Cable Elevators killed my bass

Maybe in another 25 years, cable elevators will as common sense as washing your hands to prevent colds

Doubt that. And no idea how much metal is in the floor. Small differences i hear, nothing major. But at least the cables are off the floor, and more importantly, separated from each other.

Not sure why my last response didn't post -- I heard small differences with the ESD's: more air, clarity and separation. For $40 shipped for b-stock and a 30 day money back, it's a no-brainer.

How much metal is in your floor? Nails, cement, pipes? I personally poo-poo the whole thing, but would allow for the possibility that there could be some value if your cables were resting on a floor with lots of metal or another reactive material. Who's to say? Twenty five years ago they said CDs were the shiz and that vinyl was dead. Maybe in another 25 years, cable elevators will as common sense as washing your hands to prevent colds.

Tholt=

did you use the esd isolators on you Speaker cables only, or also on your power cords? What type of improvement did you hear?

BTW, I believe I've since revised my thoughts on the ESD isolators. They do in fact make a difference, and now for the better. No idea if it was a 'settling' thing or what...but I inserted them again last night and results seem to be positive. fwiw, ymmv, wtf

Tbg, going up to my folks house for T-day, believe my mom has some antiques in the cupboard. I'll try to remember that. Thanks

Tholt, try teacups.

Snook: good point and apropo - of course it is more organic but it is also dirty - after a heavy rain I notice the sound gets kind of muddy, it's kind of like - oh I don't know muddy waters.

This is sort of on the topic. Do you prefer the power coming into your house from powerlines on poles or underground lines. I prefer underground it makes the sound more organic

Not 'avoiding' ceramics per se, I wanted to try a low cost alternative that was specifically made as cable risers as an experiment. The ESD's are from cableisolators.com and were recommended to me by Ryan Tew, whom I believe is the owner.

Maybe I'm just not a believer enough to invest $100 or more on risers. My original post was really that i was surprised that the wood risers actually affected the sound at all, but I'm not sure I'm inclined to spend anymore time on what i still consider a minor tweak. If I had carpet, this may be a different story.

Tholt, I don't see any risers at ESD. Do you mean their conductive pads? I don't know why you avoid ceramics. They are your best bet.

Well, initial reaction after a bunch of swapping sessions (...somehow, that doesn't sound right) leads me to conclude that the my lame pine wood blocks win over the ESD foam risers. My observations follow. This is based on power cord elevation only. I briefly tried the risers under speaker cables, but actually didn't like it. For some reason, no matter what I've tried, my sc like laying on the floor. I have maple hardwood floors on a raised foundation.

1. I have a delicate 'glare' problem. I probably need to treat the room more, and/or adjust my speakers, but I've recently JUST (I mean barely) cured this glare issue at certain frequencies that I've been dealing with for close to a year. The ESD's made the glare more pronounced. The wood smoothed it out. That right there is pretty much enough to go with the wood, even if the wood almost smoothed over the highs too much (which it doesn't).

2. There was a difference between the ESD's right-side-up or upside-down, where the cable was resting on the 'bottom'. I actually preferred the latter. The former seemed to soften the highs and muddy the sound a bit.

3. This one is a little weird. i've also been dealing with a balance issue (...I know -- I need to adjust my speakers. Probably this weekend). The sound pulls slightly to the left, so I adjust for that with the Balance control. The ESD's actually exacerbated the pull. I have no idea how power cord elevators would do that. And conversely, the wood brought things back in line. huh?

So, I'll probably hang onto the isolators because they were $40 shipped; not even worth sending back. I may try them under everything once my speakers are adjusted. I'd be surprised if everything suddenly 'opened up' with the risers in the new configuration vs. my observations here. But since BALANCE was actually affected, who the hell knows? This hobby drives me crazy.

The right ones sound great plexiglass sounds good Shunyata is good. I use both on carpet sounds great!!

I tried pint glasses. They sounded bright and empty. I filled them with Guinness in an attempt to make the sound darker and more full bodied. I kinda got side tracked somehow and woke up the next morning with a headache and about 18 empty pint glasses. No idea how it sounded.

Br3098 - I'd love to see a pic of that.

I used to use cable elevators. I tried wood, glass, and finally carbon fiber. All to no avail, no nirvana. Then I found the answer - lawn gnomes! Space approx. 1' or so apart, they elevate the speaker cables migh higher and more securely than those flimsy cable elevators. And it's so convenient; you can get them at your neighborhood home repair center.

Gbart, no doubt were the surface area miniscule, such as the edge of a dime, the dampening results would be less. But it is static electricity that most concerns me. I would not pretend to understand what the interplay is between static electricity and vibration dampening. I only know what I have experienced. I am happy for you that you haven't faced this problem.

I've been using cable elevators for several years and don't find they harm the sound in any way. I don't doubt the claims that some people may be having negative experiences, I just can't understand how a very small total surface area of an inert material, in contact with cables, can cause such a profound loss of bass as described ?

Tholt, they suggested that I stick with my one viable solution, the Rightway Audio Suspenders. This has gotten me by.

Tbg, then based on your previous response, I'd suggest some sort of professional help... ;)

Tholt, I also have hardwood floors.

I ordered the ESD risers. $40 for 10 (b-stock. hopefully they don't look like they came from the bottom of a dumpster) to see if they're better than the current wood blocks I'm using.

I have hardwood floors -- cable risers don't seem to make a huge impact in my system. Curiously, putting the wood blocks underneath speaker cables (Zu) sounds worse than when they lay on the floor.

Tholt, there is very little that I haven't tried from cardboard, wooden sticks, glass blocks, strings from the rack, 18 Kv isolators with the cables hanging down in between, acrylic pieces, etc. Most have a limited effect, some a substantial bad effect, and a few a limited beneficial effect. As I said, I would stick with ceramics, such as cups, soap dishes, etc. If you go to my system page, you will see that the 18Kv isolators don't look very good, especially when I had to tape Suspenders on top of them as they didn't sound good. They are heavy, however, and stay put.

Thanks Tbg.

Anyone have any experience with the inexpensive ESD isolators or Signal Cable risers? This isn't something I want to throw a bunch of money at, but if I'm gonna do it, it would be nice if they looked halfway decent.

Maybe my 'tone' or choice of words came across harsher than intended. One of the downfalls of reading text vs seeing and hearing someone speak. I think it's stupid to tell people what they can and can't hear.

I've tried a lot of 'absurd' things too. Some changed the sound (better and worse), some didn't. I tried hockey pucks and some Ikea wooden X-shaped book ends (a 6 Moons guy wrote about the bookends) as cable elevators. There was no difference to my ears. All of the tweaks I've used were either things I already had at home (like the book ends, butcher blocks) or things I could return for a full refund.

I just can't wrap my head around how elevating cables and/or moving them and letting them settle can effect the sound. Unless you're getting them away from each other or something that causes interference, of course.

Tholt, I have always found wood robs the music of its pace and thrill. I would include bass in that. Try cd boxes, but if you really want the best go to china cups. I use special ceramic feet that look like electrical isolators but they are no longer made. They are from Rightway Audio.

Hi Tholt

I have my SCs and PCs in my system elevated either with Myrtlewood blocks that raise the cords approx 3 inches above the ground or I've just tied the cords in such a fashion that they are off the ground entirely by more than a ft. It is an ugly mess but they are off the ground. Now I never had any loss in bass response but then my system is not as nice as yours.

FWIW I did lose some bass boomminess when I changed out my subwoofer isolation platform. I have a Velodyne subwoofer that is facing downwards and I was using an Auralex SubDude that raised my subwoofer 2.5" from the ground. I changed it out for limestone tiles that now have the sub raised 4.5"-5" above the ground.

Good luck in tracking down the issue.

@ Kbarkamian - point taken. It is absurd to elevate cables in our quest for the nth degree of refinement; however, not unlike spending $400 for 3 footers, or using things like little myrtlewood blocks, or cd mats, or maple cutting boards, or...

It's all absurd. But I can hear differences. Once you accept you're an audiophile, and except just one 'absurd' thing as actually working, you're all in whether you like it or not. Try it and see, absurdity aside.

BTW my question still stands

Kbarkamian, so why do you read it and post? These ideas yield subtle effects, but positive effects nevertheless. I have never found anything other than ceramics that work, but that is for everyone to judge for themselves.

I don't mean to stir the pot here, but this is one of the most absurd threads I've seen. You guys can't be serious. And if you are...

Has anyone tried using test tones and an SPL meter to confirm the bass output, or lack there of? I'm not one of these measurement, DBT, etc. guys but I just can't wrap my head around this one.

I can see the benefit of keeping power cords up and away from other cables like Tholt was alluding to (but I don't think he was actually implying), as I had issues in the past with power cords getting too close to interconnects and causing interference.

Has anyone used cable elevators under power cords? I've got a hardwood floor and thought I might elevate my pc's up and away from the other cables on the floor and had a similar experience with the OP. Bass went bye-bye. I was using pinewood blocks to elevate.

This may be a bit off topic ,But instead of using cable elevators try this for a diy if u can. Pad the outside of your cables with Deflex Paneling by using tie wraps. This will take alot of time and some expense for the Deflex pads
but sonically I think u will be in for a very big surprise.Don C.

I don't have any experience with Cable Elevators but have long had Suspenders from Rightway Audio that preceded them. Apart from the rubber bottom pad both seem to share the basic shape and use of ceramics. Quite contrary to what has been said about using multiple Elevators on cables, with the Suspenders using more than one hurts the sound. I elevate mine on 15 inch tall 18k volt insulators so that I can use the sag of the cables and only use one per speaker wire.

There is absolutely no loss of either base or treble and the sound stage becomes much better resolved and real. I have tried several very expensive speaker and interconnect wire that say they need not be suspended. They have all been greatly improved by suspending them. When possible, I use one per interconnect even if they are in contact with nothing but air.

Foster_9, they've had plenty of time to re-settle since I did this a week ago so I dunno but I hear you.

Yes, they are the ceramic Cable Elevator+ models. They have a removeable adhesive round rubber disc on the bottom so they're not 100% ceramic, obviously.

You need to place the elevators on no more than 4 inch centers or it kills the bass.
If they are more than 8 inches apart it will kill the treble too.
You need to buy more elevators.

I agree with foster on this as well

In my experience, moving cables can affect the performance until they re-settle.

You are joking right??? How exactly does it effect performance from an engineering perspective.. What re-settles?? If you lift them up higher does the bass diminish even more??

If I throw the cables in the washer will they sound CLEANER after doing so??

MAK

Is it possible that moving your speaker cables around to place them on cable elevators would require time for the cables to re-settle in their new position? In my experience, moving cables can affect the performance until they re-settle.

"Cable Elevators killed my bass"

I think you got off on the wrong floor. Did you buy the Shakti stones as well???

That is really weird. Are you using the ceramic ones?