Disappoint? Not compared to an Adcom they won't. |
"The Amps are 200wpc, so concerned that the wattage won't give me the detail and sound I have waited all these years to hear. Will these macs disappoint the requirements of this needy speaker?"
There's really no industry wide rules on how to rate an amplifier's power. If you took 5 or 10 amps from different companies rated for the same power, it would be unlikely to find even 2 that put out the same exact amount. McIntosh is one of the better ones when it comes to power ratings. You should have no problem driving your 3.6's. The only real issue is if you like how the McIntosh sounds. Some do, and some don't. |
The Mac's with their autoformers won't double down into the 3.6's rather challenging load. Not what I would recommend. |
I use to have the 3.6's great speaker but hard to drive. They can be in your face a little through the mids and highs, and they need a amp with good tight controled bass.
They do remain mostly under 3ohms, so an amp with good current is a must. Stereophile test measurements here
[url]http://www.stereophile.com/content/thiel-cs36-loudspeaker-measurements[/url]
My self I would look at amps that have reputation for good bass control, but ones with high class A bias to keep the mids and highs sweet. So the hot running medium to large size Krell's, Mark Levinson's and other manufacturers like them would be my choice for these speakers.
Read the full review here, if the 225watt VTL's couldn't do it in the bass, then I doubt the Mac's with transformer output will either.
[url]http://www.stereophile.com/floorloudspeakers/225/[/url]
Cheers George |
Hello. A bit off of the subject here but I have CS3.5's which, almost typically, have midrange driver issues. I purchased a pair of suitable Scanspeaks but...they're not quite up to snuff. Thiel no longer rebuilds them and interweb searches have proven futile. I am looking to buy the mids used from a member if anyone knows of a source. I ain't giving up on these yet. Thiei used to charge $300 for the rebuild and that doesn't totally put me off - I bought them used so that's a relatively small additional investment on truly remarkable speakers. Thanks for reading. |
^That's really disappointing to hear. Thiel's once legendary customer service seems to have faded away with the previous/original owners. Things are really changing at Thiel, and it seems as though it's for the worse.
Check e-bay, from time to time there will be part out sales of various Thiels. Another option is to contact Miller Sound in Philadelphia. I just had a friend have a Thiel CS 2 driver rebuilt by Bill LeGall there, and he was very satisfied with everything. |
Thank you for the tip! I'll be contacting him soon enough. I have seen a couple of possibilities on EBay but the sellers weren't, IMHO, too trustworthy. I sent one seller a photo of my Thiel midranges to confirm that his were in fact original and he could not or would not offer an answer as to why the stickers on his did not have Thiel printed on them. Caveat emptor! Thanks again. |
Hey Thiel CS3.5 owners - Thiel WILL repair them for $300 apiece plus shipping, etc. I guess their move made them slow in replying. For me that's good news because I feel the speakers are worth the investment I've already made. |
^Good to know! But, $300 each is a bit steep.
Though it wasn't advertised policy, if the repairs weren't due to abuse, IME Thiel used to do repairs gratis, and only charged a house discounted shipping cost one(!) way, even for items that were past the generous 10 year warranty.
Man, I really miss Jim, Shari, Gary and the rest of the gang! |
"06-21-14: Unsound
The Mac's with their autoformers won't double down into the 3.6's rather challenging load. Not what I would recommend."
I thought that was the whole point of using autoformers. The amp sees a consistent load. |
As I mentioned, I like these speakers enough to warrant the $600 investment in having them repaired. I paid $800 used, so a total of $1400 for the pair strikes me as a reasonably justifiable expenditure. (Reasonable - ha!) I have since seen them less expensive on the "Gon and elsewhere, but mine were in near perfect condition - the grills were re-done a year before I purchased them. They're my favorites so far...quite amazing. My Pass X150.5 is a good match - I just picked up an Audio Research SS Preamp with balanced connections and I can't wait to see what happens. |
zd542, Typically as a speakers impedance changes so does it's sensitivity. The Mac's use of autoformers compromises the advantages of quality high current ss amplifiers to maintain linear frequency response. |
Oblgny, I agree the 3.5's are worth repairing. IMHO, they have always been one of the top value speakers available. Your Pass amp is surely a lovely combination with them.
Still, $300 seems a bit steep. Though perhaps a bit back in time; I'd hazard a guess they didn't cost too much more new. A simple rebuild shouldn't cost that much.
You're right to question those e-bay sellers regarding the drivers being sold as OEM. Though back then Jim Thiel used outside sourced drivers, they were modified to his specifications. Off the shelf manufacturer drivers though similar, are not exactly the same. |
At least Thiel still offers rebuilds, and I'm comforted to know that they'll be in the hands of the mfr. I agree with $600 being somewhat extravagant for the pair, but I suspect they might have been over-driven by the previous owner occasionally so...
From what I've seen on here and other sites used Thiels generally fail to sell at first, even at bargain prices. One can argue that my $850 plus the forthcoming rebuild + $600 is an iffy expenditure, but within my budget I have yet to hear something as good as these. i've seen their cs 5 on here for less than $3k....tempting! |
^I completely agree!
I've been tempted too, but then I remember the cost of amplifying those 5's! |
I have given in to the temptation of a well priced CS5, but fortunately had already purchased a Krell FPB 300, which powers them nicely! Thiel at one time had a pair of CS5i's with an FPB 600 in their factory showroom, so I will most likely move up to a 600 when the time is right. Krell all the way for Thiels. My 2.4's competely opened up with the FPB 300.. |
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Ii don't believe anyone has mentioned this.
The Mac's power is rated into 4 ohms, not really an industry standard. Most are rated into 8 ohms. So, the impedance of the 3.6's drops below 2 ohms as I recall, though it's been years since I have recalled this.
I would NOT use a Mac. Go for an amp that truly doubles into 4 ohms. An amp that's smooth in the upper and has loads of current. As the resistance drops, the current needs go up quickly.
Research and call some THIEL Dealers. They'll be very helpful! |
I had CS7s for awhile and the impedance curves are very similar to the 3.6. A Bryston 4BST was simply not enough power at low impedance and I easily tripped the protection a couple of times. Only a Krell 400cx that I eventually got was sufficient t to drive these. Having said the above I am greatly enjoying 2.4s being wonderfully and adequately driven by a Manley Stringray II integrated. The only way to know would be to connect the Mac to the 3.6s. |
