Zu Omen or Tekton Lore

Yes, I know what you are trying to say Charlie. I am just trying to give you some facts and insights. If it's not enough for you, then so be it we are all unique in what we perceive as high end sound. If it were me, I would try some different scenrios in the room and on the front end. Not sure why anybody would sit there and just not be happy ... ?

But as far as chasing nirvana, remember I have downsized from a $13K+ rig at one point. This is all for fun and to get some reviews on a speaker that some may be more reluctant to try since it is a little more expensive. It is also a better fit for my room. Stay tuned!

well some of us just simply buy Erics new speaker when he introduces a new one . I really don't think you know what I mean when I state I am not happy with the low end but that is ok . Good luck with the new speakers and chasing nirvana!

Oh and Charlie, I agree... it is all about the sound qaulity, but I would be careful in "trusting" the ears when it comes to hearing specific frequencies. This is where measurments are MUCH MORE accurate (assuming the measurment is done correctly). My ears can believe I am hearing 30Hz, when it is really 50 if you know what I mean.

It sounds like you are a guy that really likes slam and dynamics. If so, then unless you are in a smallish room, you will surely benefit from another driver. Bass authority is done best with a dedicated bass driver. With that said, the Lore is FANTASTIC consider that driver is doing 30Hz - 3KHz. Simply astonishing... now imagine what it will do when it's crossed over to a dedicated mid? That's where the Pendragon comes into play! Lore on sterioids!!!

I know what you mean - the Lores are a very clean bass and not designed to have artificial "fullness." I've owned many speakers that sounded more "weighty", but few have matched the articulation/accuracy of the Lore's bass.

I think you would be a good candidate for the new speaker - Eric is telling me that the weight and bass is just incredible. I believe it, and it better be for a 54" tall speaker with 2! 10" drivers. He is selling it for $2K as the introductory price. But I know that's not cheap to most of us, yet it is very reasonable when compared to the speakers out there that sell in that range - at least for now on paper anyway. Time will tell...

Let me know what amp/integrated you decide to go with. I still believe you haven't really heard the Lores yet. Good to hear from you C...

I have seen the measurements and they are just that , measurements . Meaurements that are posted on Tekton website , beleive what you want ,I'll beleive my ears .
How much are the new speakers?
No I am still looking for a new amp/preamp or intergrated .

I absolutely dig the Lores! This is an upgrade. My room is a bit on the large side so I should benefit from the 2nd 10" driver and the 3 tweeter array. From what Eric is telling me, the Pendragon (the name of the new Lore-based speaker), is going to have similar voicing/sonic character as the Lore, but with allot more impact/dynamics, and better clarity since 1 driver doesn't have to fo all the work. It also extends down to 20HZ!!!

By the way Charlie - check out the Tekton blog, and you will see measurements of the Lore. It clearly extends down to 30Hz, so this is proof that the perception of lack of weight is definitely based on some bias or room node. I was shocked by the measurements! But I am sure the new Pendragon will certainly have all the weight and then some. Stay tune for my review in a month or so!!

P.S. Have you dumped or updraded that Hafler/Counterpoint combo yet???

Gpowered,, why are you getting new speakers ,I thought you found nirvana with the Lores?

He said about 3 weeks, so figure about 4-5 tops. Pretty neat process though - he's actually having me measure my avg. ear height in my listening chair and he's going to make the tweeter cutouts to match that height. Also, my pair will be front ported, as that's what I prefer and Eric wanted to do the production version that way anyway. I like to feel the pressure in the room, plus front ports are much easier and more forgiving when it comes to placement.

I am really enjoying buying speakers from Eric. Where else can you go and spend "sane" $ and have somone build a custom speaker to YOUR liking. Great stuff!!

That is awesome! When do you think you will receive them?

Hey guys. I ordered my new MTM T3 Lore-based speaker tonigh so in due time we will have some feedback on the new model!!

They are indeed fanatastic speakers - punch WAY above their weight class. It does everything minus the weight and low end/extension of much larger speakers, yet it holds its own. Most of us are using low powered tubes with these. Put a decent and well matching front end on them in a small to medium sized room, and they have the potential to be the last speaker you buy... but if you crave 20Hz bass or have a huge room... you may want to look at the new Lore-based speaker.

no , they are not special speakers ,, nice but not special.

And does anyone think the Tektons would be OK on the long wall of a 22x14 foot room, with me about 8 feet from the speakers and the back of the speakers about 1.5-2 feet from the wall behind them? Amp is an Edge NL12.1 (300 wpc).
Thanks.

I wonder why this thread is so long. Are these very special speakers?

finally haha.. now to decide between white and red... what do you guys think?

the new lores look crazy... who's planning on getting them?

Thank you guys!!!

Gpowered,

Not sure if you found it but under his post it has a link for reviews. Just click that

Took me a minut to find it also. It' not in the product reviews section. It's in this sub section.

Also new pics of the lore in red and white. Also an unamed new design on the blog

http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?rspkr&1306118085

http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?rspkr&1306118085&read

Paul- can you tell me what you listed it under? I don't see Tekton as a choice... perhaps you just made it and it hasn't shown up yet??

FYI - I posted a Lore review (in the reviews section).

Irish - the thread is called Zu Omen v Tekton Lore.

We had been waiting for someone to compare the 2, and finally soneone did!

Now I am sure ZU speakers are excellent compared to most conventional speakers in their price range (though not really apples to apples), but the truth here, was that 3 men - one of which has a pair of Wilson's, hence high expectations - unanimously decided that Omen was no competition for Lore. 3 MEN!!! with NO bias toward either brand. In fact, one of them owns Omens and was seriously disturbed when he realized he would now have to place an A'gon ad as a result of this conclusion!

One of claimed he become agitated by the one notey bass

The other is selling his Omens now

The other just didn't think it was close

So my suggestion to you - stop posting here and go build a better $1K speaker! Is that not what it's all about??? Someone else has raised the bar.

And I wish you many blessings from above in doing so - you are up against talented competition.

Hint: you may have to cut your OH and/or marketing expenses

Hello UL - Don't want to make your own, eh? (Referencing the other forum). I was going to post over there but the DIY guys really took the thread over.
I have the Lores about 6 - 7 feet from my head and I think they sound great at that distance. I'd try 4' but I'd have to rearrange, move them closer together, etc. so I'd rather not. 4' might be a little close but I personally think they would do fine, especially because of the full range design.
As I've said before in this thread and elsewhere, I think these are a real bargain. I know your original budget was a bit higher than their price, but don't be mislead by that. And there is a return policy so worth a try.
Hope this helps.

Quick query: Anyone tried the Lores from a 4 feet listening distance? Wondering how they will do at a nearfield listening distance.

Thanks,
UL

Well, I for one think Zu is just fantastic, being on
my personal 3rd pair I cannot say I have ever been
happier with a single company's speaker. Right now
I am listening to Cassandra Wilson from another room
at pretty loud volume, and it sounds like she is really
in there, just awesome. And that's on 15 minute new
speaker cables! I found the right match there synergy
wise for sure.

Having said that, I have a semi local guy above in this thread who wants to bring over a Pair of the Tekton Lores
so we can hear both. And, I am contemplating a purchase
of one of Tektons speakers for the heck of it, although
at this point...I really don't see the point as my feeling
is they will be more alike than not. But who knows, we'll
see what the Lores do if we get together.

To be fair though, I have the Omen Defs, which were a huge
jump from my standard Omens, so I'm sure certain areas
of comparison would not be fair. Lores should go
head to head probably with the standard Omens.

Long live Zu and Tekton!!

Well said Simon.

Since Audiogon is an audiophile’s forum I don’t intend to get involved in using it as a conversational tool with other manufacturers.

I also can only speak of what I know, which is Zu, not the products of other manufacturers. If there was an implication in my post that another manufacturer’s loudspeaker produces more distortion than ours, that certainly wasn’t intentional – does it really come across in that way? (I don’t think it does).

The idea of a golden-eared reviewer being enticed to do any one-on-one shoot-out is fanciful and pointless – what matters is what customers think, not reviewers. Last time I checked, reviewers had a pulse, which is to say they’re human and possessed of the same subjective sensibilities as the rest of us – so just because a reviewer might like something doesn’t mean someone else doesn’t, and vice versa.

We don’t design our loudspeakers to look good in measurement tests – we design them to sound great playing music. More than a few times I’ve come across people who say that a fantastic live gig is nothing to do with measurements and all to do with dynamics. That sense of ‘live’ is what we strive to achieve with Zu – more than enough people think we do it very well and that makes us happy, because they’re happy.

We offer a 60 day money-back trial for anyone wanting to hear Zu in their own home, playing their music. If they love it, great, if they don’t, that’s fine. What matters is, they’ve tried us out.

That’s the only shoot-out that matters.

Sincerely

Simon

I'm actually not a fan of the adversarial direction this is going. Not that I'm opposed to comparisons, and I have definitely contributed my own observations. I guess I just don't like the idea of the manufacturers getting into a verbal arms race. Does that kind of controversy help either/any of them?

Zu will likely not accept this challenge wishful thinking guys...

Hahahaha.....I agree Devil Boy.....can't wait to hear more:)

B.J. - Great post. Got anything more to contribute?

1985 Bose vs. polk all over again. Both great for the money but have much to be desired. It's a pleasure to listen but a hobby to pick them apart.

Woohoo!! Why doesn't this kind of stuff happen more often??? I agree with what Z man said.

Let the games begin.

Simon,

One of my clients just forwarded to me your Audiogon post.

I suggest that we arrange a very cordial loudspeaker shootout between the two competing products. I personally agree to let my product be compared and compete with yours on every conceivable area and angle in the realm of acoustical physics - this includes accurate testing and detailed measurements (this further includes your claim of my loudspeaker producing more distortion than your product).

Simon, please provide me with the date and time you would like the event to occur. Please schedule an official unbiased (and well known) industry audio reviewer we can both agree on and I will be there with a set of my loudspeakers.

Sincerely,

Eric Alexander
President
Tekton Design, LLC

I enjoy reading posts on this forum but have only posted a handful of times. When I saw a steady stream of negative comments about Zu by one poster in particular, I was anxious to get Zu's side of the story. I alerted them to this thread and here is their reply.

Disclaimer: I own Soul Superfly speakers.

There seem to be a few misconceptions revealed in this thread, so here are some facts to stabilize the banter:

1. FOR THE RECORD

If there’s any notable inspiration behind our loudspeakers it’s Henry Olsen whose 1934 design for RCA set the template for full range driver loudspeakers of high efficiency.

2. ABOUT OUR FULL RANGE DRIVER. It’s made by Zu AND Eminence, with a few parts coming from other suppliers. It has many things finished by Eminence: the voice coil, the charging of the magnet, the riveting of the yoke / magnet / frame assembly, lay-up of the primary cone, the former assembly. Zu adds its own features to the platform by using modern materials to gain improvements to bandwidth, power handling, power transfer, etc. A quick check to measure the Thiele/Small electromechanical parameters, or even the weight of the driver will suffice to prove our Zu driver is not an Eminence B-102, which does use the same cone profile, voice coil diameter and frame.

Zu does much of the final assembly in-house; driver frame finish, phase plug assembly lay-up final cone processing and driver lay-up, final QC, batching, matching and burn-in. it’s a hands-on process that includes the hand removal of the center dust cap using an Xacto knife.

4. ABOUT OUR TWEETER. One forum posting quotes an ‘inverted tweeter”! We’re sorry to disappoint but there is nothing inverted here. We use the Eminence APT tweeter driver.

5. INCIDENTAL POINTS

We don’t mind that the Lore weighs more than the Omen.

Phase accuracy in a bass-reflex loudspeaker is phase accurate noise – if that’s important to you, no problem.

Any more info required, just ask us – we enjoy a good chat.

Cheers

Simon Matanle
Sales & Marketing Director
Zu Audio
simon@zuaudio.com

Hi Genjamon, in fact I did connect the Lore’s to the Primaluna Dialogue Two after posting my last remarks. I wanted to compare the Tekton Lore with the Daber Audio Monitor 3 speakers using the Primaluna Amp.

Overall the Daber Audio Monitor 3 is a better speaker. It presents clearer detail in mid’s and high’s. And the bass is controlled and balanced. Its presentation is more forward and engaging than the Lore’s. It also plays better at lower volume due to stronger bass.

There are times I want a speaker to be laid back. I believe the Lore’s are very good for this. Its mid’s and high’s are presented somewhat equally with the bass in the background.

When I connected the Lore’s to the Primaluna amp the mid’s and high’s are clear, just not as good as the Daber Audio Monitor 3.

The bass with the Lore’s, although good, sounds a little lean. Bass isn’t strong enough at low volume to my liking or for certain types of music, such as rock. One advantage I have with the Primaluna Amp is I have a Pioneer GR-777 Equalizer connected to it. So I chose “heavy” to boost the bass. This improved the overall sound at low volume. The Lore speakers sounded better. With jazz and vocals stronger bass isn’t always preferred by me, so I can fine-tune the sound of the Equalizer or turn it off completely.

Its obvious to me the Lore’s are perfectly capable of playing decent bass. It all comes down to matching the speakers to your equipment. There is just so much tube swapping you can do to a tube amp to get the “right” sound to your taste or to match equipment. That’s why I bought the Equalizer. I wish tube manufacturers would put more emphasis installing defeat-able tone controls.

A big advantage of the Lore is its 98db efficiency. I do not have any experience with horn speakers. But I believe anybody considering the Lore’s for low powered amps would be very happy with these speakers.

Have you also tried the Lore with your Primaluna amp? I would be curious about the pairing.

I recently received my Lore speakers connected to the Triode trv-845se integrated amplifier.

First, the Lore's were very well packed. Detailed set of unpacking instructions from Tekton helped ensure no damage upon opening.

I tend to listen to Jazz, both instrumental and vocals.

Initially I connected a sub-woofer to the speakers to strengthen what I would describe as weak and laid back bass. But after about 10 hours I noticed improvement in bass to the point that I disconnected the sub-woofer.

I've listened to different source material with the Lore's and am very happy with the purchase. The speakers present an airy, detailed presentation with good bass.

My other speakers are Daber Audio Monitor 3, Paradigm Monitor 7 v4 and Energy RC30. All the speakers have their own way of presenting the music. I would put the Lore's at the top of the list with the Daber Audio Monitor 3's (a good match with my Primaluna Dialogue Two integrated amp).

Well, I would say I've listened to some pretty heavy rock on the Lores with quite a bit of pleasure. My first night's listening session was with a live Ween concert at concert levels, and I was FULLY rocking out on it. Some of my heaviest bass music is probably my Soul Coughing albums. They have some really intense synthesized bass going on, and especially on Ruby Vroom, it's really high quality as well (upright bass for that stuff). I would never say the Lores were "confused" on any of this material in the bass region.

Your biggest risk with heavy rock, in my experience, is that it's been recorded/mixed using "modern" techniques that quash all the dynamics. If this is the case, the Lores will sound loud but compressed, as that's exactly what the recording is offering. Sometimes that's listenable, other times not. YMMV I could see strong potential for heavy metal to be unlistenable if it was recorded/mixed badly - think modern Metallica. On the other hand, some more underground heavy metal is actually extremely very technically demanding, and I bet some of those recordings paid attention to quality. Not being a heavy metal buff, I can't suggest a good example there.

Bottom line, the Lores will completely rock if the source material and amplification is up to the challenge.

Jacobabacon - When we had the 100 watt tube amp with the Lores we didn't play any heavy metal, but we did play complex music loud. And with my 4-watt SET amp I have as well, for example Dire Straits Sultans of Swing. Good bass, a lot of guitar, a driving beat. In both cases I thought the Lores held together very well. They sounded very solid and clean, no breaking up at all. The sound didn't change a whole lot, it just got louder which I suppose is what you'd want.
What's your amp, room, etc.?

Hey guys love the comparisons!!

With the bass level for the lores how do they sound with heavier music? Did you try anything like heavier rock or even metal? I listen to a lot of different music but do listen to some heavier bands as well. Some of the speakers I have tried it does sound like the speaker gets confused. I do not love huge bass like some people do so I am sure the Lores will work out.

Look forward to those comparisons with the Horn Shoppes (my other pair of speakers).

I would say the comments from the comparisons these guys made fits with my memory of the Soul Superfly at RMAF compared with what I'm hearing with my Lores. I'm interested if Roscoeiii can find some Lores to compare with his Superfly's, but I would wager the result will not be very different.

I'm also a former drummer, and I can definitely relate to what the guys are saying. The nuance of cymbal strikes is great, but so is the attack and midrange detail of the other drums.

Just to let you guys know, I'm nearing a point where I'll be comfortable swapping my Hornshoppe Horns back in for a comparison. Not quite settled yet, and I have some new interconnects I want fully burned in before the comparison.

FINALLY, and hopefully, some of you guys won't think I am a nut job anymore for all of my initial rave reviews. I told you guys what I owned before and that the Lores ran right there with all of them for a fraction of the cost!

We now have more evidence to conclude that the Lore is the real deal for a grand! This guy definitely has the skills and talent to build a great speaker - that's obvious - but personally, I believe it is his integrity and walk with the Lord that keeps him on this road of choosing to give us the best designed speaker for the money, rather than cutting corners to cover other costs (i.e., marketing) and more profit.

This industry needs more of this. A nice departure from the standard chicanery.

Anyone in Chicago with Lores who wants to compare them to Zu Soul Superflys?

re: "I think it's safe to say they are similar but not the same."

Agreed! They are both Eminence and appear to be very similar but I see now they are a different color and part so I just want to apologize to everyone if that was misleading.

Hi to all, I'm the guy with the room and bad sounding amp that Sebrof and Slowgeezr commented on for the Zu Omen vs Tekton Lore shootout! Maybe it's time for a tube amp? ;-)

Not too much to say here since their comments mirror my sentiments, but here's my 2 cents for what its worth.

Lows: The Lores didn't quite capture the lowest lows as did the Omens, but what they did on the bottom end, they did exquisitely. And while the Omens went a bit lower, I believe they sacrificed lower and mid-low end clarity in the process, almost as if the driver was too busy to manage it all. Maybe there is only so much freq range you can cover effectively with a full range driver?

Highs: For the highs, the Omens sounded great, but could not match the little nuances portrayed beautifully via the Lores. For example, with the Lores, I could easily tell where on the ride cymbal the drummer was playing. With the Omens, you just couldn't hear that level of detail - another point for the Lores.

Sounds stage: Wont go into it here, both Sebrof and Slowgeezr covered it perfectly.

Net: Lores win handily - highs, lows and everything in between. It's quite refreshing to see that you can still get fantastic sounding AND very efficient speakers without breaking the bank. Kudos to both companies. Sebrof - Feel free to drop off the either pair, but if I could decide, make it the Lores! :-)

"Also, interesting there are these differences, since both speakers use the SAME Eminence driver!"

Actually I think we need to be careful here. My understanding is that there are in fact differences between the main driver on the Lore and the main driver on the Omen. What the exact differences are and how significant they are I don't know, but per the Zu website they use a Zu260FRD/G4 on the Omen. When I spoke to Eric he did say that the drivers were not the same. I am looking at them both and there may be other differences besides the color.
I think it's safe to say they are similar but not the same.

05-07-11: Telescope_trade
Hi,

Just want to make one observation regarding the Omens.
First, when I had the regular Omens ( I now have Omen Defs)
I found that the height of the spikes made a difference in the sound of the speaker (mostly in the bass) in that if to low or to high, it could make the bass less solid, and a tad ragged sounding, and it could sound a bit congested."

Telescope - I agree. I went through great pains to get the spikes to where I thought they were best in my room (about 4 weeks worth). I have the speakers on the carpet spikes tilted up slightly in front. I did mention to the guys that that might be a contributor since we did not re-do that in the new room. And I agree that the Omens are more likely to be problematic with placement, etc.
But - As the Omens were optomized to my room, and I heard the same things from them vs. the Lore in the new room, I believe that tweaking the Omens would probably have brought about only an incremental improvement. I could be wrong. I'd love to keep comparing, but these suckers are heavy and I just want to listen to music.