Still wish Stevecham and I could just switch to see what each other's amp sounds like. I do find it difficult to consider the Pass Labs XA-30.5 to be "poor quality power"... but would love to try the CJ amp without risk. Ohh well, trial and error is a fun enough route... |
As Unsound suggested earlier (nod to you bro!), you might also consider Krell, a brand I strongly recommend because I use a 400cx with my CS6s in my other system and it drives them adequately. The 6s are, in my opinion, more difficult to drive than the 2.4s. Plus, I know the 2.4s sound wonderful powered by this amp as I have tried this combination. The cx series autobiases to Class A operation, dependent on the input signal. You will need a preamp that outputs a balanced out (unless you're ready for some surgery to the amp). Also, Jeff Rowland, Audio Research, CJ 2500A (there was one on here recently) are additional candidate amps that I expect would power the 2.4s and sound great. |
Well, I guess I'm going to try out a McIntosh 402. Double the watts from my Pass and it'll still double down as the impedance drops. It was used by the previous owners of my 2.4s. Unless I just adore it, I'll probably still try to pick up a X250.5 and then sell the loser of the two. |
Hi all ! this is almost the same thread I was involved with regarding my Thiel 1.6 's and my Cary v12 amp . With the cary set to triode mode (50 wpc) ,the combo was very satisfying . However , everone looked up reviews ,charts, etc to try to prove to me that my combo simply would not work . Of course, nobody had the combo I had ,but they were convinced it was horrible . I always laugh when I see a thread like this . If You like it , rock on . |
Brad,
Yours and steve`s experience is another example of why actual listening will always mean more than speculation and preformed notions. |
Hi all ! Although I have since put the Thiels on consignment , the combo worked well for me in my smallish space , I was very happy with this combo for years . Now I prefer high efficiency / low power combos . Just another adventure in this great hobby . |
Brad I can understand your change in direction,you`ll be very happy. |
Hi all ! Yes , very happy with my current setup . Never thought I could be happy with 4 wpc . Off the subject perhaps but an article written by Steve Deckert explains why low power / hi efficiency gives greater realism to music , that article really opened my eyes . |
A thread update for future readers.
The little 30 W Pass amp just killed the 400W McIntosh. The Mac did help address the bass issue (although not a ton), but was bested in every other dimension by the Pass. Putting the Pass in the system was like lifting a veil off the music. You could hear so much more detail, a much better soundstage, and an elimination of a lot of glare in the sound. So much more delicate and natural. No contest between the two products for me.
Anyway, after this experience made me fall even harder for the INT-30A, I decided that maybe adding a sub to my system might allow me to keep all the benefits of the XA series, but also make up for the bass deficiencies I've had. Although I'd have preferred to have tried a Thiel sub, I ended up getting a decent price on an REL Storm III. I have to say that I'm extremely impressed with what this sub did to my system. Like others have commented, adding the sub opened up the soundstage and added depth to the music. I also watched Salt and listened to Tupac's All Eyes on Me (well recorded quality rap, btw), and the sub really made up for the previous bass deficiencies that had made these types of material feel flat and lifeless before. Yesterday was really the first time I've been fully satisfied with the stereo since beginning the upgrades in December.
I did end up purchasing an X250.5 to compare to the INT-30A, but only because I'd initiated that process before getting the sub. I'm actually very satisfied with the current setup and probably would have quit amp shopping if another day had passed. I will update the thread, however, after comparing these two amps.
Thanks for all the feedback folks. |
Thanks for the update. I look forward to reading about continuing quest. |
The thing about the Ayre amp is that not only is it a great sounding amp, but it is absolutely stable into difficult loads...and doubles its output with decreasing impedance. Note, as I mentioned above, its best sound comes from using it in balanced mode...which means a balanced preamp. |
Cal,
I appreciate the followup information. I`m not surprised with the superior results you realized with the lower power Pass amplifier . |
Well, it's been a while but I thought I should finish off this thread. The 30A ended up beating the X250.5. It was more natural sounding, with a little less harshness to the sound, although with poorer bass control (as everyone would expect). Voices sounded much more natural through the 30A and the soundstage and imaging were also better. It actually didn't take too long to make that decision.
I also replaced my REL Storm with a Thiel SS1 (and passive crossover). The SS1 definitely integrates better and is less boomy, although there are times where I feel that the REL made a slightly better band-aid for the bass issues I've experienced. Because it wasn't perfectly crossed-over, it overlapped a bit with the Thiel 2.4s and hid some of the bass a bit more than the SS1 does. |
Thanks for the update. I'm not at all surprised that the combination of the 30 and Thiel subs provided the most satisfaction. Enjoy! |
Looking for an update- All
anyone using an Ayre amp w/ Thiel loudspeakers?
|
jafant,
I heard the Ayre MX-R monos/KX-R pre/Ayre TT/Ayre phono with what I think were 2.4s (definitely the Thiels were pre-3.7 and of medium size) in the Ayre room at RMAF 2010 (Michael Fremer was in the room tying up all of the attention from the Ayre folks, so I could not speak with them and soon left), but I do know they were using Cardas cables which I detest excepting their phono wire, and I thought the sound was, uh, unspectacular. Very buttoned down sounding. Not at all the lively and dynamic sound I get from my 5i’s with Krell or Classe’ and my K-1xe. I am confident that it was not the Thiels nor the KX-R preamp, so either the turntable/cartridge, the amps, the room, or the cables were holding it back. Fremer was gushing about how great it sounded...
I speculate that the older V-1xe stereo amp would be a good choice ( affordable used and resells quickly) for your 2.4s if you wanna go Ayre. You know that I like the great older SS amps with Thiels, so YMMV.
Best to you jafant,
Dave
|
TY- Dave-
to my ears, Cardas cabling is rolled off. This could have been the culprit along w/ MF.
Happy Listening!
|
Hi jafant,
I thought about this some more and I want to be sure that I do not put you off on Ayre equipment. As you know, I have a K-1xe preamp with phono and a CX-7eMP CDP. I have heard different models of their products, both up and down the scale from my models within the Ayre line and also several of their amps. I have not heard the new "Twenty" line.
Ayre equipment is best described as neutral. Not the "neutral" that some reviewers use as a cop-out descriptive for subpar equipment that is overly lean or lacking in natural harmonics and richness. I mean neutral as in: it is neither additive nor subtractive.
Check me on this: Pick any piece of Ayre equipment, old or new. Find two or three reviews on that piece from Stereophile, TAS, Soundstage, etc. I defy you to find one article where there is any criticism regarding tonal colorations, excessive sibilance or lack or openness, dullness, brightness, excessive bloat or lack of definition , issues with bass control, or less than spectacular imaging and soundstage depth/width.
What you will find on occasion is that the reviewer will say he preferred the sound of another great component from another top brand because he valued a specific strength of the competitor’s unit in one attribute at the expense of another vs the Ayre, or he preferred a coloration (deviation from neutral) in the sound of the other brand of component vs the neutrality of the Ayre.
Best to you jafant,
Dave
|
