Looking for High Quality Streamer Only Options (NO DAC)?

@jbhiller I’ve had 3 DAC / Streamer combo units and used them as both streamer only and all in one solutions, Node 2i, Lumin D2, Lumin P1.  I’ve had stand alone streamers, Auralic G2 Aries and Lumin U2 Mini.  I have found stand alone streamers to sound a bit better than using a Streamer / DAC combo as a streamer only, that’s even when I bumped up to the P1 which is slightly different than most Combo units, it’s really a hub for digital, can act as a pre, has various inputs, volume control, HT Bypass and it’s the most $$ of the bunch.  Some will say streamers if they are doing their job correctly, don’t have an influence over the sound.  I have found I can hear the differences but they are subtle.  The differences between the sound of DAC’s is more pronounced.  If you really like the Lumin T3 you are borrowing the Lumin U2 Mini would be a great option.  Try it as a streamer only with your DAC’s and see how it sounds.  Innuos, Aurilac, Aurender and Lumin are all brands focused on digital streaming and have well thought out, developed implementation / support.  Any of these brands is rock solid.  BluOS is probably the most supported, easiest to use platform to use.  Hifi Rose hasn’t been around as long but has quickly made a name for itself with great stand alone streamers and combo units.  Units all have a large, really impressive screen that take up almost all of the front of the unit, they are sweet looking.  The 130b which is slightly over $ 5 grand is maybe one of the best out there, especially at its price point.  2 camps, one says streamers make no difference in sound, others claim they make a ton of difference.  I think it’s a little of both, if streamers are designed, implemented properly with really good power supplies along with limiting jitter / noise, the differences aren’t likely one of better sound but might be which you prefer based on subtle differences.  Synergy is key, choosing a streamer that has an output maximizing its performance that pairs with the best input to use with your DAC is key.  Some DAC’s are designed for USB implantation, others AES, other I2s.  Having a streamer that has prioritized the output that your DAC is designed to work best with makes a difference for sure.  
 

How’s the LTA DAC?  How does it compare to other DAC’s you’ve had? It’s on my list of DAC’s I want to try.  

@ararem , I'm seeing the Aries Mini as being both Roon Ready and not. I need it to be able to run Roon as an endpoint. 

Another shout out to the Bricasti M5. Roon ready, made in USA and fantastic support.

Interesting read on Bricasti

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/bricasti-m1-m5-m12-network-player-my-review-w-oem-response-brian

@mm1tt77 , Thank you for sharing your rich experience here. I’m particularly grateful for those sharing and being objective. You are sensitive to not falling in one clear camp, which I enjoy, and just report what you hear and think.

One issue for me is that I have no trouble spending $5k on a component, IF I can get great sound, stability, and a decade of use. With streamers (less so with DACs as the tech there seems to have reached a real highpoint), I really dislike the notion of spending $5k on something that weighs <10lbs and has as much tech as a Mac Air. It just seems insane to spend mid five figures for something that arguably should cost $1-2k. I suppose there is an issue with economy of scale (Apple sells more Macs than Auralic/Lumin combined sell streamers/DACs) so the price has to be higher to compensate for that and the design R&D. Still, it’s not like a great streamer is more sophisticated than a personal computer--guess I’m paying for design and implementation of the tech.  I get it--I've heard the same state of the art ESS Sabre chips sound different and better across different implementations.

With regard to DACs I’ve tried, I haven’t bounced around with them as much as I have with SS v. tubes, Class A, Class A/B, Push Pull, Class D, Class G, and the myriad analogue choices (tables, cartridges, preamps, and so on). So....I don’t have as much expertise or aural memory with DACs generally.

That said....

My journey has changed over the years. About 25 years ago, I began pushing and pushing toward modern, clean, "state of the art" sound in my components. Then, in about 2015 when I finally got a legitimate phono preamp my analog lapped my digital by a wide margin. And, I also tried some more dated technology--think 100 dB efficient horns, 300B amp, SET amps, etc.

At that time, the massive bloom and music washing over me from that setup changed my view. When I would go listen to modern designs (think high end dacs, transmission line speakers, and other modern stuff) I began to feel that the lens I was looking at the music was smaller, yet more defined and exact. BUT, in that presentation it was like looking at a perfectly detailed thumbnail of a musical event/recording session. Yes, it was arguably "perfect". It just didn’t sound like I was at a live performance or in the control room (they are here v. you are there sort of analysis).

So, my journey continued. I tried a wonderful tube DAC from Doge Audio. That thing was lovely with amazing parts quality and features. Just rock solid and sounded so warm. I made some gear changes and I gave that DAC to a friend, and moved on to use the DAC in my Marantz Ruby SACD player (nice Ken Ishiwata voiced product). The Marantz sort of split the baby between husky, warm tube DAC and a more clinical modern affair. Plus, the Ruby made poor recordings consistently sound pretty darn listenable. The Marantz Ruby played well with copious gear changes (amps, preamps, integrated, and all sorts of topologies).

For whatever reason, I didn’t think the Ruby mated well with my Luxman L590axii (one of the last of Luxman’s Class A offerings) and my preferred speakers, Revival Audio Atalante 5s. So I tried a few DACs laying around and friends’ stuff. This brought me to trying the $5k Lumin T3.  These Japanese cousins (Lux and Marantz) sounded good but not great together and I could hear each of them do better with other pairings respectively. 

Maybe I’m just frugal (despite spending so much money on this hobby otherwise) or foolhardy. I really like the Lumin T3 sound, but the screen, app, lack of power button and overall curb appeal seem questionable for a $5k unit. That’s said, I’m not opposed to buying one. I just think at this level I want to hear other stuff.

When I tried the Lumin T3 I was really looking for just a streamer and was surprised by its DACs sound quality. It’s very even across the sound field. It has reasonably good scaling ability (recall how I like sound to wash over me--not shoot at me like a laser).

The LTA Aero is very limited in its approach. Nonetheless, it’s just lovely. I suppose I could just mate it with some budget streamers first (Wiim Ultimate? or something like a Bluesound reference model). But...it would be nice to avoid a long audition process and selling my system short with a more budget product.

I don’t have enough experience with the Aero to say anything more or different from the reviews out there, which I think are pretty accurate. It may not be for everyone’s taste. I do, however, think folks who have been chasing stats, state of the art tech, DSD, crazy oversampling, low SINAID, might want to turn off their minds for a month and just listen to this unit. It’s utterly musical with ample detail. Highly Reccomended.

Again, if I knew a streamer would last and be relevant for 10 years I’d spend this money in a heartbeat. For example, I bet the Luxman NT-07 Network Streamer would be a great product. Luxman doesn’t make junk. But it’s $7500!!! Look inside:

https://www.musicdirect.com/equipment/network-audio-player/luxman-nt-07-network-streamer/

There isn’t even $500 of parts inside!

I should shut up on value here, as I suppose it’s an invertible part of our hobby these days.  Am I crazy or does anyone else think we are being utterly gouged on streamers in particular, DACs next.  There's just no way it costs Lumin the same to design and build this thing as my Technics SL 1200 GAE at $5k. And that's fine...my sticking point is spending such money on tech that is essentially a computer that will likely be wheezing to operate in 5-10 years from now. Hey, $500-$1000 per year though probably isn't that bad when I ammortize it. 

Maybe if the Lumin looked sexier and its screen didn't look like an early 1980s calculator! Sorry Lumin--nice casework otherwise I suppose. 

Thank you for sharing what you’ve learned!!!