Backert Labs Rhumba 1.3 vs Extreme

I can't compare the Rhumba to the Extreme, but I purchased a Rhumba 1.3 in December and am very happy with it.  I upgraded from a Freya (OG) and you will not experience anything thick or veiled with the Rhumba, no hint of tubiness at all. It is really quiet, I have 98db efficient speakers and I have to put my ear right up to the tweeter to hear any hint of tube noise.  With the Freya, I could hear some tube noise from my listening position.  Andy at Backert Labs is a straight shooter, and I think he will talk to you about your system and make an honest recommendation as to which version to get.

Hi @panerai557 

So I can't compare the 1.3 to the 1.3 Extreme but I can compare the 1.2 to the 1.3 Extreme which is the upgrade path I took. First I will say that I loved my 1.2. It replaced a Parasound P5 that served its purpose but was somewhat dry and lacked PRAT. When I put the 1.2 in my system for the first time it was a revelation even with no break-in though I believe Andy told me that they do run these in for some time prior to shipping. But it really did take my system to a new level. I also spoke to Andy about tube rolling and he downplayed it somewhat. I forget exactly what he said but characterized the effect or change as mostly minor. The first tubes I rolled in were a set of NOS Aperex Bugle Boy tubes from the early 60's (I think) and these things just blew me away. I remember sitting in my music room and the hair was standing up on my arms. I think I paid less than $200 for the tubes but the improvement in texture and palpability was significant. So this sent me down a path to experiment more with other tubes which was great fun. After trying many other lesser priced and similar priced tubes, the Bugle Boys were still the clear leader. So I took the plunge and bought a pair of Amperex 7316 which cost me a bundle and they did sound great but not better than the original Bugle Boys. Anyway, to date I have 12 or so pairs and in my 1.2 the tube changes are obvious. Most every set changes the sound signature in one way or another and most times you don't have to try to hear it, it is pretty obvious. So a couple years after owning the 1.2 and loving it I came into a little extra cash and called Andy about a trade in. I forget the exact number but they were more than fair and the deal was that they would send me a new 1.3 Exteme that I could compare to my 1.2 and decide if the improvement was worth the extra dough. The Extreme shipped with Millards and it sounded terrific right out of the box with the stock tubes. I was super excited because I assumed rolling in some more expensive tubes would deliver the same results as what I experienced in the 1.2. I know there are significant differences between the two pre's but somehow the Extreme is less responsive to tube rolling than my 1.2 was. I'm not sure why this is but that is the case in my system. Now, with all this said, I kept the Extreme and traded in my 1.2. Even with my favorite BB tubes in the 1.2 the Extreme is easily better but the difference is not like going from my Parasound to the 1.2; it is more incremental. The sound is more authoritative and muscular but still maintains the quickness and agility they are known for. I would say if you are inclined to upgrade and you have the extra money, buy the Extreme. If you have other priorities buy the 1.3 and play around with some different moderately priced tubes from a reputable dealer. Either way you'll be a very happy camper. I HTH, /mike

Member Terry London reviewed both the Rhumba and the LTA MicroZOTL and slightly preferred the LTA.  Just another option.  I believe LTA gives a 14-day trial FWIW.  Both are great and I don’t think you could go wrong with either, but the LTA also happens to be an outstanding headphone amp if that matters.  Best of luck. 

Just to update the thread, I went with LTA MicroZOTL Preamp with L2 upgrade. All I can say is that the preamp met my expectation. I agree with Mr. London's assessment in his review. I think the biggest strength for this pre is its ability to pull me into natural live sound. It still does have its own sound (all gear does, IMO), but I won't say its veiled or anything like that. A really good highend setup can take a listener to where the music was recorded. So you hear the room and the band. With MicroZOTL Pre in my system, it sounds more like taking the band into my listening space.

I highly recommend it to anyone who is looking for natural live sounding preamp with convenient features.  

At a glance, it looks like these reviews were conducted nearly three years apart. He reviewed the Rhumba 1.1 in early March 2016 and the LTA in late November 2018. I'm wondering if he was able to compare these side by side in the same system or is relying on auditory memory over three years? If it is the latter I am seriously jealous as my auditory memory is good for about three minutes.

@panerai557 

Congratulations.

Just to give a quick update, been listening to MicroZOTL preamp 2.0 for 3 solid days, and I must say this kit rocks. Microzotl - x250.8 - falcon ls3/5a gb is a sublime combo. Extremely musical and enjoyable. I don't want to leave my hifi, that's how addictive it sounds... For those who owns this preamp, what tubes are you using? Any difference? 

Having recently listened to and have since ordered a Backert Labs 1.4, my experiences with the LTA compared to the Backert Labs preamp is much different than those listed about. And that is both the nice thing but also crazy thing about audio. And why one needs to try before one buys! Reviews are wonderful for alerting you to possibilities but to buy on stength of reviews alone is dangerous, or at the most, costly. I tried an LTA with the L2 upgrade and no matter what I did, I never could make it sound like music. I rolled tubes, tried different powercords, begged the Audio Gods to send me some epiphany as to what to try next but alas, I got zip, zero, nada. The LTA went home and fortunately I heard the Backert. Even with stock tubes it gave me almost immediately what the LTA did not: music. 

As always, YMMV and what is mentioned previously was just my experience. I was just surprised at what I experienced for what I read about the LTA I guess I let my expectations get the better of me. I had no such expectations about the Backert Labs since I was unfamiliar with it and did no research on it until after I heard it. 
I would just advise anyone contemplating either preamp or one over the other to be sure to give both a serious listen before dropping the bucks on either one.

PS: I know this reply to this post is rather old but I also realize that people still read these things so the information can be pertinent still.

I have the Rhythm 1.4 and can say that the sound is to my liking. The midrange is very intelligible with vocals and the bass is solid with no muddy reverberation. I have it connected to Sopra Focal 2’s , Aqua Acoustics LaScala DAC, Lumin U1 streamer with upgraded power supply, and McIntosh MC 462 amp. The Backert Labs preamp is worth an audition. Give Andy Tebbe a call and try one out. 

@panerai557 - I have the LTA preamp level 2 and love it. I have been recently become curious about how different tubes would influence its sound. Did you end up tube rolling the LTA at all? If so, mind sharing your results and recommendations? 

@bluethinker - I rolled the output tubes. I tried Electroharmonix 6sn7 and PSVANE 6sn7. Both produce clean / transparent sound. I currently use PSVANE as it sounds more organic and a tad softer upper freq. The big surprise came from fuse change. I replaced stock fuse with Synergistic Research Purple fuse and the improvement was easily heard! Bigger and fuller sound coming out from my Joseph Audio Perspective 2s. I'd suggest to upgrade fuse first before tube roll. Power cord is also very important. I tried different PC with this pre and so far I like Gutwire SV-12 cord the best with line up of PC I have. Feet are also important. Placing the unit with its stock feet deaden the sound. You need to use a quality isolator to hear its sonic clarity to fullest. BDR cones worked well, but I am looking to try others from Stacksaudio or Tomboaudio.