I would think they need to be processing signal
tube recommendations for audio research LS-16?
Bought a new set of tubes on a whim. Figured the ones I have had been in place for several years... maybe I'll try something different...
So just dropped a little over $400 on a set of 6H23/6922 type 3. ..definitely more open and airy, very clear mids and plenty of top end energy...not so sure this is an ideal match for me. not feeling much energy in the mids, and the top end is clear and bright, accentuating the microphone and steel strings. Joni Mitchell sounds a bit shrill...seems like these tubes would be great in a pre- that leans toward the warm and lush.
I would never suggest the LS-16 sounds particularly warm or lush. I am likely to be wrong, but my impression is the LS-16 could benefit from just a touch of warmth, more dynamic liquid mids, and a bit more bass energy?
opinions? suggestions?
What about the Amperex gold pin 7308 or the Mullard E188cc/7308? I'm thinking the Amperex.
or should I just stick with my Electro-Harmonix 6922EH?
Any suggestions for tubes for a Reference Phono 3?
kind regards!
26 responses Add your response
So, I hear much more detail in the string and in the drum head struck. Definitely more resolution in male and female voices alike. Listening to Pentangle Sweet Child here. Clicks and pops are a bit more apparent. Bob Dylan’s harmonica has a bit more energy, verging on strident. But that may just be a harmonica ... and the Dutch pressing of John Harding that I’m listening to... so far the Valvo tubes aren’t quite as warm as the factory 6922’s. Though, I would say there is still some warmth, more detail, more resolution, a bit more energy on top, nice energy overall, a tad bit more taught down low...nice sense of ease. So far, much better! |
Did some reading, spoke to Brent Jesse,… Mr. Jesse recommended the Valvo E88CC... I have just installed them… Having only just last night returned from 3 weeks in Lincoln, Nebraska. Sounding so much better… right out of the box. We’ll see what they do with a little bit of break in time. Will be posting a matched quad of cryogenically treated 6H23’s from Upscale Audio with about 50-60 hrs on them ...if any one is interested... |
Whatever path you follow in your tube rolling: you might find this informative: https://www.head-fi.org/threads/6922-tube-review-17-top-6922-6n23p-e88cc-cca-7308-e188cc-tubes.761078/ Also, read the third from the last paragraph, of this 6SN7 review. The same rules/effects, noticed when mixing tubes(of any family), in the same circuit/channel, apply whether preamp, power amp, integrated, etc. Have fun! http://www.dehavillandhifi.com/6sn7_vt.htm |
I’m familiar with the LS16. If you put these in one channel, and listen to one channel at at time, in Mono: you can compare their tone, etc, with whatever else you have. You won’t get the sound stage picture(etc), that stereo would provide, of course. With one swapped into each channel and tried in both positions(first tube in each signal path, then second), they’ll still make a difference. Just colored by whatever presentation the other tubes infuse. It will still be easy to tell, whether the sound is better or worse. The offer is just my way of encouraging others, to experiment with their system/sound. |
Since you’re thinking about trying Amperex; I have a pair of Navy/USN-CEP 6922s, as shown in the following links, from ’62 and ’64(but- identical construction). You're welcome to try them in your ARC pre(gratis). No risk/no strings. Just review and return, once your curiosity is sated. Their sound, spaciousness and appearance is much like my early Sixties, grey plate and shield, Siemens CCa’s. Just a bit warmer. https://www.tubemuseum.org/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=AMP-USN-CEP-7308 and: https://www.upscaleaudio.com/products/amperex-7308-vintage-gold-pin More: https://www.tubemonger.com/Amperex_USA_MPs_MINT_NOS_1965_USN_CEP_6922_E88CC_p/625.htm |
I don’t want to modify the preamp. I’ve had it for years and am familiar with its sound. I made the mess changing the tubes. I will be on the road for the next few weeks… Work. When I get home I’ll change back to the 6922eh. I’ll need to get my phono 5 and citation ll sold before buying any more tubes. Flat broke after my recent purchase of used ref phono 3 and new luxman du-6 |
I believe ls16 has Infinity caps I had an amp long ago with those caps. They can sometimes be a little on the cool side in certain systems. You could add a bypass cap if you can solder. Remove it when you sell it and add it to next amp or your speaker crossover. Maybe a 0.1 uf Jupiter copper foil or Miflex may help warm things up for $50 to $100 you don't like it through it in your crossover. If your fuse is stock you could upgrade it. I don't think you can go wrong with Mullard or Valvo. |
Thank you Annika and Jafox. Yeah. So, I must be 50-60 hrs in on the 6h23’s and am totally bummed. Trying to give them a chance to break in. But I’m ready to put the 6922eh’s back in until I can decide on other tubes. Will read up on Valvo. Have the Amperex 7308 and Siemens E88CC in mind as well right now. Will email Brent Jesse too. Like the dynamics, resolution, sense of ease, and slight touch of warmth I was finding in my system with my new (to me) phono stage. Have totally lost that with the 6h23. Going in the wrong direction. |
Another vote for Valvo as well as Amperex 7308. Mullard 6922 are another favorite. Great advice to read the Brent Jesse site and then email him for advice. He is very helpful. As for the EH, even 500 hours will still result in no value compared to the Brent suggested tubes. Make sure to keep the EH tubes as you will sell the LS16 with these installed. |
Give your tubes 200 hours just to be safe. Did the person you bought tubes have a return policy. Brent will answer phone and will let you return tubes with a small restocking fee after so many days. He will guide you to the right tube not the highest priced ones. I thought buying the amprex SQ 6922 at almost 3 times the price would better the bugle boy 6dj8, but I was wrong, sometimes more money doesn't always improve things. |
PaulCreed, Thank you for your response. I have not spent much time on the Brent Jesse site in the past. I did spend some time poking around and reading on the site this morning. A lot of information there! I’ll need to read through some of it again. I’ll try to spend more time learning about the Valvo tubes you mentioned as well. Thank you again. |
I think you may like a Valvo, can be a goldylocks tube with right amp, it's a little on warm side but not as much as a mullard. My Preamp is tubey and warm it likes the bugle boys best,more than other expensive 6922 type. I have the amprex gold pin SQ 6922 and amprex gold pin and find it very detailed with transparent highs but prefer the bugle boy. Also have amprex early orange globe that is one super detailed tube, the Valvo is a nice tube in my Preamp I like it better than mullard. I use bugle boy mostly with valvo second and rarely use the rest. Bugle boy has good bass with solid highs and it's cheap. If you want to try a bugle boy cheap get Hewlett-Packard white label it's the same tube. I think you can get HP and Valvo from Brent Jesse for $80 a pair last time I bought some. |
So, I’ve left the stereo running all day for the last two days. I have a new cd player and have taken the opportunity to run it in a bit as well… The tubes have definitely settle down. Much better. Still not impressed with the difference over the much less expensive 6922EH it came with. No suggestions? |