musician aquarius r2r dac any good?

@viethluu with R2R DACs, you will enjoy music more and not worry so much about the source. Seem like you are set on Aquarius, it is an excellent R2R to start with for sure. Do give Lab12 DAC1, Rockna Wavelight, and Aqua La Scala a listen too if you are able too. Speaking of La Scala, you could actually get one now quite below the RRP, ask your dealer about it. 

I am very nervous though. This is the first time I use r2r dac. I always use delta sigma DAC in my system, so I dont know what change I will introduce to my overall synergy.

I wouldn’t worry.  I think you’re in for a real treat. 

@dubz thanks for the infor! how do you describe the sound of the Pegasus?

The Pegasus has a nice wide sound stage and is also deeper in sound stage than the Cutest. The base is effortless, fast, and tight although I do have four subwoofers.

The midrange is very well balanced and smooth. The top end has great sparkle and good detail but yet doesn't cause fatigue. It's very well balanced and musical. A really enjoyable DAC. I use i2s input and the balanced xlr outputs to my preamp. 

I have no regret buying it and I'm sure I'll enjoy it for a few years at which time I'll see what has emerged onto the market and look at what is available at that time for an upgrade. 

@arafiq I am very nervous though. This is the first time I use r2r dac. I always use delta sigma DAC in my system, so I dont know what change I will introduce to my overall synergy.

Whether a Pontus ii is better then Hugo or not is of course subjective. But I can tell you they’re quite different in how they sound. Either way, it looks like you’ve already settled on Aquarius. Congrats! 

@gladmo The Pontus ii is very comparable to my current Hugo2, so for me it is more like a side way move rather than moving up the DAC ladder. In case you dont know, I am planning to use a DDC with my new Aquarius DAC, maximizing the i2s inputs.

On second thought, I left out some pertinent info about my Pontus II + Hermes setup that's needed to make more sense of it.  I'm not using USB. I'm using AES/EBU from a streamer and the I²S connection between the Hermes and Pontus II.

@anzaanimalclinic Ah crap — thank you for the correction.  My bad.  Prices now look like $6405 and $1772, respectively.  Still, it’s more than double the price of the Aquarius so the principle holds.  A much more apt comparison would be with the Venus ll. 

Pontus II + Hermes DDC with OCXO clock is in your price range. I’ve shared my thoughts in another recent thread, so I won’t go off about it here, but the combination, in my system, is far greater than the Pontus II alone and the price is still not that high. It makes the Pontus II alone sound comparatively unfocused and unappealing to me.

Side note of interest: according to some online data I found, OCXO (in the Hermes reclocker) is approx 50-100 times more frequency stable than TCXO technology (in the Iris reclocker). I’m not suggesting that the Hermes clock replaces the duty of the Femto clock in the Pontus II, but my opinion is that it adds magic and the premium for using both devices is certainly worth it, at least in my system.

@viethluu Mea Culpa, Mea Culpa - I meant to reference @auroravengeance who stated

 @arafiq  the Aquarius is basically a clone of Denafrips Terminator. Musician is an original brand created by the company that develops and manufactures Denafrips stuff in China, that is why Musician and Denafrips’ stuff look nearly identical. Denafrips is just a brand created by a distributor company in Singapore.

Denafrips is much more than a brand.  Their products as you agree are engineered at a higher level.  The Aquarius uses Femto clocks the Terminator OCXO and the Terminator has separate power supplies for the digital and analog sections.  I don't believe the parts in the Musician DAC's are better than Denafrips.

I had a Terminator and now a Terminator Plus with an Iris DDC.  The Terminator prefers the I2S input.

FWIW the prices quoted by @soix are Singapore dollars the US equivalent are $6460 for the TP and $1790 for the GAIA, my Iris was $ 550.  The Iris was less expensive than the Clock cables, less expensive than the power cord and less expensive than the HDMI cable I use with it.  For me it fixed the gremlins with USB.  

Again, for perspective, the Terminator + costs $8850, and if you add the GAIA it ups the total cost to $11,300.  The Aquarius costs like $3135 all in.  

@viethluu

With regard to issue three, I think it is system specific in my case. You can perhaps check with other people here who have the Aquarius.

My question is: why do you pick the terminator over the Aquarius if the terminator will be the slower DAC?

I don’t think Sandu meant that the T+ is slower than Aquarius, rather slower than other hi-end dacs. The T+ is in a different class than the Aquarius. I would choose the T+ as an upgrade because it is in the price range I could afford (willing to pay) buying used.

My impressions are based on Sandus´ reviews. If he is wrong with regard to the T+ then perhaps someone could correct him. However, you have a point, Sandu should have mentioned the dacs that were better than the T+.

"I’ve already covered quite a few R-2R ladder DACs by now, some of them were magnificent sounding like Denafrips Venus, Audio-GD R7 and Musician Aquarius. All of them had their pluses and minuses, but I feel that today’s unit terminates them all, climbing an aluminum throne as the best sounding DAC I had the pleasure of testing at my place."

"The amount of information that comes forward is staggering and as much as I liked the Musician Aquarius and that yummy sounding Rockna Wavelight, Terminator Plus goes a little higher, delivering a clearer, a punchier and a faster overall performance."

"Terminator Plus reigns supreme in here, closely followed by a Rockna Wavelight, Musician Aquarius, Audio-GD R7 and Denafrips Venus."

@soix

While I’d love to have a Terminator Plus too, for the price difference I think I could live with turning the Aquarius off and on, and that’s IF this is an issue with other equipment at all. Just some thoughts/perspective FWIW

100% Agreed.

I have to say, problem #3 is probably specific to certain equipment. Why not work with iFi and Musician to see if there is a fix? Plus, if I’m hearing you right, the solution is simply turn the Aquarius off and on and then it works. Is that really so hard? While the Terminator Plus May be a bit better (soundnews.net rated the Terminator a 94 and the Aquarius  93) it’s a MUCH more expensive unit, and even more so if you need to add the Gaia. While I’d love to have a Terminator Plus too, for the price difference I think I could live with turning the Aquarius off and on, and that’s IF this is an issue with other equipment at all and IF that issue can’t be fixed with firmware update, etc.). Just some thoughts/perspective FWIW.

@tjag I have no issue with your problem 1 & 2. But #3 does worry me though. I do not know how the DAC will interact with my transport (window 10 machine).

My question is: why do you pick the terminator over the Aquarius if the terminator will be the slower DAC?

I have the Musician Aquarius and it has a beautiful smooth sweet sound. I don’t have experience with other dacs to compare it to. I bought it based on the recommendation of Sandu Vitalie of Soundnews. Later Sandu Vitalie’s top recommendation was the Terminator Plus, although his Cons list is interesting:

• Not the most detailed sounding unit in its stock form
• Not the fastest sounding unit in its stock form
• If you want to squeeze the absolute best out of it, Denafrips GAIA is a must-have upgrade

Three things irritating in the daily usage of the Aquarius:

1- It has no remote.

2- The led lights are the size of pinheads making them impractically small to see in daylight.

3- The last issue is probably specific to my streamer. I have an ifi streamer connected to the dac through USB. When I power up my system Tidal detects the ifi streamer, but when I press play there is no sound. I have to restart the Aquarius, press play again then I get sound. This happens every time.

I bought the Aquarius new because I was in a hurry and didn’t want the Pontus. If I could do this all over again, I would go for a used Terminator Plus or a used Aqua La Scala MKII Optologic even though I would pay about 2k more. It is worth it the dac is the heart of the system.

@dubz thanks for the infor! how do you describe the sound of the Pegasus?

I just recently replaced my Qutest because I felt it was bright on extended listening sessions. I now have a Musician Pegasus and find it to be just the improvement I was looking for. I know it was not expensive but it's a great sounding r2r dac.

My system consists of the following.

Rogue Audio RP-7 preamp

Parasound JC1 monoblocks 

Focal Kanta 2 speakers 

Optical Rendue streamer, Antipodes Server.

Having said that, have you ever heard the Terminator and the Aquarius in person?

Always the most pertinent question.

Charles

@anzaanimalclinic You put word into my mouth! I would never compared the Aquarius to the Terminator. They are belonging to a different leagues. The Aquarius can only be compared to lower tier of Denafriqs DAC.

Having said that, have you ever heard the Terminator and the Aquarius in person?

@viethluu I think you are incorrect on the Musician Aquarius using better parts than the Denafrips Terminator.  The Aquarius uses Femto Clocks the Terminator a very high quality OCXO  That's a bit difference in part quality.  There is no way a their Femto clocks will come close the the OCXO clocks. Additionally the Terminator has separate power supplies for the digital and analog sections.  I see only one transformer in the Aquarius. 

The clock and power supply are critical for a DAC's performance, Denafrips does it better.

You get what you pay for.  The Terminator plus is almost twice the cost of the Aquarius.

Reviews note the Aquarius is a bit lean in the bass probably accounting for the brightness.  The Terminator is know for the deep clean low end.

@auroravengeance yes, I agree Denafriqs and Musician are basically the same design, But different voicing though. Musician also use better part inside which is why I prefer the Musician. But, I imagine I would be more than happy with the May or Denafriqs.

@arafiq  the Aquarius is basically a clone of Denafrips Terminator. Musician is an original brand created by the company that develops and manufactures Denafrips stuff in China, that is why Musician and Denafrips’ stuff look nearly identical. Denafrips is just a brand created by a distributor company in Singapore.

@viethluu  I have not heard the Bartok, Puccini, or Vivaldi yet because they are also outside my budget. But reading online about the DCS stuff, yes, I think a higher end R2R DAC should give you what you are looking for.

Based on your desired characteristics, you should also consider Denafrips Pontus II. I owned Qutest and preferred the Pontus by quite a bit. It adds a little warmth and heft to the sound that the Qutest was missing. 

Sounds like a great system, which is getting better. It would be helpful to see your system and venue. It is useful in assessing the impact of changes.

@auroravengeance offers a good caution that it can be easy to tip the balance to too analytical if not careful and lose the music (rhythm and pace). 

I also want to mention: My Macintosh system is capable of extracting very fine detail from a good recording. I found it out by borrowing a very expensive DCS Bartok DAC from my buddy. Of course, I have no money for that. But, I am looking for some DAC that can get close to the Bartok’ characteristic.

@soix about 40 inches from the front wall and 9 feet between the speakers

Got it.  So how far are your speakers pulled out from the front wall?

I know it is hard to describe, but brightness and transparency are two different things

Absolutely  true!
Genuine transparency has nothing to do with the coloration of brightness.

Charles

@soix 

I do not want to replace the Mcintosh gears because they match so well with my b&w speakers. I have tried other branches of amplifier and like none of them. My Chord is actually quite bright, but lack detail. I want a more transparent DAC, but not as bright as the Chord! I know it is hard to describe, but brightness and transparency are two different things

@viethluu 

My experience of listening to B&W speakers were that they were a tad on the bright side. Is it possible to borrow an Aquarius to test it at your home? IMO, the Aquarius might work better with speakers and gears that are more laid back in sound. 

Based on the sound you are looking for you might want to consider Audiobyte HydraVox. It is transparent, very detailed, and on the drier side, so I think it should be a very good match to your 805. 

How far are your speakers pulled out from the wall?  And if you’re looking for more transparency you might think about replacing the Macs as they’re probably the bottleneck there.  Just IMHO. 

I forget to mention, my system consisted of Chord Qutest (will be replaced) -> MC220 ( Mcintosh Preamp) -> MC352 (power amp) - > b&w 805 d3s (speakers).

My Quest sounds fine, but I am looking for a more transparent sound with deeper and wider sound stage. The Qutest does not have that deep of sound stage.

I have the Musician Pegasus in my HeadFi rig and like it a lot. Depends totally on what sound characteristics you’re looking for, but I’d recommend reading the review  of the Aquarius on stereonews.net to see if it might be a good fit.  It’s one of his favorite and highest-rated DACs for whatever that’s worth. All I can say is he also reviewed my Pegasus and I completely agree with his assessment. Hope this helps, and best of luck.

I had Musician Pegasus and of course when I wanted to upgrade one of the DACs I considered was Musician Aquarius. 

The funny thing about Aquarius, yes, soundstage was better, separation was better, everything sounded more coherent but it did not feel as musical as Pegasus. To my ears the sound was brighter but somehow didn't encourage toe-tapping like Aquarius. I guess it sounded more uh....analytical?

Anyway I tried many other R2R DACs, including the top-end XLR Rockna Wavedream and a few upsampling D/S DACs for good measures. And I settled on Lab12 Dac1 Reference. It's slightly cheaper than Aquarius and very barebone in features in that only accepts signal to 192 Khz, but the sound is glorious. Seriously, to my ears, it sounded better than Wavedream. It is certainly a good candidate for end-game DAC. If you have a local dealer you really should give this an audition. One other DAC that really impressed me at this price range was TEAC UD-701N, organic and non-fatiguing as well. You might want to consider that if you wanted a more complete package of streamer and pre-amp.