Thiel Owners
So I swapped out the Monster Powerline 2 speaker cables, to the CS2.4SE, for a shorter pair of Kimber 8TC; more out of curiosity than anything. First impression: everything sounded the same tonally. No difference in the soundstage either. It was the system that I’ve listened to for years. Then I noticed something: I heard the precise words in some background vocals on an Indigo Girls’ track. I never knew exactly what the lyrics were before; just that the harmonies were nice. Then I was surprised at some rightish-channel strumming that kicked in part-way through another song. I never noticed it before, despite the years of listening to the piece. All-in-all I’d say that the 8TC has added a level of detail that I hadn’t observed before. Not a huge difference, but enough to sit up and take notice. And be delighted... Cheers, Warren P.S. I’ve also added a short run of 8TC to the MCS1 centre channel too. |
Jafant, I used a Krell fpb 300 on my 2.4's, which is very high current and doubles down to 2 ohms or below. The fpb series was made in the early 90's, I think. Mine had fresh caps done at the factory. As these get some use, I'd look for freshly recapped models. The older KSA's are great buys, if they have fresh caps. A Thiel dealer in Amarillo used an old KSA 50 for some CS5's in his bedroom. Not that I'd recommend that. I think for most Thiels the older Krells or Classes are great and are still available online. The KSA's are heaters though! |
Jafant... Currently I'm using a Sony Hapz1es music server for all my digital stuff which is a really good piece of equipment. It has a 1TB hard drive which I've barely put a dent in. So far as synergy goes I'm still checking it out. I'll be buying some tubes tomorrow since I have no idea how long those installed have been in service. |
Mapman... Dig in, you won't regret owning Thiels. If at all possible try to locate 'em geographically convenient since even the smaller models are HEAVY. My CS 3.5's are a permanent fixture even though I've had Magnepan,. Von Schweikert...all very good speakers but...I return to them above all. (I just listened to the new Magnepan 1.7i and .7 last week. I really like the .7 better.). I'm thinking about a used pair for sale here on the site...just for kicks, a complement to my system not a replacement. I got my 3.5's from a fellow member here for a pittance, actually the least expensive piece of equipment I own. Just make sure to inspect all the drivers visually if possible. I've seen too many models here and elsewhere with mid ranges suffering from dry rot, dented dust caps on the woofers, dimpled tweeters. The 3 different models I've owned all came with the instructions to leave the grills on for listening. |
I finally received the BAT VK3i preamplifier back from the good folks at Audio Den here in beautiful downtown Lake Grove. Along with it I also purchased my last set of Transparent input connects so now I'm 100% Transparent on everything - except the Marantz TT-15 turntable which has proprietary cables built in. My initial impression is that this is a very laid-back preamplifier. I tossed Ginger Baker's "Cyril Davies" into it and heard imaging better than my ARC LS 3, but I'm finding the highs a bit reigned in, or reserved? Build quality is excellent. I don't know how many hours are on the tubes so I'll be playing with that aspect in the near future. Hard to tell that this is a used piece - well worth the $1k I paid for it. As soon as my right arm mends I'm going to toss my CJ MF200 into the mix and see what happens. Too damn heavy to monkey around with now. Current amp is a Primare Research A34.2. Its all good. |
I have had Thiels since '83 starting with a pair of 03a's & a PS Audio Elite integrated Amp. I progressed through 2.2's, 2.3''s and then to 2.4's to which I added a Krell fpb 300 amp, which was wonderful. As a truly sick audiophile, I was not content with perfection, and couldn't resist adding a pair of CS 5's. The Krell did just fine, but oh no, I had to twist off and get a CAT Amplifier, a beast with 1000 plus amps into a 4 ohm load. But it had a damn noisy fan, So I traded both to an audiophile in San Antonio, for a pair of Altec Onken horns and a tube amp and Transcendent tube pre. That ended the arms race, and I have a really smooth system. I still had the 2.4's, which I sold to a guy in Dallas, who is a happy happy camper. Thing is, I now am developing a "no Thiels" twinge and feel lost without a pair of Thiels in my system. So, thing is, I am wondering if I should get a pair of CS6's on the Gon, or get some 7's on US Audio...But what am I going to do with those really nice (and big!) Onken Altecs! I need help. |
Jafant... No, at least not for the moment! I still have my new Primare A34.2 amp that's barely, not even broken in. I also have a "spare" CJ MF200 amp as well. I was actually thinking of returning to Pass Labs amplification. but the 150.5 that I had, and bought for $2495 a few years ago has almost doubled in price - even used/demo. Mark @ Reno keeps me updated. Yikes! That would have been the only piece of equipment I've had that actually increased in price. If the BAT is truly something special I'll more than likely purchase a new unit. It's kind of how we should buy automobiles; check them out in a rental then decide. If that were possible in every case I would not have bought my 2011 Lexus ES 350. (An imported Buick at best!) Very uncomfortable seats, low headroom even with the sunroof open, no rear view camera...a mechanically bulletproof car with decent mpg and performance but...real world daily usage feh! I was thinking once of leasing the Cadillac XTS but after I rented it for a vacation week, found it was like driving a refrigerator box with slits for windows. Ridiculously limited rear visibility on all sides. Wow...went off topic there! |
Jafant... No. Rather than going to an electrical supply store for this they are dealing directly with BAT - and they were sent the wrong toggle switch. Grrrrr.... It's just a flipswitch! I'm not being charged for this so my patience is extended if not tested. They're good folks so I'm not truly concerned. However I sold my AR LS 3 and my Peachtree 220SE integrated and my Classe CP35 so I'm music less now... |
The 3.5's and 3.6's used different drivers, similar but different cross-overs. The 3.5's used bass eq/boosted sealed boxes, and with the 3.6's a passive radiator. IMHO, the 3.5's are more coherent, have deeper bass response, and are easier to amplify. The 3.6's are more refined and suave in the mid to upper frequencies, and are capable of more dynamic range. The amplification requirements of both requires careful consideration, especially for the 3.6's. With that said, most seem to prefer the 3.6's and I seem to be I the minority of preferring the 3.5's. |
Open question... I have a very good pair of CS3.5's right now but, as mentioned a few posts back, had offered $1100 for a pair of CS3.6's here on Audiogon which was declined. The seller just messaged me that their buyer backed out after they accepted and I could have them for $1100 now. Original cartons and everything. It would be nice to lose that electronic equalizer but I would be sacrificing about 5hz at the low end - is it "what's a few hertz between friends" or "you're an idiot - keep the 3.5's! Or do I start a vertical collection of Thiel models? Thanks. |
TY- Dan for the connection on Thiel legacy manager- Rob Gillum. Regarding your question about surround speakers- I have only heard the 2-channel Thiel loudspeakers (2.4, 2.4SE, 2.7 and 3.7). None of those dealers/retailers had any in/on nor sat Thiel speakers. All auditions were in a 2-channel listening room or showroom. Hopefully, one of the other guys here can be of help to you. Happy Listening! |
Jafant... I have to admit that I exercise caution when touting a commercial enterprise here for reasons that are obvious to everyone who buys/sells and posts here. I like the "real world" opinions of people who own and live with the equipment we discourse over as opposed to people who have a commercial stake - not that there's anything wrong with that in the proper setting. Here on Long Island there are two bricks and mortar stores a body can WALK into without an appointment - and this one is literally right around the corner from me. When I first moved here 22 years ago I had virtually no furniture so I bought a pair of Klipsch CF-3's from them - to fill up my living room. (They were fun for a while but those horn loaded tweeters...oy vey!) The fact that they're still around is testimony enough to their business acumen. Anyway, I should be picking up my BAT preamp this afternoon and when I do I'll be checking out the Thiels they mentioned - which may pose an issue. If they're a model above my CS3.5 dare I consider them? Woe is me! |
So jafant, as apparent resident Thiel expert, can you give me a suggestion as to what smaller satellite or ON wall speakers tonally match the Thiel sound? I have nowhere to install Thiels in walls for my surrounds, and unfortunately need on-walls. SHort of building boxes for another pair of Power Plane 1.2's, not sure what else would match. ALSO - an FYI to all Thiel owners - I spoke to Rob Gillum of Thiel today who sold me 2 replacement grilles for the beat up ones I received from the prior owner... He runs service for all legacy products in Kentucky. Really nice guy, look him up if you need anything. Former operations manager when the factory was still located in Kentucky. Appears to know his stuff. Anyway, suggestions as to tonally matching satellites or on-walls would be much appreciated - Dan |
Jafant... I stopped by the store yesterday and will be picking it up Thursday. Aaaaargh! Great folks at Audio Den here in Lake Grove but thankfully they really take care of me. I also checked out a pair of Maggie 1.7i's just for the hell of it. (I like Maggie's, too) Oddly I preferred the smaller and less expensive .7's. The owner said he had a pair of used Thiels downstairs and when I pick up the BAT I'm going to ask which models they are...of course! I almost had a pair of CS3.6 from this site but offered $1100...I think they went for $1200.. |
Good Day robinbarbour- I am a big fan of CJ gear as well. Did you check out the MET-1 ? This is CJ's attempt at surround sound- 5.1 to be exact. Yes, I have read excellent comments on Cary Cinema. Personally, I am a "stereo" guy, 2-channel only. Once one steps outside of this and goes into a more complicated configuration, 5.1 or 7.1, much thought/planning must be sorted out. I have auditioned both good and poor HT set-ups over the years. In a 5-channel system, it all starts with the room or listening space. |
Jafant, I like you comment : "Another attribute- very clean. Some will confuse this aspect w/ forward and/or bright. I suppose that if fed the wrong source or component the presentation could be bright. At any rate, this could be tamed w/ a tubed pre-amp or amp. My fave combo is a tubed pre-amp and solid state power amp. Most important of all, carefully selecting cables/power cords." I have been experimenting with cables and getting some decent results, but difficult to try without purchase. My question is about tubes. I am operating a surround system with Thiels and the only tube prepro I saw was cj that doesn't do decoding. I was thinking of possibly Cary Cinema, but wanted to know if anyone had other suggestions? What are your thoughts on 5 channel. I still currently get good two channel with my set up and would like to stay multiple channeled. |
UGH! Due to a pocket door, there isn't enough room to mount the Powerplane 1.2 on the right side of my TV! So it's 1 of 3 options: 1. Build a nice looking box around them and hang them on the wall; 2. Install them all horizontally in a row below the TV (it's a 65" so they would be mostly spread out...) 3. Sell them. I guess I could use them in my bedroom, but that's overkill on my budget, especially when I have 2 and a half extra HT speaker systems I can use in the bedroom... What do you guys think? I can get new grills for $40 a piece, and there are 2 very tiny (undisclosed ) chips on the speakers edges that won't be visible when installed. Time to research on-wall options? - Dan |
Many Thanks! Dan for your contribution to this thread. Thiel will image like no other. Detail and resolution are abundant as well. Another attribute- very clean. Some will confuse this aspect w/ forward and/or bright. I suppose that if fed the wrong source or component the presentation could be bright. At any rate, this could be tamed w/ a tubed pre-amp or amp. My fave combo is a tubed pre-amp and solid state power amp. Most important of all, carefully selecting cables/power cords. |
So I received the speakers. They are a little beat up - not sure how to handle that, sent an email to the seller - but I hooked them up and I've got to say they sound fantastic with the Odyssey Stratos amp. My Odyssey is an HT-3 with a cap upgrade for reference. Anyway, sound is extremely detailed. They are replacing Acoustic Energy Aegis speakers, Compacts for right and left and the Aegis Center. Surrounds are Canton Plus X speakers. Dialogue is is crystal clear for movies/TV. Playing Force Awakens right now and it's close to perfect dialogue. Had to turn down my sub, as the Thiels are slightly harder to drive than the Acoustic Energy speakers. No nasal dialogue, and the speakers are seriously dynamic. Easy to hear at low volume, no ability to crank them up due to sleeping family. Music is also excellent. Used to prefer multi-channel music mode. But now all that does is reveal the deficiencies in the Cantons. Yes, the Thiels are that much cleaner. They make the Cantons sound dark. I wouldn't call the Thiels bright in any way - just clean. If they are normally bright the Stratos is keeping them musical. Imaging is great. Can't tell where the speakers are even tho they are aimed slightly above my head (not installed in the wall, sitting on console table under the TV). Anyway, very pleased with the sound just unhappy they are cosmetically banged up... Overall, I'd say great match with the Odyssey Stratos. I'll try to hook them up to my parasound 1206 and compare them to the MK's hooked up in the basement. - Dan |
Jafant - I will report on the marriage between Thiel and my Odyssey Stratos amp when I get home from vacation and hook these puppies up. They need to sound good before I cut holes in my walls. Cables are as follows : internconnects by The Music Cable, using the Yellow model, and my review from 2002 is available here. These have been stored sin sealed ziplock bags since 2007, brought back into action about 2 months ago when I hooked up the Stratos in my living room. https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/review-the-music-cable-yellow-interconnect-interconnect Speaker cable is 14 gauge, available at big box store brand cable that my contractor ran through the walls - no idea on the brand. Source connects are rocket fish HDMI a from blue ray player and X1 cable box, media server via wired Ethernet cable. Not much else to report until I can run some power though these speakers... Not likely until Tuesday. - Dan |
I just created another discussion, but curious as to what you guys think about the synergy between an upgraded Odyssey Stratos amp and Thiel speakers. I just purchased 3 Powerplane 1.2's for my living room (wife is done with my rotating on-walls) and the Stratos 3 channel powers the three front speakers. Use is mostly TV and movies, and I'm the only one that listens to music in there... I've always liked Thiels, never owned them (couldn't afford them!) but when I was looking for higher quality in-walls and saw how inexpensive the powerplanes could be found online, I just bought them. Expecting delivery on Monday. Anyway, any thoughts would be much appreciated. Thanks, - Dan |
