Holo Audio May DAC
The May is extremely clean and extended with great tonality across the frequency range. It paints an amazingly tall and wide picture across my soundstage. The AM-T3SE is a little less even handed, but provides more body and "meat on the bones." It shrinks the soundstage more between the speakers, but also draws more depth and 3-dimensionality. It’s obvious to me that both are superb dacs.Was this done with both in NOS mode or OS mode? If both, was the outcome the same, as for me the borrowed Holo Sping L2 in NOS was richer perhaps not as microscopic than OS mode. Cheers George |
@falconquest I have both in my system (see my system page for more information) right now. The May is extremely clean and extended with great tonality across the frequency range. It paints an amazingly tall and wide picture across my soundstage. The AM-T3SE is a little less even handed, but provides more body and "meat on the bones." It shrinks the soundstage more between the speakers, but also draws more depth and 3-dimensionality. It's obvious to me that both are superb dacs. I'm maybe talking myself into a conspiracy theory, but for people who track the distortion profiles of their electronics, it does kinda feel like a classic 2nd (depth and warmth) vs 3rd (clarity and details) harmonic dominance difference. A lot of good information on that from Nelson Pass in this link if anyone wants to put themselves in the weeds with me (https://positive-feedback.com/audio-discourse/the-pass-h2-harmonic-generator/). It's feeling like I'll probably put the May up for sale soon. I think the "demo" has kind of solidified for me that I prefer 2nd harmonic distortion profiles and am going to exclusively shop for them in the future. This also fits with my experienced preference for First Watt f4s (and Coincident 300b SETs) over Atma-sphere M60s and a Pass Labs XA25. Anyway, I can let people in here know if/when I do. Feel free to PM me if you're interested and want to talk about it before I release to the general public. |
@73max, how many hours on both? With such a close sound and the Plus not handling delicacy as well as the standard, sounds like just a break-in thing. When I had a Termi, delicacy and final details is what took the time... Not saying your observations are not true, just aways a chance with something ‘new’. Especially since they’re so close. |
Termi vs Termi +. Had them both in my house side-by-side. I so badly wanted to like the plus better. Latest model, oven controlled clock, has to be better right??? I kept the Termi. The plus was great, a slight, very slight, bit more “drive” behind it. Almost like digital equalization slightly tweaked. I didn’t find the change necessary or better, just different. Also, when listening to very delicate detailed highs (“My Foolish Harp” Isabelle Olivier) the Plus couldn’t quite match the delicacy of the Termi. Forced my wife to listen too (yeah, I know) she also preferred the terminator over the plus. Tried both with and without the Gaia. The Gaia provided a barely discernible improvement to both—kept it. Toying with trying the May but with no trial period, and being extremely satisfied with Termi I just can’t bring myself to do it...Yet. Roon Nucleus+. Mark Levinson pre and monos. B&W 802D3s |
George, agreed that you know the basic character after a day or two. That said, I've had two experiences that have convinced me that electrical break in is real and can take a full week or so. I had a Pass Labs xa30.5 and decided to get their int30a integrated with the same exact amplifier circuit. Two days into listening (48 hours of play time) it still sounded worse than the original amp. I was told they would sound identical after a week by renohifi and they were correct. I also built my own First Watt f4. Eventually I decided to build new boards with the highest quality parts available and when I excitedly powered up they sounded way worse. That remained true for a couple days. After a week of 24h/day play it became the significant upgrade I'd planned for. |
As break-in goes, I heard great things from the May KTE right out of the box. Once I got 20-30 hours on it I thought it sounded slightly better (10% improvement?). Beyond that it sounds great and I haven't really thought much about it. I doubt I have more than 200 hours on mine so far (I spend a lot more time listening to records) but I am still very happy with the May. I have not heard the Audio Mirror DAC, but have heard good things about it. Either way, the May DAC holds its own among the Super DACs, and for me this is enough. As I mentioned I mainly listen to records, so naturally I prioritize my efforts around my analog set up. If these priorities change at some point, I will likely pursue DACs that cost more and perform more highly than the May. Happy listening! Peter |
break-in is going to take a whileI think break in is a valid exercise for mechanical things, like phono cartridge suspension, speakers roll-surrounds, maybe even laser suspension etc etc. But with electronic devices dac, pre, amps etc I believe if your not getting "off on it" after 10hrs, which by then even the most stubborn of caps have polarized/formed properly, then your only going to talk your self into it waiting for 500hrs. BTW: Also, nothing will measure any different from 10hrs to 500hrs. But compliance in the mechanical things above do. Cheers George |
Just a quick note that I do feel like break-in is going to take a while with the May. I'm on day 6 of mostly 24/day playing and feel like it's just starting to come together. I think Kitsune recommends 500 hours. I read one report (for a spring 2 i think) where they put 500 hours on and said it took another 200 until they understood what all the fuss was about. Sorry if this was mentioned earlier in the thread and I missed it. |
Take that with a grain of salt. Not that much in it, balanced is slightly better below -130db!!! and looking at all the noise makers in the background tubes, laptops, screens, test gear etc etc with SMP buzzing their brain out, it’s no wonder the balanced look a little better. My linear Tektronix scope make noise if it’s close to any source gear too. Cheers George |
@yyzsantabarbara As you can see here, https://www.superbestaudiofriends.org/index.php?threads/kte-may-technical-measurements.8933/ the balanced outputs measure better. Atkinson at Stereophile stated that there were no differences besides gain, however. I haven't seen anyone do the subjective tests and claim one to be superior. |
This is a very interesting review of the May KTE. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HXKr_HNorg0 At 26:52 he says that if you turn OS on with the May DAC, it then uses a chip inside, and at that point you are not going to be using the ladder DAC. I wondered if he meant the digital to analog conversion was done with a chip in that case, so I sent Tim Connor an email with some questions. He quickly replied and clarified by saying the ak4137 chip in the May is an SRC which is not a DAC. It does not do anything other than convert sample rates from digital to digital. He explained the discrete DAC module has two completely dedicated discrete resistor networks for both pcm and dsd. He said the pcm network is highly advanced r2r architecture but far advanced beyond the typical. If you send the DAC a dsd file it has a completely separate discrete resistor network for 1bit content and requires high speed switching components to process dsd. So a resistor ladder is used for both pcm and dsd. I'm seriously thinking of buying the KTE May. My last separate DAC was a PS Audio DirectStream. Currently I'm using a one box setup that has a streamer, DAC and Purify amp modules inside. I use Roon and it's 64 bit volume control. I'm buying a Don Sachs Valhalla integrated tube amp, and need a DAC to use with it. This is a great discussion, glad I found it! |
I just placed my order for the KTE. As per the website, only 2 KTE’s are available for order. Now the wait begins. I’ll be feeding the May with an Auralic Aries G2.1 connected by a Shunyata Sigma USB cable. I’m currently using a Yggy which will end up going to my bedroom system. The remainder of the chain is as follows: KTE May -> VAC Signature MkIIa SE (Cryoed Telefunken 6922’s) -> Pass Labs XVR-1 crossover -> Pass Labs X250.8 (mid’s and high’s) and Bryston 7B SST’s (low’s below 250Hz) to Maggie 3.6R’s. Subs for two channel include a REL 212/SE (Left) and a pair of S/5 SHO’s (Right). Interconnects are Wireworld Platinum Eclipse 7 XLR’s. Most of the above are powered by a Shunyata Everest 8000 while subs are direct to the wall. |
Just got my Holo May KTE DAC yesterday. Only 24 hours into 500 hour burn in, so I’ll need a few hundred hours more before giving a comprehensive review. I will say that I already have a good impression of a huge soundstage and incredibly solid and tight bass with this DAC. Current DAC is a PS Audio DirectStream DAC, which sets an high bar, especially fed with a Shunyata Sigma power cord and Shunyata Sigma USB cable. Both are now plugged into the Holo May. As an aside, the Shunyata Sigma USB was the single greatest upgrade for my PS Audio DirectStream. I just installed it 5 days before my Holo May KTE. It made such a huge improvement to my PS Audio DSD, I probably would held off on the Holo May KTE purchase until getting more time with the DSD with the Sigma USB. The Shunyata Sigma USB is a marvel. It is worth every penny given the impact it has had on my system. Anyway, more updates to come on the Holo May KTE after more hours. The highs are still a bit steely with so few hours on it. |
I'm personally against USB, but am probably just biased from using a non-specialized computer input long ago. As long as you've got a quality USB out, it looks like the May's USB input measures very well (and supports higher input rates if that's your thing). https://www.superbestaudiofriends.org/index.php?threads/kte-may-technical-measurements.8933/ |
@thenewguy007 I presume you've seen the Audio Mirror T3 thread (https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/another-new-dac-audio-mirror)? Quite a few users reporting back in there (and you can see my personal review where I compare it to the other recent dacs I'd had in the system... PS Audio PWDII, PS Audio DSD, Lampizator Amber 3, ifi iDSD Pro, Shiit Bifrost 2, & Matrix X-Sabre Pro). Regardless, I'll certainly report back here at some point. Gonna be a while until I get the May unfortunately... they say 4-5 weeks. |
@cal3713
Tell us how it compares to the
Audio Mirror T3-SE. There are so very few reviews of either. |
Ha! Indeed. And it appears that there is significant consensus that the May is better in NOS mode. I'm solely redbook pcm, so the NOS performance was the primary reason I chose the May. When I got my Audio Mirror I had seven different dacs in the system over a month or two period and became convinced that R2R was the best way forward for redbook (although I'd happily perform no-risk trials of other approaches!)... |
Well, the boredom associated with social isolation and the threat of dying upon leaving the house finally got me to place an order. Curious to hear how the May compares to my lovely Audio Mirror T3-SE. Twice the price, but who knows in this hobby. I believe in NOS, silver, and separate power supplies, and it’s rare to see all 3 in a DAC... regardless of price. The stereophile product of the year award doesn't hurt either. |
I just bought the Matrix Mini-i 3 Pro (for headphones) and will compare it with my existing Benchmark DAC3B. The Mini is supposed to be close to the Element X. I would like to get the Halo and AudioByte VOX to maybe move up the DAC ladder. How are people connecting to the Halo DAC? Is the new USB component in the LEVEL3 as good as i2s . If i2s is preferred, what digital converter is being used to output i2s? Anybody get the Denafrips IRIS to connect to the Halo via i2s? |
@lordcloud Sorry for the delay, I don’t get updates on this thread even though I’m subscribed for some reason. The Benchmark DAC3 HGC is a great Sabre chip based dac, but the Matrix XSabre Pro MQA DAC is $2k and a superior sounding dac. There’s a slight upper-midrange glare or minor harshness at higher volumes I’ve noticed over the years that the Matrix XSabre Pro MQA doesn’t have. It’s just a better execution and better sounding DAC. Now, with regard to the Holo May KTE DAC, no Sabre dac I’ve ever heard (Manhattan, Aurelic etc) sounds as real and natural as the May. It’s really in its own league. It’s kind of like going from 2d to 3d for sound. Guitars are frightenly real. Jazz/acoustic/bluegrass/blues/classical instrumental images are well delineated in their own space, and their decays hang in the air. Transients effortlessly leap out and microdynamics are retrieve and rendered flawlessly. It nails harmonic richness and timbre is stellar. It’s really a notable gestalt that is hard to put into words, but realism is the best I can attribute to the experience. It’s presentation is attention grabbing, emotionally connective, and just an absolute blast to experience. |
I've had my Holo May KTE DAC for a couple of months now. It's as impressive today as it was the day I got it. It never dissapoints. I do now use HQPLAYER and Roon, but I actually prefer PCM 20bits (per Jussi)/1.536MHZ to DSD512. I find it a tad more resolute, and detailed honestly. I also think DSD512 is also very good, but just a hair smoother too me and maybe that's preferred by some or it's just the synergy between running source-direct to my Pass Labs XA25 amplifier and then on to my Tekton Encores. I use Roon for volume attenuation which manipulates HQPLAYER's built-in volume control. I've only got two digital sources and no analog sources. I've always preferred the sound source-direct and not through a preamp. I'm a big fan of the shortest signal path. I've used mostly SET Tube Amplifiers for 25 years. The XA25 is the first solid-state amplifier to change my mind with its unreal set-like midrange and Pass's signature bass which is outstanding. I've also enjoyed the Holo May KTE DAC very much with no hqplayer processing on redbook lossless in NOS mode of course. It's superb, but I drank the Hqplayer kool-aid recently after swearing I'd never buy it for years while settling for Roon's upsampling as sufficient. Eitherway, it's definitely the best sounding DAC I've owned or heard in my experience. |
The Halo May Level 3 and the AudioByte Vox | Zap | Hub stack seem like advancing DAC technology without breaking the bank. I am looking at these 2 to supplement or replace a Benchmark DAC3B. The AudioByte vs the Rockna Wavelight is also very interesting since they come from the same designer and are priced around the same. |
I think he's just referring to the AK4137 chip that handles all upsampling. But you're right that the standard r2r modules are still involved. See below: From: https://www.kitsunehifi.com/product/holo-audio-may-dac/ "The oversampling is done by AK4137, ‘OS PCM’ converts the input stream to PCM no matter it is PCM or DSD, then send to DAC. ‘OS DSD’ converts the input stream to DSD no matter is is PCM or DSD, then send to DAC. ‘OS’ over-samples the input stream. If it is DSD input, it over-sample to DSD256. If it is PCM input, it over-samples to PCM384K or 352.8K ‘NOS’ does no oversampling. send the input stream directly to DAC module.' |
@jriggy The high bitrate upsamplers will always say a DAC sounds best that way. yes i think this is true in my pursuit of streaming and digital file playing, i have focused on what makes cd quality material sound as close to and ’analog’ like as possible - this objective is important as so much/most music out there exists in this resolution higher bitrates/mqa/dsd etc etc are icing on the cake, relevant side dishes, not the main meal deal |
