specialist".  Just like headphones and earbuds.   

I wouldn't buy a preamp without using Google Images or that website hifi-inside.com  It used to be called HiFi-shock.com as I recall.  

@samzx12 Your preamp has the Holy Trinity of tube preamp design:  Point to point wiring. Dual Mono all the way to the power switch. Tube rectification.  

 

 

@big_greg.  Definitely agree most components lose a lot of value buying new. That's why I typically buy used.  

 

Kevin the build quality and many fantastic reviews is the main reason I bought the EVO 400. Plus the fact switching tubes I can tailor the sound to my liking which is very important to me. 

@bobbydd 

First, go and listen to each preamp. With what amp are you pairing it?

Second, what sound signature are you wanting? Warmth, dynamics, resolution, soundstage, clarity, richness, etc.

Third, in my experience with PL gear, including the evo preamps the OP listed, produce boring sound. It's neither tube-ish nor solid state. It doesn't have the warmth of say a VAC pre nor the dynamics of a VTL 6.5 (highly recommended) or the ARC 5se. The ARC does not have the warmth of a VAC either.

Fourth, though there are many Kevin Deal fanboys, there are as many who consider him less than a desirable salesman. There are plenty of good and bad service reviews of upscale. There are plenty of other dealers and products that service and sell their products without the uncertainty of Kevin/upscale. I would suggest looking at VAC, VTL, and Ayre (the latter, if you're willing to try solid state). These companies don't change models nearly as frequently as ARC. That said, the 5se is excellent and its resale value will continue to be excellent. PL does not boast such high resale value.

Finally, PL products do not, imo, alter their sound signature by tube rolling. Very few new tube products offer much benefit by tube rolling other than micro differences. If tube rolling is of interest, Decware's products experience notable changes.

Goodluck in your search.