Us tubeys really love our colorations. We never attend live concerts. We just want to feel good. Classic ss state argument. I am also sure you could write my response. The classic tube argument that is. The fact is Raul has proclaimed his preamp the best. Totally neutral and faithful to the music. That's a lofty claim and will be subject to considerable attack. I am sure he doen't mind. |
I don't remember Raul ever stating that his preamp is the the best. Maybe I missed that, but "best" is a loaded word. I love tubes, see a lot of live music, and use a VAC Phi 110 with my Essential. IMO, a tube lover can still find lots to like in the Essential - I have.
Matt |
"We don't do/make any Essential 3150 voicing to meet other similar audio devices. We make/do our best on the Essential 3150 circuit/layout/execution design, selecting the best neutral parts: here in the parts selection was where we made some voicing looking for that neutrality with out loosing: accuracy, very low noise, very low distortion, etc, etc."
I'd say they have thrown down the gauntlet, wouldn't you? |
I get what your saying - he's definitely implying that it's unique, but I usually cringe when absolute terms like "best" are used. At least he didn't say "the Essential is the best preamp, period." I think Raul would agree that best, from a sound perspective, is a subjective term in this case and can't possibly mean the same thing to all people. I can see J&R saying that they think it's the best(especially from a design point of view), but I can't see them arguing that you, or anyone else, will think so. Beauty is in the ear of the listener, right?:-).
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I think Raul is a very kind, compassionate, respectful and experienced man who thinks his preamp is the best; and that's ok with me, even if, for my purposes, I were to disagree (which I am not in a position to do). |
"Beauty is in the ear of the listener right?..."
If I were the creator of the music then, I get to do whatever I want. Then the beholder is the subjective judge of beauty. But the recreator has no such license. Music creation is one thing; music reproduction is another. The so called ss objectivist are always acusing the so called tube subjectivist of creating a thing of beauty but not necessarily faithful to the original. The subjectivist acuse the objecitvist of recreating something that measures faithfully but has no likeness to the real thing.
There are some things in music we just can't measure. It's like cooking. I can buy the best cook book and follow the recipe faithfully;, I still ain't no Julia child. As Raul himself states he spent years exchanging parts for optimum results.
On the other hand if everybody could cook like Julia Child, it just wouldn't be special now would it?
"...Raul...thinks his preamp is the best..." gentleman that he is he has tried to avoid comparisons to any one preamp. No need to ruffle any feathers if you don't have to. |
Unless I have missed quite a lot, the argument is being misrepresented. Matt and I both own the Essential and would both (I believe) argue very strongly that it is not only objectively accurate, it is also subjectively beautiful in its representation of recordings (both phono and line stage). I repeat myself by stating that it brings me closer to live performances than any other piece of equipment that I have owned and/or auditioned. It also acts as a critical tool by which items (ranging from my Allaerts MC2 Finish Gold to my Kubala Sosna Emotion cabling) can be assessed. And as with Piedpiper, I have no problems with Raul stating that it was designed to exceed any other line and/or phono stage out there.
I am bemused by efforts to turn this into an argument. More so when the argument seeks to base itself in a "tubey v SS" or "subjectivist v objectivist" nonesense. I am certain that Raul has argued in various threads that:
1. The technology is no guarantee of quality. You can have poor applications of any technology, and 2. The live performance and/or actual recording is the only true criterion for judging the value of any piece of equipment. Need we consider the obvious in that we are talking about "high fidelity (hifi)"?
Finally, I believe Piedpiper is bang on again, when he suggests the need to hear the Essential before deciding what it might or might not be and do. |
" Matt and I both own the Essential and would both (I believe) argue very strongly that it is not only objectively accurate, it is also subjectively beautiful in its representation of recordings (both phono and line stage). I repeat myself by stating that it brings me closer to live performances than any other piece of equipment that I have owned and/or auditioned." And hopefully you both remain secure in your purchase.
"...need to hear the Essential before deciding what it might or might not be and do..." No doubt. |
Dear Piedpiper: +++++ " , even if, for my purposes, " +++++
Which ones are those purposes? could you share with us?
Regards and enjoy the music. Raul. |
Raul,
obviously totally hypothetical. In other words, if I were to compare your preamp to some others, and for reasons of personal taste I prefered another preamp, I would still have no problem with you prefering yours. |
I have been reading this thread with great interest as i am looking for something simpler to replace my 2 unit system (preamp and phono preamp). But i am always been a tube man so it's hard for me to imagine any non-tube unit that can be as good.
Still, i believe the best way to see if it fit your system is to go ahead and buy the unit and audition it in your system to see if it fit - there a so many taste in audio and system set up that you can read review till you are blue in the face, but the ultimate test is to put it in your system; case in point is the recent Triplanar Tonearm i just audition - i have heard so much how good it is but when i have it in my system and compared to my Graham Phantom, i still prefer my Graham but when i stuck it on my friend system, it match his perfectly!!!!
I wish most manufacturer will allow home audition for a fee (maybe 1-2% audition fee of the unit cost) so us audiophile can try to match our system and finetune without breaking our bank by buying and selling; well isn't it why audiogon is around :-)...
Just my 2 cents, |
Kdtran, having heard the Essential 3150 in two other systems plus my own, I will say that during these auditions, issues of tube VS ss never entered my mind. Instead, I marveled at the open and uncolored presentation of the (recorded) musical event. To qualify this I will say that in general, I have preferred the sounds from tube gear for nearly the past 20 years. The point is, not all tube electronics suit me and not all ss fail me. Everything in this hobby must be evaluated for its own merit.
My 3 cents worth, accounting for inflation! |
I received an email form Jose' of J&R Music. He is as much a gentleman as Raul. It is clear the Essential is manufactured to the highest standards. Some much higher priced units use "proprietary" parts which do not approach this level. There is now a "3160". I assume there is a price increase. I suppose I will have to hear the preamp some time this summer. |
A new model?
Already?
The successor to their Edsel. What's it called, the Corvair?
Hasta la vista baby. |
Audiofeil, the Edsel failed because of lack of market acceptance, the Corvair failed because of management ineptness. Anyway, your analogy for the Essential is pretty silly.
Have you seen or heard the Essential 3150? I have and while I believe Raul or Jose' would not expect it (or any product) will appeal to everyone, it has sonic abilities that warrant consideration by anyone considering an upper end preamp or line/phono combination. |
Is the new 3160 model a circuit change or cosmetic?
I ask because when Raul was here I ask why the umbilical cords were mounted on the front rather than the rear. Visually it was unappealing and Raul said he planned to change that in the new model.
So is the 3160 the 3150 with mods or a partial redesign? |
I ask because when Raul was here I ask why the umbilical cords were mounted on the front rather than the rear. Visually it was unappealing and Raul said he planned to change that in the new model. Paul and I discussed that with Raul too, and shared some ideas for faceplate redesigns that would make it look more like a commercial unit. Of course our preamp is even more obviously a home-build. But it and the Essential are the two most realistic and lifelike sounding preamps we've heard. |
For what here would seem to be a minority view on auditioning the Essential 3150, please see my comparative findings with the H-cat starting at: http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?aamps&1059180366&openfrom&654&4#654 |
I hope I did not betray any secrets. Jose' neither asked me me nor forbade to make that announcement. Yes Albert you are right as usual, the improvements are mostly cosmetic. Just ignore Audiofiel. Beleive or it or not he is a nice guy with a sense of humor. |
Audiofiel and I have exchanged email, we do fine.
As I've stated in previous posts, I'm willing to listen to the Essential again after Raul finishes tweaking. I even offered product photography, which has real value since that's what I do for a living.
Even if the Essential is not my cup of tea I can still respect it for what it is. It's going to be tough to dislodge me from tubes. I've had a lot of product in and out of my system and tubes do it for me.
The short listening session we had is better than listening at CES, but Raul and I only had one day to listen and there was way too much going on.
I prefer not going on record about equipment performance until I completely understand every facet of the product being discussed. That's why I've not joined in as much as others, it's nothing against Raul, in fact we got along splendidly. |
Hi folks, I recently had the upgrade from Raul and Jose on my Essential 3150 and have posted a full review on audiogon at http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?rprea&1187459855&openusid&zzDgob&4&5#Dgob.
I hope it will prove useful. |
Dear Albert: " I am looking forward to the day that Raul needs photography and will allow me to audition the 3160 for an extended time. "
You will have it. As you know this is not my main " business " and we are slow on it. Sooner or latter you will have it. I will try as soon is posible.
Regards and enjoy the music. Raul. |
...And we would not be offended by a non-professional picture in the intereim. Hint-hint. |