Sound to match Zen iFi Stream

Holo Red and JPlay for IOS.  

I’m similarly suffering with my Zen Stream. 😖😖😖  I’d look at the Innuos PULSEmini paired with an upgraded LPS from LHY, Teddy Pardo, or SBooster.  I’m sure it’s at least on par with the iFi performance wise, and it comes with their outstanding Sense app that is so good some have even dropped Roon.  And very unlike iFi they offer excellent customer support.  Best of luck. 

I actually had two iFi ZS streamers serving my two rigs, both powered with iFi iPower X. I replaced the streamer in my first rig with a WiiM Ultra paired with a Gustard U18, using DH Labs USB Mirage and HDMI 2.1 cables—and the improvement in sound was significant. The WiiM Ultra truly benefits from being paired with a DDC, and it synergizes well with the U18. I also tried pairing the ZS with the U18 but not impressed with the pairing.

This combo—the Ultra and U18—has excellent synergy with my Harmony Micro DAC. The sound can be described as effortless, transparent, and depth-dealing. I believe it can outperform many higher-end streamers.

For my second rig, I used the Cambridge Audio MXN10, which also sounds better than the ZS but still doesn’t match the performance of the Ultra/U18 combo. I’m currently in the process of upgrading it.

Interestingly, a trustworthy reviewer who previously gave the ZS a high score of 9.5/10 has recently revised it down to 7.0 or 7.5, reflecting the increased competition. That says something.

There are many choices at different price point.  I will encourage you to look for recommendation(s) from persons that actually own the gears and have a substantial auditioning experience with them.

Nice post timing!  My iFi Zen Stream stopped working just tonight - I tried for hours to get it to be recognized by Tidal Connect and something bricked it.  I tried everything to get it going again - which it had been working fine for years.  Oh well... time to move on to something else.  I need something as a stop gap and am hoping the upcoming Laiv streamer will be my next piece.

@tubeguy76 Wha’s your budget, and are you looking for new or used?

@soix Did you just start having issues with your Zen Stream?  Mine was fine until this weekend and I didn't change anything.

@tubeguy76  Mine was fine when hardwired to my router, but when not I’ve had problems (as have many others) and no support from iFi even when the US distributor got involved to try to help.  And their software/website absolutely sucks as well.  

I just ordered a WiiM Ultra from Amazon as a stop gap.  Who knows, maybe it will be permanent.

Mine was fine when hardwired to my router, but when not I’ve had problems (as have many others) and no support from iFi even when the US distributor got involved to try to help.  And their software/website absolutely sucks as well.

Ah ok, I had mine hardwired as well but it just lost connection and I couldn’t get it back. I even tried setting a static IP and no go. Was weird. It’s a shame as it does sound good but the software is a tragedy. 

@tubeguy76 

Did you try doing a factory reset and re-doing the setup from scratch?

@jackd 

Yep I tried all that and didn't have any success.  

@tubeguy76  Just to make sure that you have gone through the 'unbricking' process with the tool send by the Ifi supporting team and get the firmware reinstalled. 

The term “iFi supporting team” is an oxymoron. 

I submitted the ticket online and they replied within reasonable turnaround time sending the unbricking tool.  I was able to follow the instruction and resolve the  issue.

@lanx0003  Well good for you.  Their service still sucks and is an embarrassment compared to most of the industry. 

@lanx0003  I haven't tried the iFi tool, I'll reach out to them and see if I can get them to send me one. 

On another note, I received the Wiim Ultra and setup was flawless and fast, zero connection issues with Tidal.  Sounds pretty good too.  I have a feeling my Zen Stream was still a bit better (used it with the iFi Power Elite power supply) but it might just be all in my head.

I still have a Zen Stream. A Neo Stream also as I just picked one up on the cheap. I've tried a lot the budget types outside of the Halo Red. Though that one is well over $1k now. I personally liked the Zen over the MXN10 & CXN2..as well as the WiiM Ultra. I've never used a DDC before so that might be all one needs to better the SQ of the low priced Zen Stream. I have always used a Sbooster of IFI Elite for power supply though. Which both are very similar. 

I've had the ZEN twice. First one I sold due to connection issues. Someone gave me a tip to run it with its own phone (old unused phone) & that's what I did with my 2nd Zen Stream. Pretty flawless after that. Well not flawless..sometimes when I start the first track direct from Tidal it wants to start it in the middle of the track. But after that it's flawless lol. I wonder if it has to do with my regular phone getting constant notifications, texts, emails, phone calls that it throws off the connection. I've had no issues with the Neo Stream. 

I felt that the Primare Prisma NP5 was comparable in sound quality to the Zen. Slightly different presentation but still very good compared to the other cheapies. Little more spacious, airy compared to Zen. Not as bassy or thick as the Zen. The Prisma is very limited in outputs..no USB even. It's about as basic as one can get. 

I really liked the WiiM Ultra. Loved everything about it & really wanted to keep it longer than I did. I should have tried a DDC. It wasn't even on my radar though. I'd like to know what's all involved with incorporating something like Jriver or other upsampling software into the signal. 

After many years of only analog I'm basically streaming all the time now & really need to learn/figure out how to get the best from digital streaming. 

@mattw73  Ultra + VG ddc is transformative. Ultra+ok ddc like smsl po100 pro is noticeable. Zen + ddc demo only marginal imp on my system.  Ultra by itself does not outperform Zen but sounds more natural.  Just share my experience. 
How do you like Red?  Hans rated mid 1b, on par with Rivo plus + good LPS.  Hans also commands Red clean almost all sibilance.  Can you confirm?  Are you bothered by the need to control Red by PC?  Thx.

@lanx0003 What’s the "VG" ddc?  Is that a certain brand or model?

edit:  I think you mean very good?

VG very good like U18 I used. Several Agers use it too. There is a YouTuber rated it highly.  Harmony micro ddc has more nuances but cost more. I found its clock has extremely low jitter noise better than Rivo plus. Don’t forget cabling especially i2s ones hdmi cable is critical too like DH Labs 2.1. Did you get Zen problem solved?  

@lanx0003 

Ok, I understand, thanks for clarifying!  Yes, I did get the Zen working albeit with the old firmware from 2022.  I'm trying to compare it with the WiiM Ultra and I like both.  I "feel" that the Zen sounds slightly better but it's difficult to tell.  In theory, they should both sound the same since they're outputting only a USB signal to my external DAC.  (DA2 in my Mac C2800).
If I stick with the WiiM, do you still recommend a ddc?  My DAC doesn't have I2S.

@lanx0003 I misspoke or used my words wrong. I meant to say that I've tried a lot of the budget-ish streamers except for the Halo Red. I re-read what I wrote & it's not what I meant lol. I have never listened to or owned the Red. It is one that I have been interested in. The Red & the  Rivo Plus. 

I did receive my uDac today. I hooked it up to the IFI Neo Stream (which I feel is an improvement over the Zen Stream) but only by USB. I do have a short I2s cable but I'm just trying to burn the uDac in right now. I have my TV running into it by optical at the moment. 

I didn't have my Pontus 15th in the living room where I put the uDac. I had the RME & when I switched to the uDac the height of the soundstage was very noticeable. The clarity was better..as was imaging focus. That was only with it playing a couple hours. I did notice how hot the uDac gets. I'm looking forward to its presentation after some hours on it. 

@tubeguy76  I don't want to take credit from the gentleman who first started promoting the SMSL PO100 Pro with the Ultra. I'm not sure if you've seen his video, but I took his advice and tried out this well-built, sub-$80 DDC. It really works well with the Ultra.  

The device measures well on ASR and, on my system, achieves 80-85% of the performance of a Gustard U18 when using an I2S connection. The performance will vary depending on your system, so I suggest trying other connections for yourself. It's so affordable that if you don't like it, you can return it to Amazon at no loss.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BYoRDOfUSGI&t=28s

@mattw73  Yes, it reaches 104-105° F on my infrared thermometer gun. As long as it's still touchable, it should be okay. According to Soon, the entire chassis acts as a heatsink.  After complete broken-in, I suggest you switch it to standby mode (but don't necessarily need to unplug the power supply) to avoid nonstop heat attack.

I tried it with an iFi iPower X (15V / 1.5A), which is less than 2A, but Soon said not to worry about it. I found that it doesn't make a difference compared to the stock power supply. One trustworthy reviewer reported that switching to a Linear Power Supply (LPS) doesn't offer much improvement, so I didn't bother. It implies that Harmony has already optimized its SMPS for micro Dac.

My unit is working well so far. The only glitch I've found is that the display sometimes doesn't turn off, even when set to do so. I reported the issue to Harmony, and Soon said they were able to replicate the issue and it would be fixed in the next firmware update, but I haven't received any notification yet.

My impression of the sound quality was consistent with yours, although for some reason, it took me a longer while to get there. During the break-in period, I often unplugged it at night, which some people say slows down the process, even if the total number of hours reaches the suggested amount. You might want to consider leaving it on all the time during the break-in period.