Aurender

@vonhelmholtz

That is correct. Not only we have varying I2S standards, there is no consistency between I2s connectors among manufacturers of DAC / Streamers. 

The software/DSP-level DSD-to-PCM conversion was aimed to accommodate compatibility with DACs that do not support DSD decoding on SPDIF or AES/EBU inputs. Typically, software/DSP-level DSD-to-PCM conversion almost always sounds terrible. That’s why Aurender’s transports like N10, N20 SPDIF / AES outputs allows an extremely high quality DSD-to-PCM conversion engine performed by FPGA using thousands of tap filters.

If you don’t prefer DSD to PCM conversion, then please use USB output on any of the Aurender streamers for high resolution files beyond 24bit/192kHz. BTW, N10 is now officially discontinued. You can still find good bargains on used N10’s but the newer N series is much improved over its predecessors.

“I’m sure that I have misrepresented things above, so please correct my understanding.”
Well, you certainly have! Let me try to clarify,

1. Coax and AES are the preferred outputs, but higher bandwidths require dual AES out, but I don’t have dual in on my DAC. - Only one model, W20SE in Aurender lineup sports Dual AES outputs and it was designed to mate with high end DAC’s that sports dual AES inputs like DCS.

2. Aurender’s top models claim to have great clocks, so why not pass this on to the DAC via I2s? - I2S is not a universally adopted digital protocol and there are known handshake issues between components featuring i2S from different manufacturers. If you study the pattern, the adopters of i2s protocol advocates using their own source (streamer) and DAC’s. For example, PS Audio, Rockna and AQUA HiFi. And Auralic promotes L-Link as best connection between their DAC and Streamer.

3. Top Aurenders accept external clocks and I assume this is used with a DAC that accepts external clocks, but why bother when I2s would take care of this? - See #2. Also read up on ‘Master Clock’ implementation in a high end digital system where both streamer and DAC greatly benefits from a master clock.

4. The argument against I2s is that there isn’t a standard, but this isn’t a problem in most implementations. - Please provide an example.

I am assuming you’re a ROON user. Nothing wrong with that but if I may ask why does everything needs to be Roon ready? Do you know what happens when there is no friendly competition? From what I have learned and read, ROON is not the best software when it comes to delivering audio?

You may wanna read up on Innuos ‘Sense’ users experience with ROON. Also there are reports that Taiko is soon to release their own app that is supposedly better than ROON. What does that say about ROON?

I am a lifetime subscriber of ROON and longtime user of Aurender. Atleast with Conductor app, I never have to wonder if I am getting the best audio quality. The conductors app has performed consistently and flawlessly over 10 plus years. Over the years, I have owned N100, N10, N20, ACS100 and my current DAC sports ROON Core + Renderer and external Master Clock.

“Aurender’s USB interface was not optimized.”

@vonhelmholtz

I say you got nothing to worry about!

• Aurender’s Dedicated USB Audio Output

  USB is historically prone to transferring noise between devices. That’s why Aurender’s dedicated USB Audio output is physically and electrically isolated from the noise-generating CPU board to minimize noise in the sensitive audio interconnect.

• The May DAC has the new and exclusive USB Enhanced module (L2 and KTE ONLY) which has our FPGA with the new Titanis 2.0 and custom firmware to improve USB Eye Pattern and reduce latency to near zero as well as reduce jitter to very very low levels. The USB module has completely new code written to optimize performance and reduce latency significantly. Low frequency performance (-40db) is also improved. The “enhanced” USB xmos module is twice as powerful/capable as the one that is used in the Spring2.

@vonhelmholtz 

Whichever ‘digital’ output you end up preferring from any of the Aurender transport (streamer) is largely depends on your DAC implementation of USB and legacy digital inputs like AES or SPDIF.  As a long time Aurender user, I can say with utmost confidence that they are built to very high standards and no matter which digital output you use, Aurender will faithfully render the digital bits to your DAC. Another important consideration while choosing a streamer is the app interface. Once you get your replacement DAC, reach out to Aurender dealer for in-home audition. Good luck! 

“I honestly don"t see what I am missing sound wise vs. Aurender ”
@baylinor

May I know if you did any comparison between Node vs Aurender or any other streamer to arrive at that conclusion. 

@baylinor 

I appreciate the invite. I would love to connect with you and listen to your amazing system next time I visit Austin. My point of engagement was not to cast doubt on what you’re hearing with Node 2, which is a great performer for the money and even better with upgraded power supply. Bottom line, if you’re satisfied with what you’ve put together then it shouldn’t matter what else out there. 

I used to own Vault 2 so I can say from my experience, Aurender streamers offers a substantial upgrade in sound over Node albeit at higher price of admission. Streamer is just one piece of the pie, so one needs to ensure your rest of the system is up to the task. My impressions of Node vs Aurender are in the context of my system (listed here under my moniker). 

You’re welcome to stop by next time you’re in Houston. 

@mkdm11

I enjoyed my time with N20 immensely (paired with EMM Labs DA2). I believe N20 holds a sweet spot if you can utilize all of its brilliant features. As far as settings goes, my recommendation would be to play with each setting and keep what sounds best to your ears. The same applies to digital output, AES vs USB. All of these choices are subjective…I guess my point is it would be a shame to not explore all the features on a transport like N20 :-)

When I had my N20, I did not prefer any upsampling or DSD conversion. I had my N20 connected using both AES (for files upto 24bit/192kHz) and USB for DSD’s. Another thing I really appreciated was CLM (critical listening mode) in N20. It further drops the noise floor and allows you appreciate quiet passages and space between instruments.

Use best digital cables you can afford. And lastly, if you have not yet; tweak your Ethernet signal with a passive filter from Network Acoustics’s ENO or Muon. They will further relax the sound and take off any digital edge or grunge.

I intentionally held back my feedback on one of the most important feature of N20, the clock input. PM me if you are curious about the master clock input. 

Would you please share rest of your system?

“For now, a Node with an external linear power supply, a great digital interconnect, my DAC and a NAS gives me audiophile bliss. What’s wrong with that?”

@dinov

There is nothing wrong with the your current system. But your previous statement on Aurender being not NAS friendly is inaccurate. My Aurender can access music stored on its internal drives or as well as external NAS on my network.

“Not only does it sound better, the N30SA costs $10K less”
@blisshifi

Have you compared Taiko running on XDMS with N30 in your system?

@blisshifi

You’re probably right! If I am faced with the decision to pick between Taiko + XDMS with marginal gains over N30SA, I am very likely to keep the $10K savings.

The T+A SDV3100 scenario you shared is what I find most interesting. If you have to try really hard to tell the difference between SDV3100 streaming client and N30SA, then my hats off to T+A. But I know there is little bit more to the story, the T+A interface for Qobuz / Tidal is not very user friendly (you can’t have it all, right). A close friend of mine who owns SDV3100 actually prefers Taiko over SDV3100 internal streaming client.

You gotta love the subjective nature of our hobby :-) I do appreciate your candid feedback, thank you!

@blisshifi

Pink Faun has developed fully customized OS called Euphony Stylus. The end users can switch between Roon and Stylus depending on one’s preferences in playback quality and UI experience. You can also add Merging Technologies +player to above list. The implementation of ROON in their +player is just as remarkable not to mention the adoption of RAVENNA which allows streaming upto DSD256 over Ethernet.