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Turntable upgrade advice

I've requested advice on where to upgrade my system before but have decided the biggest improvement would be in improving either my speakers or turntable or both.

Current system is:

LSA 1 Statement monitors

Rhythmik E15HP subs x 2

Clearaudio Concept w/ Concept MC cart

NuPrime DAC10 as preamp and DAC

Eastern Electric Minimax phono pre w/ NOS tubes

Emerald Physics 100.2SE power amp

Clearday Double Shotgun speaker cables

Audio Art IC3SE interconnects


The plan is to keep the Concept MC cart but sell the turntable. I really don't want to go above $3000 and would prefer to buy from a dealer whether it be online or brick and mortar. I'd prefer a deck w/ an arm as I've really only done plug and play solutions up to this point. Some current options would be:

Nottingham Space Deck 294 w/ Nottingham arm (recent production trade-in to dealer) - heard good things about the table but many comments about how the arm isn't as good. All the recommendations are for arms in the $2000 plus range. I can demo this at a dealer, so that's a big plus. However, not any recent reviews. The dealer also carries Michelle and Well-Tempered, would love to her the Gyrodec SE and the Amadeus GTA though both of these would be out of my price range new.

Pro-Ject RPM 10.1 or 10 Carbon (demo or pre-owned) - seem to come up frequently at online retailers. Seem to go in the $2000 range and reviews are very positive.

VPI Prime (demo or pre-owned) - the price hike bothered me but the demo prices are significantly lower and demo models seem commonly available. The reviews of this table are insanely positive across the board, not sure whether to take them with a grain of salt.

Gem Dandy Super12 Polytable - $3000 new by George Merrill. If I had the money I'd probably get a REAL and I've never seen the Super12 come up used. No official reviews of the Super12 version yet. The reviews of the standard polytable mention beautiful soundstaging and midrange but say that the low end is a little lacking which is a concern for me. I would hope that the Super12 would fix that.

Clearaudio Performance DC w/ Clarify or Satisfy arm - (used) This would be the most obvious choice as an upgrade from the Concept, better deck and better arm. Also, the used price is easier on the wallet. However, I read a reviewer that reviewed each one after the other and preferred the VPI Prime. Also wonder how much of an improvement I'd really get moving up one deck in the line. Floor vibrations are not a problem in my room, concrete floors so not concerned w/ that aspect of the tonearm. The cart should be a perfect fit as well.

Avid Diva II SP - Reviews seem to suggest that to get the most out of this deck you need a higher end arm. Also you don't get many offered used by dealers.



Ok, so that's my list. Please keep reco's to those tables on the list whether good or bad. Any opinions?




joegator81
inna
7,135 posts
 
Yes, get the mat while you can. If, and it is highly unlikely, you don't like it there should be no problem of selling it. The mat tightened things up, increased clarity and balance.
I do not use any clamp, never felt the need to try. As for maple, I am not sure what he meant. I have the table on a 3" maple block which in turn sits on three big Boston Audio tuneblocks, and all that is on the wooden floor close to the left speaker. My rack is not good enough for the table. Nothing is dull, but I only compared to the Nottingham MDF platform and the maple was better and heavier, more stable. I wouldn't jump near the table but I walk near it without thinking. You don't want to push that block, though, because it sits on three metal balls. But since the maple block is quite heavy and so is the table, it is stable enough for me, but still you should be careful around it. I know that some people use Symposium platforms under Nottinghams and like it a lot. I might try it in the future but for now I just have this $75 maple block that I got on ebay.
inna
7,135 posts
 
He probably meant not to put the table on a thick maple platform and then on the rack. That would be different from my set-up, so he can be right, it can also give some ringing.
By the way, I have Boston Audio tuneblocks for speakers under my spiked speakers and yet another set under my Nakamichi cassette deck. One more thing you could try after everything else is set is to get Walker Audio SMALL resonance control disc, $50, and put it very close to the motor on the shelf or whetever your tables sits on, not touching anything. This made a subtle but audible improvement in my sytem. And I put another one on top of my deck - same effect.
joegator81 OP
108 posts
 
I picked up a Boston audio mat 1 off eBay for about $45 less than what the 1 remaining dealer is selling them for new. 

Im a skeptic with tweaks, apart from proper vibration isolation. The first record I played showed obvious improvement in micro detail and that continued with every record I played. Space between instruments improved and the stage was more stable and assured. Why is that? There was an obvious decrease in low end bloat that was fairly subtle but easily masking details through the audio band and meshing everything into a blur instead of clearly separated instruments forming a greater whole. 

On Dean Peers Airborne there are delayed bass lines that echo outside of the speakers. These were so much more detailed and easily heard. 

Alice In Chains unplugged, you can hear the individual strings within the chord so much more clearly where before it sounded like the bass on the acoustic guitar amp was turned up over the treble. The bass guitar lines are cleaner and the second acoustic guitar on the left side of the stage stands out much more easily after joining in on the song nutshell. 

On yello's 30000 days from Toy, there was an obvious reduction in low end bloat. This a bass heavy track and the spoken word vocals are very rich. All of this is cleaned up with sacrificing extension. 

Best of all, the essential tone of the table, arm, and cart remained the same but the detail has been greatly enhanced. I will never use the original foam mat again. 

Just let me say that before adding the mat1 I wasn't convinced there was that much improvement to be had via tweeks. I was wrong.
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