New Coincident Frankenstein 300B Stereo Version

@sns

Ha, Jut dawned on me that you own the Coicident Turbo 845 SET integrated amplifier. 😀 Do you use it strictly as an integrated amp or as a power amp paired with the CSL?

Charles

@charles1dad Only as power amp with CSL. Using passive/volume control on 845 substantially inferior to CSL, even inferior to my relatively cheapo Schitt Saga+ passive. I see integrated feature as add on, temp solution for those without pre.

. I'd bet the 845 would be very nice match with all Coincident speakers, plenty of drive along with the SET magic. 845 not quite the magic of 300B tube, but authority, impact, drive and enough of the 300B magic to be quite enticing. The 845 preferable to my 300B amps with my Merlin VSM MM 91db sens., easy impedance curve. 300B preferable with my 104db sens. Klipschorns.

A little observation on bass:

This appears to be a unique US phenomenon that good bass is almost always equated to "tight" or "super-duper tight" (aka overdampened) bass.

While we can observe overdampened bass in real life in recording studios, or at venues where the instruments (mainly drums) overload the room acoustics.

The exact opposite is the overly loose bass: just like what you get in a concert hall when you sit at the end of the row close to the exit. Still, it's realistic, but I have not heard of many people standing in line for those seats & that experience....

Yet, while listening to bass at venues with good acoustics at good places, bass is not overly tight - it's just right. A good SET can deliver that, the bass that has a good likeness of both texture in the bass and the right tightness. Overly tight bass representations bleed out the texture of the bass.

Push-pull implementations have bass tighter, with bland bass texture. (=More apparent power, less refined skill/technique.)

Single ended implementations have bass looser, with better bass texture.

Good implementations of each have less issues, and get closer to a fine balance.

It's up to your preferences from which side you want to approach bass - is tightness or texture your #1 goal?

@realworldaudio

Yet, while listening to bass at venues with good acoustics at good places, bass is not overly tight - it’s just right. A good SET can deliver that, the bass that has a good likeness of both texture in the bass and the right tightness. Overly tight bass representations bleed out the texture of the bass.

You are my brother from another mother. 😊

I have been making this point seemingly forever. I have been attending live (Usually smaller/intimate) jazz clubs for 30 years. Often they don’t even bother with microphones on the stage as they’re not necessary. You are hearing pure untampered with acoustic instruments. And you know what? Those upright beautiful wooden bass instruments are not tight!

Certainly not in the overdamped,dry artificial sense that some audiophiles seem to demand. What they are is very full bodied with undeniable warmth, plenty of texture and a natural present bloom. The sound is not slow, flabby or bloated either. There is control but tight and overdamped is no where to be found when playing without the mic.

Now in those circumstances where the acoustic bass is played with an attached microphone through the club’s electronic sound system, all bets are off.

I have had various solid-state amplifiers and a couple of very good PP tube amplifiers. In terms of presenting what sounds like the most authentic acoustic bass, and all other instruments for that matter my 8 watt SET comes closer to that live acoustic vibe than any of the other amplifiers.

It isn’t flawless and speaker choice is critical. But what it excels at just happens to be what matters most to me. Naturalness, realism and emotional/musical connection.

Charles

@Charles- I completely agree with your last point from a purely theoretical standpoint.  I live 10 minutes from Coincident, and have likely owned more models of Coincident speakers over the past 20 years then most on this forum.  One of the best previous combos was a 14-watt SET 211 amp and Air Tight ATC-2 preamp on Total Victories, so am with you on the inherent quality of SET bass.

 **However, when I was last at Israel’s place a couple months back, I was quite blown away by the impact of the double PRE with Franks on top and Parasound A21+ driving all 4 woofers (double bass cabinets as well).  The naturalness on the mids/highs combined with the massive impact on the bass was really something, and the bass didn’t seem ‘overdone’ either…