Review Shunyata Venom V16 Power Distributor

@guakus   Thank you so much for breaking this all down for me I really appreciate it. I want to ask u another question. I have a Krell FPB 600. Would I recommend that an amp also be plugged into a power conditioner? Same question for my ARC Ref 6 pre amp. Thanks again. Mike. 

@tattooedtrackman 

As with many other aduiophile companies, they essentially take their best technology and begin stripping it down to make lower models. The Denali uses their best electric outlet sockets.  There are 6 separated zones, instead of 2 on the Venom V16. The Denali uses much more advanced filtering techniques.  On the main power cables, they use thicker wire, 8 and 10 gauge internal wires. Also, there are additional shielded cables that run within those 8 and 10 gauge mains (they're hollow to reduce skin effect).  The internal components are sealed in an oxygen free environment to prevent corrosion overtime. It runs the mains through a tube of material that bleeds off any excess noise or signal. It also uses a technology where energy is stored as a reservoir to reduce any form of delay in electric transfer. 

The Venom V16 removes all that tech and a few amenities and leaves it with their high-end base tech. Such as their cryogenic process, the use of hollow copper mains, but they're 12 gauge in this case and no internal shielded wire running though it. It uses internal tech to mitigate frequency crossover and noise from entering any of the internal components. It uses a chassis ground system for external use. It also has very good vibration control.

Both the Denali and the Venom V16 require a 20amp power cable. IN my case, I went with Shunyata's Alpha XC, although they recommend the Delta XC. However, I determined that with the Delta XC, it was not able to provide power fast enough to provide the best performance to my powered speakers.

I was using Audioquest's PowerQuest 3 power conditioner prior to this and the Venom V16 destroys it, performance-wise.  I imagine the Denali would decimate the Venom V16 in terms of performance and it darn well should for $4000 more dollars.

When you break it all down, what you're paying for is a lowered noise floor and better dynamics. 

Hi. I know this is an older post but what is the difference between a power distributor like the Venom V16 or like the Denali Power conditioner or other mods. 

I agree with Carbon Miller about how even the most subtle vibration can throw the music "off." Of course, one can become completely obsessive about this, but it doesn't hurt to try some minor "mods" such as putting Blue Tack on an outlet cover (and my outlet covers are made by Furutech to match their outlets). But I wonder...

Perhaps a Delta would suit me more than the PS10. It might have some "protections, " as one ascends the line into the Reference level I don't yet know about.  This can be a beautiful hobby if we learn things even as we are immersing ourselves in music. And educate our ears at the same time!

 

 

 

@gbmcleod 

Thanks! I discovered how not only vibration is a strong source of distortion, but general EMI even with "shielded" cables.

I have an in-law who was going to 3D-print some cable risers and separators, but that seems to have fallen by the way-side :(.  Maybe one day it'll happen.  I am sure it will be better than cardboard. ;)

I want to commend you for keeping your cables separated and not touching each other. I’ve written about this in forums for years, and have done it since 1990. It makes a significant difference in the sound, as does turning off power outlets, lights and especially the microwave(!) unit in the home, regardless of whether or not you have dedicated circuits (which I’ve had since 1990, also) or not. These things all affect the sound. I also don’t have anything touching the floor. NOTHING. And despite naysayers, it’s a reality. I was once a writer for one of the major "underground" mags, an editor for another and a writer, later on in the early 21st century for a third magazine. I learned over the past 40 years to pay attention to EVERYTHING.

Good for you that you are are so diligent. It can only improve your musical experience and some things (keeping cables separated) cost nothing at all! Some people just don’t trust their own ears, and think that measurements will tell them what they need to know (something I strongly disagree with!) I suppose it depends on the type of music one plays, but Miles Davis’ Kind of Blue, reissued as a 45 so you need multiples records for the whole album, would show even a half-deaf person (oh wait, that’s me now that I’m in the 7th decade of life) that a measurement will not convey the feeling of the music itself. Perhaps some people just don’t feel that music that deeply, which moves one from music lover, to music "enjoyer" (while they’re on their computer or smartphone at the same time).

As they say, "I couldn’t EVEN."

 

P.S. My PS Audio Power Plant went on the fritz, and I decided that on Monday, I will be buying the level below  yours, the Venom PS 10. Can't wait!

Interesting find in the Venom 16. Thank you for sharing that here. 

UPDATE:

While exploring a different issue, I discovered something about the Venom V16 that IS NOT advertised by Shunyata and apparently is a fantastic feature.  It has their CGS grounding tech.  The distributor has the copper ground socket just like their higher and highest tier power distributors!

Now, I had built a grounding box for a custom cable, but now I think I will build a grounding box for the Venom V16.

Well done. Not only conditioners, pretty much everything. Right down to parts like AC outlets, outlet covers, transformers, caps, wires. If you can find something not improved with vibration control let me know. It won't be a first but it will be rare.

Now if you want to learn even more replace the optional feet with Nobsound springs. When you hear $30 worth of springs perform far better than your (I assume) much more expensive option feet, this is the beginning of real knowledge. For advanced degree learn springs isolate but they do resonate, and so some degree of damping will improve them. Then to find out what that is like try Townshend Pods or Podiums. But Nobsound are so cheap I would start there.

@millercarbon 

Just an update, I had the opportunity to switch the feet on the V16 back to their factory stock and the difference is fairly jarring. My holographic image flattened a bit. Instruments are well placed and clear as usual, but don't seem to move as  deeply forward or backward in space or as far outside the confines of the speakers as it had before. I ran it with the original feet for a few days to see if it just needed to settle a bit.  There wasn't any perceived difference.

So I put the steel feet back on and the music was more lively and my holographic bubble returned. It can therefore be discerned that the Venom V16 is indeed susceptible to vibrations and it can affect performance. O_O I learned something new.

Thank you for taking the time with your follow up post. 

I have never had electricity described to me the way it was to you in terms of available power. The power draws on those other devices shouldn’t have impacted the available power to your components at all. I do believe the power systems of the chargers, lamp, and eraser are “dirty” and would generate noise. They describe the Component to Component Isolation (CCI) feature filters noise and doesn’t reflect back into the system. It does make me wonder if the Venom 16 has the ability to filter harmonics associated with those types of power supplies. I wonder if the unit you received has a defect and it isn’t working properly?

Before I make my final decision to purchase the Venom 16 I think it would be wise for me to contact them with some questions regarding the CCI feature. 

Cheers!

UPDATE:

I contacted Shunyata to discuss what they thought about the devices connected that were making the noise on the system and the answer I got back was intriguing and new to me.

It seems that some devices when "off" or not in use are still drawing power. Phone/device chargers are never "off" and are constantly drawing power waiting for the device to be connected to complete the circuit. Two of the lamps that were connected both have this type of switch.  One actually has a USB device charger built in.  The other uses the exact same type of transformer as a USB charger. The Steadtler Electric eraser was also drawing power.  It's on switch is spring loaded and only activates while the button is depressed.  I also had a USB hub connected.

It was advised to disconnect all those devices and have them on a socket not connected to Venom V16. Not just because of noise.  But because those devices were leeching power that could be used to power the speakers and amps.

Sure enough, I disconnected all those devices as instructed.  I had the speakers going while I was doing this, and once I pulled the lamp and USB hub specifically, the sound got louder. Which was weird; it could have been my imagination, but after all things were removed, the sound quality was richer and louder. The computer and monitor are on Zone 2 and the Sub and Speaker are on Zone 1.  That's all that is currently plugged in. The monitor was more bright and vivid.  I had to have my wife verify.

So, does that mean that the more devices that are plugged into the Venom V16, the lower the power output or lower the quality. *shrug*? Possibly.

@femoore12  

The fan and desk lamp I used to help burn in the Venom V16 (per the recommendation of the Shunyata rep) are ungrounded and had no effect on the speakers.

In regards to the Point-O-Matic and the Steaedtler Electric Eraser, I think it has something to do with mechanical electric noise, versus standard electrical noise.  I seem to remember reading something about the effect electrical mechanical noise has on an electrical line.  For example, how you could turn on a blender in the kitchen, and the speakers in your living room receive a hum.

Sadly, I am renting this house and can't make changes to the wiring. I requested, at the time, to be able to change out the electric sockets themselves and was granted that.

If it comes to pass that we are allowed to buy this house, I will reconsider re-wiring because it is an older house and the ground wires are all aluminum.

@millercarbon   

I have not tested the Venom V16 with its original feet vs the optional feet.  Largely because when I set it up, the system needed to burn in, so doing any sound comparisons would have been skewed. The second problem will be the delicate wiring situation I have going on.  I have all cables balanced just right on risers and in positions where they don't touch each other.  Pulling the unit out of its small shelf would wreck my current wire setup :(. 

If the option comes up where I am forced to reposition the unit and or cables, I will take that opportunity to test it out. :)

@guakus

After about a month of use, it has settled in and performance is consistent. There is however something that it does not protect against and that is ground loop noise from ungrounded or poorly grounded devices.

Thanks for additional data on your review! That is an interesting phenomenon. I wonder it it's simply related to not having a dedicated ground on those plugs. I may experiment with that scenario with my current power conditioner when I get home this week. I do keep my switching power supplies on a separate power conditioner (Panamax unit) to try and isolate those. That seems to work for my system.

Cheers!

I like, "someone at Shunyata" because when I bought my Cobra there was no "someone" there was only Caelin! He brought it out, we tried it, that was it. You get a LOT more for your money nowadays! Hard to say for sure without comparing but my guess is you got more for your $2k than you could have got for just about any amount of money back then.  

The improvements you noted with dynamic shadings, micro-dynamics, together with the lower noise floor revealing greater detail, these kinds of improvements just go on and on. As you notice there are other things that still create noise even with a conditioner. That is just the way it is. No matter what you do there will always be some simple thing that makes it even better still.  

If you want to blow your mind some time, try flipping off a lot of the breakers in your panel. You can also unplug stuff but this is a lot easier. Listen with breakers off and you will hear a lot of the same improvements you get with the Shunyata. Mostly due to eliminating a lot of RFI, and this will give you some idea the effect of RFI on sound quality. 

Another one is vibration control. You mentioned getting the optional feet but not what difference they made. Were you able to listen with/without for comparison?

@millercarbon 


Thanks!  I was very excited to have this.  It seems Shunyata hadn't sent out any review product for folks to review.  I had been in constant contact with someone at Shunyata before I got it, so I had the inside scoop; so-to-speak.

Since these discussion boards are searchable in any search engine, I thought it was a good idea to write up a review. :)

@femoore12

Thanks!

After about a month of use, it has settled in and performance is consistent. There is however something that it does not protect against and that is ground loop noise from ungrounded or poorly grounded devices.

I am an illustrator and sometimes I use a light table or my electric eraser. When I use the light table, it makes a loud popping noise on the speakers. The electric eraser also makes noise on the speakers when I use it. These are ungrounded, and both are on the 2nd zone away from the power cables that power the speakers. So the Venom V16 will not protect against those types of devices if they are connected. To be fair, this happened on the Audioquest Powerquest 3 as well. It was even worse because those tools were connected to a power strip that was connected to the Powerquest. Also, I had a Panasonic Point-O-Matic pencil sharpener that does have a ground that also made noise on the line when in use. So I moved it to a different socket. It seems I should do the same with the light table and eraser, but there are no sockets near there and I use these at the same drawing table (the pencil sharpener doesn’t need to be by the drawing table.)

Very nicely done review, thanks! Good job telling us about your listening impressions. This more than anything else is what we need. As you’ve noticed there are some here who will ignore and skip right over all the great positive contributions just to nitpick and attack any little thing they can find. Ignore them. Keep up the good work.

I first learned the value of power conditioners 30 years ago but even now all these years later we still find people missing out. This upgrade, going from a decent power strip to a genuine power conditioner, is pretty typical of what a lot of people would do. In other words, a lot of people will find this useful. Thanks again for taking the time to write it up.

Thank you for posting this review on the Venom V16 power distributor. I have been looking for reviews on this product. I am now leaning toward pulling the trigger with the options you selected. I am using Synergistic Research Foundation cables (speaker, jumpers, and interconnects). I think this will be good match for those cables.

Thanks! 

They aren't using materials that are specifically designed to destroy the signal.

In the Foundation line, their lowest, is using silver conductors, air dielectric and their matrix shielding. They didn't add brass connectors, Polyethylene insulation, or add non-conductive additives to ensure a loss in signal strength. 

Synergistic used their most basic foundation materials.  The higher tier adds active elements and more gauge and more geometry to the wire. Hence they broke nothing at the lower level.  Audioquest on the other hand uses inferior products in their lower line to purposely dull the singal...like "Long Grain Copper," "Purple Copper" and "Spray Foam Polyethylene."

"In other words, Audioquest breaks their promise of, "Do no harm". So Synergistic is more "truthful to the source"?