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Innuos Zen Mk3 - Ultra Rendu and MAC mini

For critical listening, I’m primarily and Analog guy (tape and vinyl) and digital was accomplished with an Esoteric DV60. I’ve did fool around with computer audio with a Mac Mini and a Metrum Octave, then changed the DAC to a Ayre Codex. (Have a lot of SACD) I never did emotionally connect with the computer based presentation. As a result I stuck with the other formats until now...

My dealer was just bringing in the Antipodes line and loaned me the newer EX / CX combo with an Aqua Optologic La Scalia DAC. Oh my, that was the first time I’ve heard digital that made me get lost in the music, tapping my toes and letting the musical performance fully & emotionally engage me. Not once did I think about the technology. I was lucky to have this on loan for two weeks of bliss.

One observation I discovered after experimenting with the CX / EX combo was, while the EX by itself with its built in DAC was okay, (I still liked my Esoteric a better) then I tried the EX with the Ayre DAC, while that was better still, the Esoteric was the better music maker. Then I dropped the Aqua DAC in, oh my gawd, now we’ve edged out the Esoteric - this was a step up.
Context - the Esoteric though getting long in the tooth is arguably worth $1500 now, the Aqua DAC and the Antipodes EX would set me back $7000 for used gear. The Esoteric was a better value even if overall it wasn’t as good. But...
This is the part that floored me, put the CX in With the EX and Aqua and the SQ was off the chart good, In near perfect harmony, natural, smooth, palpable, emotionally engaging with great dynamics... it was all there. SACD was sublime, Redbook too. However the challenge is, I don’t want to drop that kind of coin on the technology that was still evolving and depreciating quickly compared to other used audio investments I’ve made. 
I’ve also observed a lot of passion for other brands of streamers (server / renderers) by Lumin and Innuos that we’re closer to what I wanted to spend. The other lesson I leaned was the concept of the server / renderer was perhaps part of the magic, but how could I accomplish economically?

Locally a Sonore ultra Rendu with the Signature LPS came available so I added that to the Mac Mini and Ayre DAC, while better, it didn’t get me close enough to the music. After much research I just bought a Innuos Zen Mk3, just it and the Ayre DAC sound very good! 

With that, here is my question — would adding either the Mac Mini or ultra Rendu improve the sound In combination with the Zen? Anyone have an Zen tried it with the Mac? Given what the Mac sounded like in the system I suspect it will significantly pollute the overall sound quality. Perhaps the Innuos acting as the Roon Core (bought a lifetime membership) and the ultra Rendu as the Roon endpoint (renderer) might be a better combo. Your thoughts?
ianderson
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thyname's avatar
thyname
3,107 posts
 
ianderson OP51 posts06-09-2020 10:39pm@thyname mentioning the Mac was in support of having a server / rendered combo.  I read a comment somewhere on the net and it was from a guy from Sonore (Barrows?) and if I remember correctly he said if the Mac was used as a server and it’s network connectivity was Fibre based, not copper, it would deliver a clean undamaged music signal to the renderer / end point.


Yes, that's the common set up with Roon, with server and streamer being two different machines. That's what Roon recommends. 

However, that's basically a common denominator, for people using their general purpose computers as Roon Core, and to stream. Innuos is an excellent server, and optimized for streaming too. It works very well as a streamer.

Since you already have the ultraRendu, you can certainly compare & contrast and see what you like.

Given I have two system, perhaps the living room system could have the Innuos as both Core and end point to the Ayre DAC, and then buy an Aqua DAC for the dedicated system in the basement with the ultra Rendu being the end point. I suspect that would work if I set it up properly in Roon?

Yes! that's a very good idea. It will certainly work with Roon.
ianderson OP
92 posts
 
My nickname in high school was Jethro for that reason, and more than once I’ve been called Think as a Brick! You’re fine....  :-) 
soix
9,456 posts
 
Ugh.  I’m a moron.  I do like Jethro Tull though. 
ianderson OP
92 posts
 
Also I’d like to apologize as I thought I had all the paragraphs formatted correctly before hitting send. I wish there was a way to edit it still.

So the takeaway this far is - leave the Mac out of it. If using the ultra Rendu in combination with the SQ improve? (Even without a fibre connection for now)

@yyzsantabarbara fibre does make sense. At some point I well imagine running all the wired devices in the house via Fibre. 
ianderson OP
92 posts
 
@soix its the non-mini, so its the Full Zen Mkiii With the dual LPS built in. (The one without a DAC)
ianderson OP
92 posts
 
@thyname mentioning the Mac was in support of having a server / rendered combo.  I read a comment somewhere on the net and it was from a guy from Sonore (Barrows?) and if I remember correctly he said if the Mac was used as a server and it’s network connectivity was Fibre based, not copper, it would deliver a clean undamaged music signal to the renderer / end point.
My common sense would place a higher priority and have the Innuos Mk3 as the core, and them use the the ultra Rendu as the end point renderer.

Given I have two system, perhaps the living room system could have the Innuos as both Core and end point to the Ayre DAC, and then buy an Aqua DAC for the dedicated system in the basement with the ultra Rendu being the end point. I suspect that would work if I set it up properly in Roon?
thyname's avatar
thyname
3,107 posts
 
Why would you need a Mac Mini if you already have the ZEN MK3? The Innuos can act as both Roon Server (Core) and Streamer (endpoint). Just USB out to your DAC.

Do you own the Aqua DAC or just borrowing it from your dealer? If you don't own it, maybe you can buy it from that same dealer?
soix
9,456 posts
 
Did you get the LPS with the Zen Mini?  It’s supposed to be a significant sonic upgrade. 
lalitk's avatar
lalitk
5,443 posts
 
“My dealer was just bringing in the Antipodes line and loaned me the newer EX / CX combo with an Aqua Optologic La Scalia DAC. Oh my, that was the first time I’ve heard digital that made me get lost in the music, tapping my toes and letting the musical performance fully & emotionally engage me. Not once did I think about the technology”

Psst....you may cause sleepless nights for some folks who come here regularly to diss digital. I am glad you get to experience how good digital can be and above all thank you for keeping an open mind. 

Stay away from MAC Mini and get a better DAC for Innuos Zen Mk3 when your finance permits. 
Enjoy! 
yyzsantabarbara
4,811 posts
 
Talk to Sonore about incorporating a Fibre Optical conversion into your setup. From what I read it have the impression you are taking Ethernet from your switch into the ultraRendu and taking the USB out from the ultraRendu into your DAC. Their view (I think) is that the Fibre Optical will eliminate the analog noise propagating up from the Network + Computer (or whatever server) into the DAC. I have a microRendu that I want to upgrade soon. I could add an FIbre Optical conversion to my rather old setup.

I am suggesting you get to something like what this Rendu is doing.

http://www.sonore.us/opticalRendu-rr.html

I just looked over this ROON only device. I think I will buy one myself. I would need a new Network Switch with optical (not expensive).
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