What artist do you put above all others in terms of lack of talent but somehow has achieved success?
For me Madonna has to be the queen of mediocrity (mediocre being a compliment in this case) - can't sing or act and what's with the fake english accent after living there a whole two years. And don't get me going with all these new female jazz "singers" with that vomit inducing vibratoless whisper that seems to have become mandatory in that genre today......Jones clones.
In the words of Beavis to Buthead "Change it or kill me."
This is how I feel when a Billy Joel song comes on the radio. If I'm not in a position to change the channel I have to run around with my fingers in my ears singing loudly so I can't hear the awful sounds coming from BJ's mouth. If I were in the CIA, I would force the suspected terrorists to listen to this music. They would be spilling there guts like a National Enquirer reporter with indisputable proof that Tom Cruise is gay. But alas, we can't run afoul of the Geneva convention.
Also, one day I had the unpleasant experience of being exposed to one of the greatest lame duck artists of all time. I was enjoying a warm and sunny summer day on my boat docked on a pier located on one of the Great Lakes. My blissful day was blatantly interrupted when some moron docked his boat in the slip next to mine with Jimmy Buffet music blaring from his speakers. The knuckle dragging troglodite stomped away from his boat but had the audacity to leave his music playing. This put quite a damper on the day with this offenisve music honking from his crappy sound system and there was little I could legally do to stop the noise. I only managed to endure this torture by imagining myself pulling out an RPG launcher from the hold and firing a grenade for a dead on strike on the center of his boat. The huge fireball that was once his cockpit would send his vessell to the bottom like the HMS Hood. My fantasy continued with the Jimmy Buffet loving idiot returning to his slip only to find a mushroom cloud and a cauldron of bubbles where his boat once was. Good thing I don't own an RPG or that guy would have been minus one boat and a Jimmy Buffet casette tape.
Thomas- my dog can get into the British Isles without the 6 month wait. Actually, according to immigration the US does not consider N.I to be part of the British Isles.
Tina Turner does nothing for me and I consider lame but I do not know quite were to put her on the "Loomis scale" of lame. I walked out of a live performance by her out of boredom.
Perhaps 3? "artists who don't have much musical ability but aren't especially annoying ass clowns and have some visceral nice-guy appeal to their misguided, though harmless fans (jimmy buffet, phil collins)"
tt, bong et. al. i love buckley, but i can see where he can be offputting on vinyl--he's very theatrical and emotive; like rufus wainwright or antony/johnsons there's a showtuney aspect to this music which can sound a bit fey if you're a rockhead or in the wrong mood. however, i saw buckly play live a the green mill in chgo and he really, really kicked it--great voice, real power and, at least when unembellished by a lot of studio sheen, really good material. you might check out the live at sine disc, which is closer to what he was about. how does someone drown in three inches of water, anyway?
TT: "Grace" is more about a sense of mood, and also needs to be placed next to the other prevelant music of the day, which was largely Grunge in 1992. A very quiet album next to that music, so I guess it was about contrasts.
I have the vinyl version and it is quite stunning on a good sound system and I think his vocal takes are widely respected by his musician peers. Robert Plant of Led Zep said it was one of the reasons he has focused on his blues, country and bluegrass cannon--really loved the soundstage.
BTW: His mother is really upset, claiming that the actual output that was released in 1992 does not match the actual quality of master tapes she has heard, which had many layers that were removed from the final mix, so I expect you will see a "directors cut" version released by the estate, which she administers, down the road.
Hey, this is not in any way intended to be a lame duck nomination and I think I am missing something here. Some time ago I bought Jeff Buckley's "Grace". I had read nothing but praise for it from every angle, read up on his life to enhance the listening experience and much as I have tried I just can't get into it at all. The fact that tracks off it, notably "Halillua" (I know, wrong spelling but I can't be assed) went off the charts means the whole world except me is dialing into something that is going over my head. I know the problem has got to be me here. I would love to hear your comments on this album and I know there will be many (if not all) positive ones and maybe you can convince me before I resign myself to having wasted $18.99. This isn't an audiophile issue and it's not a real catchy track that you would expect to reach the #1 spot with general listeners. Nice track and well sung but its massive success surprises me. Better still, does anybody else NOT like it......I am starting to feel like a freak of nature.
Easy - Ashlee Simpson and Taylor Swift. Makes me embarrassed to be a fellow biped. One a lighter note I was in a dive bar (think stage surrounded by chicken wire) in arizona a few years back and a terrible band was trying to play. Lead singer? hollers something completely unintelligible, picks up a full bottle of Jack Daniels and chugs the ENTIRE thing! The bartender and I exchange a "Did I just see that?" look and the band launches into a new song (from the drums I seem to recall it was Back in Black) and the singer continues trying to sing. Watched him completely disintegrate. To his credit he kept trying up until the ambulance showed. Seriously! Moral of the story is that at least Ashlee and Taylor dont vomit in front of me.
I saw Sheryl Crow live in Austin a few years ago, my wife loves her and dragged me to the show, and you know what I have to admit........she sucked. My wife even said she sucked. Sorry, I had to throw that in.
just a word in defense of sheryl crow. i'm not gonna claim she's godlike, but i think she gets unfairly maligned, probably because she's milfy and pops up a lot in people magazine. she's actually a good musician, with a knack for melody--like steve miller or bryan adams, she can knock out a catchy, dumb radio single. i'm all for artists who have actual songs, as opposed to simply a sound.
Aaaaah, the Who at at LA Coliseum, 1982. That was a great show as far as I can remember - a lot of hallucinogens going 'round, not that I partook ;0)
You're right, Cassandra needs to abandon her eclectic crap and just start crushing the classic standards. I'd love to hear her do songs that made Ella & Sarah Vaughan great.
DeeDee Bridgewater is another great voice undermined by her taste in music. Her 1997 "Love and Peace: A Tribute to Horace Silver" and '98 "Dear Ella" are brilliant. After that, hit & miss, at best. At worst, pure schlock.
On Cassandra Wilson she reminds me of Tierney Sutton for one reason, the both have sublime voices, and really aweful choice in music.
I am very impressed with what Shelby Lynne did with her brazen rip off of Dusty Springfield with "Just a Little Lovin'" not makeing it better, or a complete copy, but rather an homage.
I actually like the Shelby Lynne album better than Dusty in Memphis.
I would love to hear a Cassandra Wilson or Tierney Sutton album of _____________ sing the Cole Porter Song Book.
Or maybe I'll just let Ella sing it again, and again, and again,
The Who was long my favorite rock band, and sadly they did suck at the Super Bowl. Nothing like the force of nature they were on their first "farwell" tour when I was a freshman in high school, in 1982, the Rosemont Horizon in Chicago. The only better concert I saw in Chicago was at some dive off of Maxwell Street my brother took me to see Koko Taylor and Johnny Lee Hooker, that was awesome.
conceptually, i'd divide the foregoing into specific categories:
1. artists of no discernible musical ability who nonetheless have value as image makers, trendsetters etc. (madonna,bon jovi, cher) 2. especially annoying ass clowns who nonetheless have musical ability (rod stewart, sting, u2) 3. artists who don't have much musical ability but aren't especially annoying ass clowns and have some visceral nice-guy appeal to their misguided, though harmless fans (jimmy buffet, phil collins) 4. artists who play execrably bad music skillfully (norah jones, dave matthews, john mayer) 5. completely worthless "artists" who have neither charisma or visual appeal and whose derivative, addle-brained product is wholly unlistenable (nickelback)
ergo, by careful analysis you must arrive at the conclusion that the single most worthless performer extant is, in fact, nickleback. who, according to billboard, have sold 30 million records, most of anyone in this decade. consider the karmic implications...
02-08-10: Viridian Cassandra Wilson seems to pay homage to the great vocalists of the past, not that she is in their class, while still having her own style and voice. Some of her material has been variable, but at her best, she has a lot to recommend her.
I'm right there with you in regards to Cassandra. She actually has a voice on the level of the greats when she's on, it's just undermined by the majority of crap music she chooses.
Her '83 disc "Blue Light 'Til Dawn" has some great music and phenomenal vocals on it. "New Moon Daughter" has a few, too. But, I don't have much patience for most of her other stuff - especially the New Agey crap. She seems to have trouble picking or sticking with a single coherent style.
That's funny Bongo. Hey, I am planning on going back home for a few days mid-summer - would you mind if I used you as a tour guide of my own home town, I think you know your way around better than I do. That was a beautiful city Bongo before it all got blown up in the 70s - fantastic architecture, but most of it is gone. I popped over to the Bourbon thread, but I as a beer drinker I am out of my depth. Now, if it was a "puff" thread.........
You f......ker!!!! The Crown - Jesus Christ it really is a tiny world. Hey, you didn't happen to stop off for a cup of tea in my mum's house while you were at it. Looks like you were just about everywhere else that I like to be but can't right now. Like I said, I was hoping to be shooting off there to leave my dog with my family while I hop to Brazil for a bit, but I forgot about the six month planning/wait bit for taking an animal in. Actually got myself registered as a deaf guy and everything so he could come in the cabin with me. Well, now he gets to be my wing-man for the babes on the beach. None of that old six month malarky for Brazil. Did you ever check out the Mrs Robinson scandal?
Agree - I saw Robert Plant perfoming at a Queen/Freddy tribute concert concert. Looked like someone had loosened the valve and let the air out of a blow-up dummy - really dreadful. Yes, the whole trick is to hang up your badge before it gets to that. Mark Knopfler is another guy I had respect for but after hearing his solo stuff it was like he was saying "hey guys, look how much I suck now". It becomes hard to separate that image form the original.
Biggie and 2Pac had the right idea - get shot while you are on top.
TT: Notorious BIG's "The Ten Commandments of Crack" was on heavy rotation at the Bongo House over the weekend, along with Ice Cube's "Had a good day." Some really good tunes came out in the 1990s.
I nominate the Who for yesterday's amazingly bad performance. It is always nice to see two old codgers sing off key, motionless on stage.
Other people who continue to dial it in are Aerosmith, Clapton, Sting and Phil Collins. Every dog has their day, but these guys just need to rest by the fire place.
Caught your comment over on the "rap" thread. I agree.....but, for me at least, what makes a good thread is disagreement and fighting words or it all gets a little boring after we have our initial say. Props to Macdad for losing it over on the rap thread and to Bongo for responding - loved it! Just shows we are all adults and can disagree, have words and dust it off and be friends again. I almost went there with Martykl on Leonard Cohen but he was such a nice guy ( I wished he wasn't) I just couldn't do it. There has to be plenty of people who have a favorite that even they know is crap, but just like dating that ugly chick and justifying it by something as bizarre as her having great personality it would be great to see some some defense of "lameness" to provoke a bit of controversy. Not trying to start anything, but why will Beethoven's Fifth never live up to, say, the creative genius of 2Pac's "Wonder Why They Call You Bitch." or Mahler's 4th Symphony (or Miles Davis' Kind of Blue for that matter) never reach down so deep in our souls as Notorious B.I.G. with "Hypnotize" ??? I am sure very many, (actually most) people on here LOVE hip-hop and will be happy to tell us why. While I was at the mall I saw a used John Tesh CD for $1.99 and couldn't resist (how can you claim to have eclectic tastes if you don't have at least one JohnTesh CD in your collection). I brought it home and popped it in for a laugh and he started the track off with "take a deep breath, take a deep breath" I thought the next line was going to be "this is going to hurt", but no - it was brilliant - so uplifting. Now John and Vanilla Ice are my two favorite all-time artists. And just to think I could have wasted that $1.99 towards my $15.99 slutfest pay per view bill at Motel 6.
TT: I am the only troublemaker on Gon who had the brass balls to nominate Midleton Whiskey as the best of bourbon under the Best Bourbon posting. Please join in.
Had weird experience yesterday. I decided to get off my property and drive to the mall. I picked up a sampler type CD called "The New Jazz Divas" with one song from each of the usuals (13 in all). I loved Diana Krall singing "Temptation" nice lazy track with chunky beats and, well sung with a bit of life to it, just when I expected to see zzzzzzzzz coming out of the speakers. Life is full of surprises.
You've got a good point, Mac, considering those unfamiliar with the classic artists will never get a chance to hear them on popular radio. So, anyone that opens the door to these by paying tribute, has to be given some credit.
That's why I've never been too hard on Harry Connick, jr. He always gave credit where, and helped introduce a new generation to jazz, no matter how lite his own stuff may be.
J Buffet has always been lame, and I have never understood the attraction. But back to an earlier post regarding Norah Jones-Diana Krall-et all(very similar). Yes their music is boring, I agree, but the first Norah Jones album was something different to me, especially with the crap that's been on the radio the last 15 or so years. I still enjoy her first album, and it made me pick up Diana Krall (really like The Girl in the Other Room, her other albums are elevator music), Madeliene Peyroux (love Careless Love), Jane Monheit (not a fan at all), Melody Gardot (nice, like her) Teirney Sutton (one great album, Dancing in the Dark, what a voice, the rest has been forgetable) and that led me to other places:
Billie Holliday, Ella Fitzgerald, Etta James, Frank Sinatra, Nina Simone, and on and on. Man, my parents and grandparents had some great singers. I would have never found these recordings without their lesser modern day equivilants.
So yes, many of these contemporary light jazz singers are pretty limited, and just re-hasing material previously released by the masters, but in many instances it can lead you to the well of great material.
I really didn't know much about Ella or Billie Holliday before Norah Jones or Diana Krall, and now they are constant and well loved companions.
Grateful Dead - ok, I'll spot them the first go-'round cause it was the 60's and all. Free love, drugs, communal living, 2 hour extended jams, etc.
But, by the time we got to the 80's and they were the top grossing tour year in, year out, staying strictly at the Four Seasons hotels and flying in by jet helicopter, while a new generation of upper middle class kids were sleeping in the parking lot pretending at the 60's, the hippy thing was a $70 million a year sham. Unwashed Spinners ripe with the biting smell of acrid sweat and Petruli oil is enough to make anyone with a nose vomit.
And the $24.99 Jerry Garcia ties at Macy's and JC Penny?
Wait, I haven't even discussed their music...Then again, why would I? I loved taking acid and mesc, nitros balloons, etc. as much as the next guy, but their music still bored me. How many different ways does the world really need "Dark Star".
And was Jimmy Buffet ever actually good? He should be taken out behind the woodshed just for making Tommy Bahama shirts popular.
Ah Kelly's - Bongo, you are making me homesick, you have actually been in my old watering hole, god, it's a small world. I love the pub culture back home with all the non-stop banter that goes along with it and I never realized how much we really do drink back there until I left and got among normal people out here. Things are changing for the better too re. the troubles. Have you been reading about Mrs Robinson? Google "Mrs Robinson" for a giggle - amazing that a a shag on the side could (and is) bring a country to its knees. When I lived there. around the time for last orders more often than not, the bar would turn into a scene from an old John Wayne movie with fists and bar stools flying everywhere. Glad to say things have mellowed out a bit now. Related story - when I was at university I was dating an aristocrat and being working class ( but pretending not to be) I brought her to Belfast and checked into the Europa Hotel, Belfast's top hotel at the time to impress her. The hotel is right opposite the oldest bar in Belfast (possibly Ireland) and It was my regular. She was very excited to see the inside of the bar and get a glimpse of my background so we got showered and dressed and crossed the road to go in. Just at that moment the windows came crashing out and a huge brawl emptied out into the street, bar staff in aprons with sleeves rolled up and fists flying like windmills, there were probably fifty people involved. My cover was blown.
TT: I like the old growth Yew forest next to the monk rehab hospital. I am five generations removed here in America but the family name is still found in town. Visited last year.
Do you still have family there? I don't miss the weather there at all, but the humor and non-stop banter Is what I miss. I was actually going to fly over next week but that got put on the back burner til mid summer. Portglenone - very nice little place.
Thomastrouble. Isn't it funny a fat little makeup wearing pansy can make money with a routine like that?
Whitesnake is no worse than all of their peers of the mid 80's. Rotten garble.
I guess there's a market for all sorts of crap, but that's what the majority of people (at least in the U.S.) want to hear. There's a lot of good talent out there, but the majority of Americans prefer total crap. Anyone who watches American Idol is only contributing to this.
Darkmoebius, I couldn't agree more. Limp Bizkit's gotta be playing clubs with two dollar covers by now. I haven't even heard the name in 10 years. I've got to give them credit though, they know how stupid the general public is. I think the target market is the 'can't understand morning talk show' segment. I hate the fact that so many talentless people can actually pass themselves off as musicians in some way or another. I blame it on a lack of music education and trailer parks.
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