Pass Labs INT 60 VS. Primaluna Dialogue Premium HP VS. Arcam A49

Oops, I meant to add..... We sometimes think that the greatest amount of care goes into show demonstrations, when in reality often times systems are cobbled together at the last minute from borrowing components from local dealers located near the shows.

Kenepeters, The only integrated on your short list that actually specs being capable is the T&A. I'm confident that there are a few more. I believe Dan Dagastino'd integrated might qualify.
I haven't heard  all of the vast amount of amps on the market. When I make a short list, I begin by eliminating those that could be technically compromised, and then choose the ones from that list based upon what I just plain like, and of course price/value.

I don’t doubt that some tube amps would do very well with this speaker. The ARC REF series would seem like good bets, for example, due to their combination of low output impedance (for a tube amp), robust power supplies, and other characteristics.

However, **if** the output impedance of the Dialogue Premium HP is not considerably lower than the output impedance of the non-HP version (as described in the Stereophile measurements I linked to earlier), and given the speaker’s impedance characteristics as shown in Stereophile’s measurements which Unsound linked to earlier (showing an impedance between 2 and 3 ohms for frequencies between about 60 Hz and 300 Hz, where a lot of music contains a lot of energy, while rising to considerably higher values in the mid-range and treble regions), the result of those impedance interactions **will** be weak bass and over-emphasized mids and highs, ***in comparison with the tonal balances that would result with many other tube amps and most solid state amps.*** The degree to which that effect on tonal balance occurs will be dependent on the output tap that is used and on whether triode or ultralinear mode is used. But it would be a significant effect in all of those cases (if, as I said, the amp’s output impedance is not considerably lower than that of the non-HP version).

That follows from basic EE circuit analysis principles, which of course cannot predict a lot about what we hear or don’t hear from our systems, but can certainly predict some things, including what I said in the preceding paragraph.

Whether or not the resulting sonics would be appealing to some listeners in some rooms is another matter, of course. But why take the risk, unless a meaningful and extended audition in familiar circumstances is possible? And even then, why invest the time that would be required for such an audition, when other candidates can always be found that would not have this issue?

And as Unsound said (rightly, IMO) in his recent posts:

What will work, and what will work best are different things.

When I make a short list, I begin by eliminating those that could be technically compromised....

Best regards,
-- Al

OP, If you cannot demo both before purchase and from my experience with Wilson, get the Pass.   My brother has a Pass Labs INT 60 and is terrific.  It's more linear than most Pass class A models.  1st 30 watts Class A and weights 93 lbs, it's a beast!

Unsound,
I’m not looking for another tube vs SS debate either. By now those number in the multiple hundreds. My point is that feedback from owners is significant and very valuable. Often times their actual experience with a product runs contrary to expectations based solely on test measurements. I see no rational reason to dismiss real life results because they violate preconceived beliefs.

No question good quality SS will work very well with the Sasha, actual listening encounters verify that certain tube amplifiers will not just "work" but succeed with stellar results. Bottom line  for me is that real world use/interactions takes precedence over measurements and test bench environments. Listening is the ultimate determining factor. 
Charles

I have had my Prima Luna HP with EL34's and 2 Mullard cv4003 as drivers and primaluna stock 12au7.  I have Aerial Acoustic 5T's.  

I auditioned it against Aerial 7t's.  If I ever purchase the 7T's I would be tempted to put in the KT150 tubes.  These have been well received for their tones in upper mid and then their stomping lows. 

Tube amps generate tone our ears appreciate.  That's why the best guitarist use tubes not SS.

I can sit and listen for hours each night and not get enough.  Nuf said. 



 

Unsound, you’re probably right about manufacturers hedging their bets to make a sale, but, sorry, Dave states his thoughts on whatever amp the customer has, if he’s heard the amp. Or at least, he used to. I always found Dave to be quite honest, both in his estimation of his products and other manufacturers as well. So, what might apply to others (in your statement) cannot be applied to Dave.

 I didn’t ask Dave’s recommendation for an amplifier when I bought the WATTS. (I knew what he used to design the WATTS: Goldmund Studio turntable, Rowland Coherence 1, Spectral DMA-50/Rowland Model 7s, MIT cables. ) And I already had a Rowland Model 5 when I first got the WATTS. And then got VTL 300s, later adding the Goldmund Mimesis 9.

I use my own ears for listening, not the manufacturer's, and when HP wrote his review on the  original WATTS, I could only nod my head in agreement on every point he made, and he was using the Goldmund Mimesis 9 amp. Since I had both a Goldmund Mimesis 9 as well as VTL 300s, as well as the Rowland I didn’t have to "figure it out." All I had to do was listen, and, aside from the Mimesis’ phenomenal resolution and airiness, the VTLs - aside from resolution - revealed everything the Goldmund did, and were superior in bass power (which doesn’t mean that much to me, but it was obvious, so...). The Rowland was great, too, by the way.

(SOME) tube amps will work just fine with Wilsons, as will SOME solid state. Sonically, the VTLs had no problem with the WATTS (the most difficult of all Dave’s speakers to drive, especially the first generation WATTS), which I kept until the Series IV WATT/Puppies. And since I’ve had actual long term experience with tubes (VTL, Jadis, VAC and CJ (not such a great pairing), perhaps that can assist those interested in tubes.

The ONLY way to KNOW anything is to try it Everything else is sheer speculation, and speculation can cause more problems than almost any other factor.

^"Speculation"?
I don't think that the principles of physics and electrical engineering can be merely disregarded as "speculation". Without the principles of which, this conversation probably wouldn't be happening.

You speculated on tube amps and Wilson speakers, setups you have not had the experience with and I have. Extensively. Even in science, one does the experiments to PROVE the result.  Your response  in this particular matter IS  speculation, because, according to those principles and physics, the WATT isn't a good match for tubes.
The REALITY, however,  is that Wilsons DO work with tubes. So, whatever principles and law of electrical engineering apply, they still do not negate the reality of the fact that Wilson speakers work with tubes. The "why" might be interesting, but if it works, it works. And they do. I'd expect them to be much easier to drive now than 30 years ago.