Veneer delamination


Good evening my audiofile friends!  I am in a quandary that I am hoping some of you may able to help me with.  First of all has anyone had speakers "delaminate" (bubble, split, etc)  when they were under warranty, and how did you get this resolved with the company?

The end of 2021 I received a pair of Ohm T1000 speakers new from the Ohm company.  After a time setting them up and breaking them in I have enjoyed them very much.  Last week I went to dust them and found several large bubbles in the veneer as well as the veneer separating where it joined.  This was happening to both speakers.  My jaw dropped and my head hit the ceiling; I have never had this happen in over 45 years of owning stereo equipment.  The Ohm speakers that are in this series have veneer that raps around the entire speaker and meet in the back.

I live in Colorado where the humidity is generally below 25% and pretty consistent, and no one I know has witnessed problem.  I called Ohm and the technician I talked to said this has happened before but said with a hot iron with no water in it I could probably fix the problem or send it back and they would fix it free of charge but not cover shipping. These are the best speakers I have owned and am not going to touch them with an iron and thought I better think about the shipping cost a little.

The next day I called again and said I would rather trade them in for a pair of T2000 they had because I did not feel comfortable that something else would not go wrong with them.  They would give me the exchange for my speakers (which I appreciated) but no discount on the 2000's or shipping of any equipment.

I've looked in Denver but have not found a company that would re-veneer the speakers (sending them back and forth to New York is going to cost several hundred dollars.  I would appreciate any help anyone could give me with this type of issue, the Ohm people have been ok to deal with but there may be a better solution out there.  Thanks 

128x128dbwinters

     Perhaps a bit of background on a couple methods, used by various cabinet manufacturers, professional veneerers and common civilians use, in the application of veneers, will assuage some fears.

     The suggestion of using an iron tells me: Ohm applies theirs with one of the following, common methods.        

Hot Melt:  

https://www.hmtmfg.com/blog/applying-wood-veneers-quickly-using-hot-melt-adhesive/

and:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X5PGXoigtD4

or: something similar to Titebond Wood Glue and heat:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TxUKc4JWBaI

      As you can see from those vids; the judicious use of an iron would be an excellent method, for the repair of weak veneer adhesion.

     Seems to me: the high solids (rubber), 3M contact adhesives, we used back in the day, could probably be repaired the same way.    Never had to try it though.

     As suggested in the third link: keep the temps down to where you can touch the

surface of the veneer, without burning yourself.

     If that was the suggestion of the manufacturer; I'd have to assume, they feel whatever finish they applied, wouldn't be damaged, by the iron.

     From what I remember of the Ohms I repaired, back in the Eighties: they had a mostly natural, oiled finish (no gloss).   Don't know about now.

     I'd still use a lint-free cloth, between the iron and veneer, anyway.

     It's been my experience: in dry climates, in homes using wood burning stoves or high heat and no humidifier: glues dry out and expensive, antique furniture falls apart too (just a thought, having effected repairs on a lot).

     Give it a try, on one of the areas that is mostly out of sight, if you're afraid of the outcome.    ie: The rear seam would be a good place to start.

     Repairing one's own equipment, can be most gratifying.

     ie: Do a good job and you'll get warm fuzzies, every time you sit in front of those pretty Ohms.

@rodman99999 

Rodman is correct, a towel laid on the bubble and a warm iron should do it, lay it on for only a short 10-12 seconds and lift the iron and the towel should only be warm, do it several times, no rushing it, and it should remelt the glue, press down hard with a block of wood or a book as it cools down and it will make it lay flat.  If you are not a do-it-yourselfer, any local Denver woodworker/ cabinet maker should be able to do it for you, as you are not looking to re-veneer it, just fix the area that popped. Can happen with any furniture with a veneer.  

Dry air can cause issues with shrinkage and delamination all real wood finishes require furniture oil. If poly coated just toss them who wants plastic over real wood?

@dbwinters , They are using a heat set glue. They either did not heat it well when they put the veneer on or they did not use enough glue. This is not that hard!!

Make sure the bottom of the iron is perfectly smooth. If not smooth it with 2000 grit silicon carbide wet or dry paper and use water or use 4-0 steel wool. Set the iron to the middle of it's temp setting. You should be able to tap the bottom without burning yourself. Where there are bubbles prick the center of the bubble with a sewing needle (to let the air out). Then place butcher's paper over the area and slowly pass the iron back and forth over the area, pressing down firmly for one minute. 

If the veneer does not stay down they did not use enough glue and the speakers are defective. They should send you a new pair and return shipping labels for the defective speakers. I assume the speakers are still under warranty. If they do not want to do that tell them you want a complete refund, go buy something else and plaster them on the net. Errors are a fact of live. It is what a company does with it's errors that counts, particularly in these days of the internet.

If there's a bubble use a syring to inject an appropriately small amount of wood glue. Then warm iron it down like above.

I just completed 3 drawer fronts in my bathroom using a maple veneer tape and a hot iron. Piece of cake. Rodman, deadhead1000 and mijostyn are all essentially correct. The key is keeping the temps regulated by using a towel or butcher paper to avoid scorching. releasing any bubbles with a needle, then press hard on the area until it cools.

I have the walsh 2000 that I picked up in Brooklyn right before Covid really became an issue. One speaker has a bubble right in the middle of the front facing side. The other is starting to delaminate at the very top of the side panel. I spoke with the guys at OHM and the said bring them in but I just haven’t had the time. Should do it before they get any worse. Without traffic I’m only 40-45 minutes away. This is going to motivate me   Seems like it may be a manufacturing issue

Suggest you get rid of distorting wood cabs and get some Magneplaners.  Not only do they not de-laminate, but they also do not distort the MUSIC.

Cheers!

Thank you for your responses.  I wish I had known that evidently Ohm speakers have an issue with delamination.  While they said they would “fix” them they don’t pay for sending them back.  This is approximately the cost of one of the speakers.  There are creases that it seems like heating and applying pressure may not work.  I’m currently looking at some veneering companies locally that would be able to fix or relaminate.  This is a hard lesson, buyer beware.  Thanks again!
 

 

 

If the speaker was well made doing all this stuff should not be necessary.I would dump them ASAP!!

     Veneering companies need love too, right?

                        Happy listening!