After having various turntables over the last 40 years, I am seriously considering getting out of analog. The "vinylists" argue that analog playback sounds more natural, musical, and provides more of an emotional response. I have experienced this feeling several times while listening to my modest vinyl collection, and tend to agree....until I begin hearing pops, clicks, surface noise. I keep my vinyl generally clean and protected
However, after listening to the 40th anniversay edition of Jethro Tull's "Aqualung" I am more convinced that analog is just not worth the time, money and, maintenance. The dynamics on new Aqualung are superb and there seems to be much more detail to what I remember of the Mobile Fidelity remastered recording
I have a modest analog set-up Rega P3-24 with their upgraded PS and the Dynavector 10X5 MC. I was on the verge of upgrading to the new Rega RP-6 which includes a newly design PS, and a choice of color plinths. Even with a generous trade-in value offered by the dealer, I would still be putting in about $1300 + which would get me into the Dynavector DV 20MKII ( above their 10X5.)
I personally don't see the value regardless of the sonic qualitative edge of analog. Maybe, the money could be spent elsewhere or not at all. BTW, I am not getting into computer audio, and am STILL not convinced that a BASIC DAC will bring me closer to analog sound quality. Members have recommended Peachtree's DACIT, and even the supposedly new and improved Musical Fidelity V-DAC II. I have a Rega Apollo player. A great sounding player, but it has its flaws.
Therefore, I would like to hear the pros and cons of staying with analog....or just dumping it. Thanks
It's not really about "superiority" for me. My Arcam CD player presents a clean sound. It is also very flat as far as depth goes. I simply enjoy the sound of my records and what they bring to the party more. And, as a 58 year old, when i say "been there, done that" I'm speaking from experience.
Thesoundhouse is right on the money! I've had the same experiences, almost exactly. What I finally discovered is that when I'm craving listening to music, it's never digital.... because it's just doesn't sound like a performance, no matter how many thousands and 10s of thousands of dollars I spend. If you are focusing on the noise you aren't focusing on the music anyways...
I know the golden eared types can spend endless hours worried about minutia, ...
Why describe what you hear and prefer in emotionally neutral terms while describing what others hear and prefer as "minutia" [sic] of concern only to "golden eared types"? You made many valid points, only to undermine them with a descent into argumentum ad hominem. I see no reason to disrespect anyone else's hearing, musical tastes or sonic priorities.
Human hearing was developed over many econs to ensure survival. So we could hear the lion among all the other noises on the plains. This was few years before LPs came out.
Now, I got your point, it's just that it's getting to be a little much, this attempt to prove the so-called superiority of analog. Leave elvolution out of it.
Others have covered most of the questions you have to decide. What music do you have in your record collection that you value and can't hear otherwise? If it's not much, consider transferring it to digital before bailing.
If, OTOH, it's substantial, you should investigate WHY the surface noise is so significant. There are plenty of threads here on the topic, including a very recent one.
Despite Rok2id's scepticism, many on this forum and elsewhere listen to vinyl with little or no problems with surface noise. I'm one of them. I'm not going to argue this point from theory. I merely cite my experience while not in any way maintaining that it's valid for anyone but me. I can't tell Rok2id what to like and he can't tell me... and neither of us can tell you!
I have a reasonably good system for both digital and vinyl: a $6K universal disc player (including CD, DVD-A, SACD and Blu-ray) and a $20K+ vinyl front end. We have ~1500 digital discs and ~4000 LP's and enjoy them all. The advantage of digital discs is their convenience and of course they're inherently quiet. It takes me 20+ minutes/side to clean an LP but once I do it's almost invariably quiet enough so that we can enjoy the the natively higher resolution of vinyl (higher than blu-ray, just as film is still higher res than blu-ray for PQ). Home digital media have not yet matched the resolution of analog sources, whether in sound or in video.
From the above you might deduce that very expensive equipment and much work is necessary to do vinyl well. For me that has proved to be true. That will factor into your decision as it does for anyone. For myself, my LP collection contains many hundreds of releases that will never be available on any other medium. Abandoning those would be musically unthinkable. Degrading them by converting to (today's) digital would be audibly intolerable. But YMMV surely applies here, as everyone's collection, musical tastes and sonic priorities differ.
Viridian wrote: "There are tons of performances that have only been issued on LP and never remastered on any other format..."
There is another option. Over the past 10 years I've converted about 2,000 LP and open reel tapes to digital format. I now have my entire collection on a music server and, other than a few items with sentimental value, got rid of the LPs.
I resigned from the "audiophile" club long ago. Digital has its own issues, but I find it amusing when the vinyl advocates blithely overlook the inherent clicks, pops, surface noise, off-center holes, inner groove distortion and other flaws while proclaiming the format inherently superior.
My take? I have wonderful recordings on LP and lousy ones. Same thing is true of digital. Many of the complaints about modern recordings have zero to do with format. Rather, the problems are based in the fads and fashions currently in vogue in the recording industry.
I've got a couple of 2nd generation open reels made from master tapes back in the early 1970s. When I record them to digital, they sound just like the tapes! The digital process does nothing to change it. The same thing happens when I digitize my LPs - unprocessed, they sound just like the original LP.
I know the golden eared types can spend endless hours worried about minutia, but as respects impact on sound quality, I find the original choices made by artists, recording engineers and producers multiple orders of magnitude larger than the storage format decision.
"Also, I probably hear clicks, etc in only about 5% of my 3000+ albums."
If this is true, assuming you have normal hearing, then LPs ain't what they used to be.
"I have to say the small amount of surface noise is not a problem at all"
Would you be so forgiving if you heard noise on a CD? Would you tolerate a small amount of noise in a preamp or any other component? I almost said wire also, but the Lord stopped me in time. :) Seems as if noise is ok, depending on the source. One of my favorite CDs is very unpleasant to listen to because of the 'breathing' of the violinist. To me noise is noise, regardless of the source.
I agree with Elizabeth. Also, I probably hear clicks, etc in only about 5% of my 3000+ albums. If you're hearing it in most of your LPs, you might need to change your buying standards. I sold all of my 1100 albums when cd came out. I was dumb. I've done my best to replace those and increase the number. I ordered 5 new ones this Christmas alone. Digital does ZERO for me.
Since I have a large collection of vinyl (and also digital media) I have continued to own and use high-quality phonograph systems.
If I did not own a large vinyl collection already, I would probably not get into it now as back in the day, I bought most of my vinyl for $5 to $8 per lp, and that was the dominant format of the time. Now, new vinyl records are selling for $20 to $50 per record and I can't bring myself to buy them except in special cases.
That said, my vinyl still gives me something that my best digital has not matched, namely more air in the highs and faster sounding high frequency transients. The faster sounding transients add to the impact and realism I get from high frequency percussion instruments and that increases my you-are-there experience. Digital is not bad by any means, but it does not quite do the same thing that analog does, probably due to the types of digital filtering that are commonly used to roll off "unwanted" high frequency nasties.
I even get this extra air and impact from old cassette tapes I've made from my records years ago... it's definitely an analog thing. So I like having the best of both worlds.
Of course not every vinyl system will provide the kind of speed, air, and control that I get from my system, so many vinyl users will not hear this clear-cut difference in the highs (bass too, come to think of it) I'm speaking of. In fact, dare I say, that vinyl playback through digital amplification is a true blast if you get it right!
I have gotten out of vinyl just to get right back into. I have done this several times over the last 25 years. I did it as a teenager. OOH look at this new digital thing oooh! it is so convenient and it sound better so I thought. Then one day I digging through my things and I find my old vinyl collection and I say lets listen to some of this old vinyl. I find my old turntable head over to my former employer a hifi store where I worked while in college and buy decent cartridge and a used phonoamp. Find the same music from the vinyl and on CD (same master recording) and go wow where did that come from the vinyl kills digital I am back into vinyl. Then I do this for a few years and then I get stupid and get into home theater sell the turntable but keep the records. Then get tired of every year your freaking receiver or pre-processor is already outdated by the time you drive home from the AV store. Do that AV thing with tons of speakers every where for a couple of years until my live in girlfriend calls me up says I want to watch a movie wile I am out of town and she cannot figure out how to turn the freaking thing on. Sell all the stupid av stuff and buy a extremely expensive Krell DVD player a Krell integrated and a pair of B&W 802 Nautilus and a cable box. Did not even miss the AV junk. Then one day I horse traded into a Nakamichi CR7A cassette deck and while testing it before I sold it here on audiogon. I find some cassette tapes that I recorded off of vinyl and others off of CD and wow what a difference the cassettes made off of vinyl sounded better than the ones made off of CD. Then I do an A-B comparison of a NAK CR7A against a $10,000 Krell DVD player. The cassette deck wins. Now I bought a used Sota Star Nova turntable with a SME V, Koetsu Rosewood Signature and a krell phonoamp from an older gentleman who was one of my previous customers from when I worked in the audio store. Got it home and wow I have never been happier. My system has changed so many times I cannot count but now I always keep vinyl as the focus and supplement it with a decent digital rig. I have have a modified Mac Mini music server with a decent DAC and a Oppo BDP 95. The digital is just sound and it is convenient but when I want to listen to something really special I put a record on my Sota Cosmos MK IV. Do not get out of vinyl just enjoy it and use the digital just as filler.
You answered your own question in that vinyl has the inherited problem with the noises you mention. That did it for me too, although I came to the conclusion years ago that the noise distracted me to the point of not caring if I listened to music or not. When you listen to live music, you don't hear all the noises you mention, so why do "audiophiles" continue to seek the "Holy Grail" in their equipment and yet tolerate the noise? All the above responders gave good advice. It's your ears that are listening, and if the noise bothers you, get rid of the vinyl. Happy listening!
This is a hobby, if there are aspects you have tired of, move on. If the joy is gone from the whole ritual of the album, let it go. Your current system sounds like a dandy. Keep it to at least transfer music you may not be able to get from another source easily.
I still love my turntable, but mainly use it for music I have on LP's that I do not have available on disc. And don't be so quick to dismiss computer audio, a good music server or such, may open up a new door of musical enjoyment. Most of all have fun listening to the music.
Stay where you are, and don't invest another dime in analog. Start to sell of the vinyl and when the last lp is gone, sell the gear. I agree with you about bluray is the future with more refined dac's to come. Move to better speakers first. When Miles Blue comes out on bluray do a reality check against your vinyl of same. That will tell you that your vinyl affair is over.
If you have a decent sized vinyl collection in decent condition, I suggest "...Staying with" Analog and Vinyl", if not then I'd suggest moving on. FWIW, I made such a consideration some time ago, besides having a tuner, I'm analogless.
I have adopted digital wholeheartedly. As you mention, the noise inherent in vinyl has become a distraction to me. And the newer 24-bit DVD and BluRay based music sound absolutely fantastic, especially in 5.1 format...
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