Difference in sound between copper and silver digital cables?

@williewonka   Steve: YES.   Very much so. Thank you!

@david_ten - Ooooops sorry about that….

@williewonka Steve: within the parameters of (the "experiment" / components / systems) you tested them, correct? Thanks.

Yes - I was testing with digital audio files up to and including 24/192. They connected a Schiit Bifrost DAC and a Musical Fidelity V-Link192 USB-S/PDIF Converter and an Apple PC as the source of the digital files via USB.

The amp was a NAIM 5i Mk II and the speakers are the Gershman Acoustics Sonogram model

I could not discern any degradation in audio quality at those sample rates, higher sample rates may have issues, but I am unable to test ot those rates.

I did drop down to the copper Harmony RCA and there was also no degradation, but I the silver plating on the copper harmony may wear off after 30 insertions, so I do not use them for anything.

My Silver Harmony RCA’s had been inserted around 40 times to that point without wearing to the copper underneath the plating. But this very much depends on the quality of the socket they are plugged into.

For all analogue cables I only use Harmony Absolute RCA’s

Hope that helps

Williewonka 1-3-2020
The geometry of the cables is an advance Helix design, so that probably made a significant contribution to the performance of the cable.

Steve, I always have great respect for the very extensive work you’ve done with cables over the years. But in this case I’m wondering how or if you might have established what IMO is the requisite 75 ohm "characteristic impedance" for an unbalanced digital cable, using the helix geometry you have used for your analog interconnects.

Also, IMO, if the characteristic impedance of the cable was not known to be an accurately controlled 75 ohms the sonic consequences of the resulting mismatch to the impedances of the components being connected figure to be even more dependent than usual on the designs of those specific components, and probably also on the length of the particular cable. Making the sonic effects of the particular cable pretty much random and unpredictable among different digital applications, IMO.

Best regards,
-- Al

Do you mean after they’re broken in? Before or after cryo? Yes I know what you’re thinking, “Are you hot dogging me?”

@williewonka Steve: within the parameters of (the "experiment" / components / systems) you tested them, correct? Thanks.

With this design using a silver conductor seemed to offer no advantage.

Yes you are right Doug! Always outlier experiences and who knows why? System? Ears? Break in? Bad pizza? 

Try and learn. 

I tried an experiment a few years back...
- I built an extremely good digital cable with silver signal wires and exceptional RCA plugs
- I then "stepped back" the design by replacing the signal wire with copper - there was no change
- I then stepped back the design once more opting for a more affordable RCA plug - again there was no change.

The geometry of the cables is an advance Helix design, so that probably made a significant contribution to the performance of the cable.

The RCA’s finally used are silver coated copper, KLE Innovations Silver Harmony RCA and the copper wire was from Neotech.

With this design using a silver conductor seemed to offer no advantage.

With other geometries there may be some benefit to using silver conductors

Hope that helps - Steve

Your system’s current sound and what you want more or less of determines the type of cable you should buy. Yes cables can be used like seasoning in the hands of a chef. You’re a sound chef. While design, solid vs. stranded, cotton vs Teflon and on and on all impact sound, silver does have a sound personality that always comes through. It is marked by sharp, crisp, and clear leading edges, slightly leaner overall presentation and the perception of increased speed and inner details. Place silver in cotton and silver becomes more open, natural and not quite as lean. However, it still exhibits the general silver sound in relation to pure copper.

Copper tends to deliver more mid-bass body and weight and is not as well defined in terms of leading edge detail. Bass is a tad more rounded and yes this can vary, but in general is accurate.

So you have sonic must haves and preferences. Your system does or does not meet these preference as well as you like so start cooking!

Caps and resistors, well most parts, also have a sound. One can dial in a system by seasoning with these parts and cables. This is my particular area of interest and one that I have many thousands of hours of experience in. Many Aphiles don’t believe this to be true or possible, but if one spends enough time, effort and due diligence on this area of study, then they would learn first hand just how real it is.

Take a simple tube dac with an output cap right before the RCA outputs. Try placing a Vcap Odam cap vs. say a Jensen copper foil cap in paper and oil and I can assure you this same dac will sound quite different depending on your choice. No ear straining is needed to hear the difference. My point is that materials matter and do indeed have a sound. Same is true for cabling.  

If the Bits is Bits theory was true, which it’s not, optical digital cables would sound just as good as copper or silver digital cables, which they don’t. That’s because the signal is not really Bits. Duh! 😳 Besides, as I’ve been counseling, by the time the signal gets to the DAC it’s too late. The signal has already been degraded during the laser reading process due to a number of problems that have always been there.

Yes, there is a difference, but it largely comes from the implementation. There are copper conductors, silver, and copper coated or copper infused with silver. The design and material used in the  dialectric also contributes to sonics.

Ideologues kindly butt out with your ill-informed opinions.

As the French chef says "No diffawrance!" - BITS IS BITS!