Telefunken E188CC Sound

I don't know, but I do know that anyone wanting that much is a scam artist and anyone willing to pay it is a fool!

Talk about a fool, I recently paid $235.00 plus shipping for a used LP that won't even fit into a tube socket :^).

An E188CC tube is a big improvement specs-wise, over an E88CC. E188CC is another name for the 7308, both being prized in the tube world.

I think tubes are definitely a flavor kind of thing, very system and audiophile dependent. I may prefer this tube for its low end, but you might dismiss it out of hand because of something that irritates you.

I used to wonder how different people could prefer different tubes, as the rankings always felt more or less clear cut to me, but I now I strike it up as a vanilla/chocolate kind of thing. For example, I am not a fan of most Russian tubes. The Slovak and a lot of the current (and I do stress, current) Chinese tubes appeal to me a lot more. But, as I read these threads, a lot of people I respect like the Russian tubes better than the ones I like. I don't understand it, and don't agree, but people should run what they like best.

Still, in my experience, better tubes are worth the additional money. If you're the type of guy who has some serious money invested in your system, it seems automatic to me that you'd strive to have the best tubes you can get. You'll definitely hear it, and the effects can often be far more than subtle.

All this being said, "better" must be found through experience, as it doesn't often correlate with price. As an example, we have been running a lot of tube shootouts, and have found a few new tubes that can match or even exceed the stratospherically priced classic varieties. In these cases, you can live well on a fraction of what is normally considered the way to go. It's really great when you sell your $300 tubes, and replace them with a $6 tube! The end goal always being to maximize sonics, factoring in value.

Bojack,

To some $400.00 is a days wage and to others pocket change and still to others a weeks wage and so on.
If you list your system and price paid I can then go through it and see if you are a fool or not.
Your statement is meaningless regarding the fool who is willing to paying $400.00 for a pair of tubes.
As for as the scam artist statement is concerned I pity your wife or close friends as you are to black and white in your thinking.

I have a pair of each of the Telefunken E88CC and E188CC tubes. Both pairs are great sounding tubes. The E188CC is by far a better sounding tube than the E88CC. Imo the E188CC has a fuller midrange sound. The E188CC is a lively sounding tube, it does a great job of keeping up with fast changing music if you know what I mean. Clean sounding though the Telefunken tubes are not as warm sounding as the USA made early 60s Amperex PQ 6922 tube or the early 60s siemens CCa tube. For the money and sound you can't beat the early 60s USA Amperex PQ 6922 tube. You can still buy them at a reasonable price. Install the Herbie's HAL-O tube dampers near the top of the tube and enjoy.
Though I do not have any personal experience with the Holland made early 60s Amperex PQ 6922 tubes I have heard the sound is similar to the Telefunken tubes.

What piece of equipment will you be using the tubes in? What sound are you looking for?
.

Jea48,

Thanks for your input.
I have a Audio Note dac with Amperex white label gold pin PQ shield USA.
I just bought the Siemens CCa gray plate that is in the mail.
I am about to pull the trigger on the Telefunken E188CC for $325.00 new in the box and sealed.

Bojack, last year I paid $400 for a pair of 1972 NIB Siemens low noise 7308. Yes that's a lot of money. However, they clearly outperformed any 6922/Cca/E88CC/E188CC, etc. I had heard previously in THAT particular application. Would they have made the same difference in another preamplifier or Glorys' Audio Note? Dunno, but don't criticize what you don't understand.

Tvad your point is well taken. There exists, among many audiophiles, a belief that all Cca tubes are created equal. Nothing could be farther from the truth. Having used Siemens and Telefunkens from different production runs there is no doubt in my mind that Cca guarantees very little. I've heard and used Amperex and Philips 6922 that were far superior to many Cca. My humble advice when buying tubes at the price levels discussed is know your seller. It may cost a few dollars more but also save a lot of headaches. Caveat emptor.

06-11-06: Glory
I have a Audio Note dac with Amperex white label gold pin PQ shield USA.
I just bought the Siemens CCa gray plate that is in the mail.
I am about to pull the trigger on the Telefunken E188CC for $325.00 new in the box and

I can only speak for the sound from my Sonic Frontiers Line one preamp, with that said, I prefer the sound from the early 60s Siemens CCa tubes to the Telefunken E188CC tubes. Imo the CCa just has a better overall musical presentation.

After you have the Siemens CCa broke-in post back with your opinion of the tube. Same if you buy the Telefunken, let us know what you think of the two tubes.
Jim

Tvad,

Nice to get a reply from you and others. I have had both exact tubes in preamps (AA M3A) and a CD player (Tjoeb 99). They were nice (not exceptional), and they were not worth this kind of money when compared to other brands (Philips and Amperex) that sounded as good or better in my system. And BTW, stating that 400.00 for a pair of tubes is NOT "black and white" thinking as Glory states; rather, it is thinking influenced by a semblance of economic reasoning. When Wall Street hits 20,000, it will make economic sense to pay this kind of money, but until then . . .

Tvad,

I bet your hair rocks!!

>>When Wall Street hits 20,000, it will make economic sense to pay this kind of money, but until then . . .<<

That's your opinion. Others disagree. If one has the financial resources, equipment that will clearly reveal the sonic improvement, and ears to hear that improvement it makes sense to them. Again don't criticize what you don't understand and/or can't afford.

I've used all above mention tubes in my ARC SP11 MKII.
Telefunken E188CC by far is best sounding in the right placement. What I mean is they sound best at phono section.
Extend highs and very nurtual sounding. But if you placed them on line and play CD it sound hard edgy and little bright.I end up with Amperex 7308 JAN in the line with E188CC in the phono.