Hi!
I´ve now reached listening period for Mundorf S/O in X-over
of Merlin VSMX, more than 800 hours for mid/bass and tweeter more. Still find them improving, you have to be patient to find peak point of burnt-in. Compared from start they definitely opened up. Sound is more lush with powerful distinct bass and pronounced overtones. Midrange/treble wonderful relaxed with no sign of edginess whatsoever. You can listen very loud for hours and hours without fatigue. I´m sensitive to trumpets and clarinets especially on high level, with Mundorfs no problem. Listening to Herbie Hancock-Quartet, Putte Wickman-Wickman in Wonderland, Wynton Marsalis-Black Codes, Jazz At The Pawnshop is a sheer joy and sensation of live performance. Due to more powerful bass (than Hovlands) I find soundstage improving, it sounds bigger.
The sound is so relaxed but yet powerful and detailed with a darker background.
The brush stroking over the drum in Lady Be Good-Jazz At...
sounds more pronounced and real. I can go on and on of improvements that I hear.
It was definitely worth the cost of $1100.
I also use S/O in BAM, across tweeter terminal with Duelund resistor and also in phono stage. Wether al this contributes or not, I suspect it does.
Spacing these giant capacitors inside cabinet wasn´t easy and should be wisely considered before. Unfortunately i missed taking fotos before assembling X-over back onto cabinet. I used fast drying glue sticks that are melted through a gun look-alike heater for adhere capacitors against X-over board and secured extra with plastic straps around capacitor and through board. Glue is partly to take up vibrations apart from adhering.
Bear in mind!
This is my opinion/impression and should not be taken as granted.
Many thanks and hope this can be useful for those who considered taking the step. |
Nmanuel,
Thanks for the listening impressions. The new MXR sounds like another large step forward in the pursuit of 2 way excellence. |
hey all, i thought i would jump back in and give my impressions on the newest merlin iteration, the VSM-MXr. by way of introduction, this all started for me about 5 years ago. i originally owned the VSM-MX for about 3 years. i sent them back to bobby for the "lead-free" upgrade, and upgraded the BAM batteries. with this upgrade, i found the sound to be even more continuous, more dynamic, and more energetic. i have a largish room with vaulted ceilings, and i found the upgraded VSM-MXe's to be more room filling. a little while after that, i got the itch and decided to sell my upgraded lead free VSM-MXe's to a friend locally, who was willing to wait for me to get the new pair of fully lead free VSM-MXe's, with a lead free BAM.
after a wait, bobby surprised me with a pair of VSM-MXr's. full disclosure--simultaneously i also upgraded my digital front end from an audio aero prima to the AA capitole classic SE; AND, i bought a two level critical mass direct coupling rack for my filarmonia and the cap classic. my reference analog front end is unchanged--VPI TNT 6 hotrod.
i've got about 500 hours on the VSM-MXr's, and about 300 hours on the critical mass system. just like all the prior merlin upgrades, this one too gives you MORE of what's so special about the merlins to begin with. the speakers are now more continuous form top to bottom, more articulate and more authoritative in the low end, and the top end is even more precise and natural. the stage is more expansive. they're still tonally neutral, they still disappear completely from the room. but the sense of realism is heightened, so the sound is even more "life-like," less like a recording. in that way, the speakers are even more emotive.
i'm waiting for my turn on the master BAM and RC parts upgrade, which i'm hoping will make the speakers even more authoritative in the low end, which i want since i'm trying to energize such a large spatial volume.
as is, IMO, the new VSM-MX's do justify their "r" designation. they sound to my ear clearly better than my prior merlins, a different animal. |
Hi Guys!
After listening more than 400 hours on Mundorf S/O caps for midrange/bass it wasn´t until yesterday I noticed big improvement. I´m shure peak hasn´t been reached yet, based on fact that S/O for treble also has improved past days. The "trebles" I´ve had for more than 800 hours.
What can I say but I´ll be back.
Many Thanks! |
Hi Guys!
I have now installed Mundorf S/O for midrange/bass in x-over, i.e. x-over is complete with S/O and Duelund resistors. 10 hours later sound is hard/edgy and a cold in upper midrange. Bass somewhat indistinct/blurry but powerful. I´ll be back with opinion in some weeks.
Many Thanks! |
Clabe, I agree with Bobby on the Mundorf sound. I've tried the Mundorf Silver oils in various places in my system, thin out mids and brighten highs. I've heard the Mundorf golds are a bit better in mids. I will only use Mundorfs as replacements in my Merlins. I should have my Duelund copper foils in tweeter position in the next week or so. Next to Duelunds, Hovlands sound best in Merlins IMO. |
Bobby, yes I have.
Regards |
you have the s/o in the bam and in the treble of the crossover?
b |
Hi Bobby!
I haven´t got the S/O:s yet, ordered them yesterday.
I was talking about the treble area which I´ve replaced with S/O that´s been running "now" for 36o hours.
I will tell i due time.
Thanks! |
tonally the s/o cap is full but it depresses the mids and collapses the depth and layering. have you noticed this?
b |
Hi Bobby!
I´m not going to try Duelunds, already got Mundorf S/O in the Bam for a long time and I`m very pleased.
Than You! |
clabe, you must try the duelunds in the bam and rcs.
this will make the most improvement. the cryoed hovlands and caddocks in the speakers are really excellent.
best, b |
Hi Guys!
After 330 hours of continious play through speakers they finally opened up. Sound was was hars and nasal on voices at begining, now it opened up with smooth but detailed.
I don´t now how much Duelunds silver resistor influence on this since I don´t know if any burn-in is needed for these.
Comparatively with Hovlands sound is smoother and yet as detailed if not more. I´ve just ordered Mundorf for (16.8 microF) for midrange/bass element. I´ll be back.
Have a nice day! |
Hi Bobby!
This is just a start/experiment, if you don´t try .....
who knows.
Have a nice day! |
i think i know what you will end up with clabe. it will certainly be different sounding but better? having the tweeter cap different than the woofer cap will make an imbalance, not recommended. plus you have some cryoed caps and some not, again not recommended.
other things could have been doe to the speakers that would have made them clearly superior.
imho.
b |
Pubul57!
You can now se exchange of X-over in my "system". |
Hi Pubul57!
Duelund are the resistors, capacitors are Mundorf (not Duelund). I´ve got Mundorf S/O in the BAM and also in my phono pre, try to stick with the same make.
Sorry, I obviously missed to update my system. I will try again with photos. |
Clabe, did you mean Dueland capacitor, or is this a change different than the "Master" upgrade offered by Bobby? |
Hi Guys!
Finally, yesterday I exchanged the Hovland capacitor for tweeter and Caddock resistors in my Merlins VSMx. Replacement Mundorf Silver I/O and Duelund resistor.
Immediate listening sound was sort of imbalanced, treble was missing/low. After 14 hours it was improving but still imbalanced, rumours say it will take up to 400 hours.
I will report in a couple of weeks.
If interseted, there some photos in my "system" of the exchange.
|
paul,
the mxr evolved because of the master products, their more robust sound and most importantly because of our cabinet material change. this cabinet material became available to us a number of months ago and is a new product in itself.
best regards, b
|
Nmanuel,
Thanks for sticking your oar in the water.
If you can, please check back into the thread after MBam and RC with 400or so hours after full break-in with your impressions. I'll look forward to them for sure!
Thanks again,
Jim |
Thanks for the therapy:) But seriously, I do feel I am at a stage where I can stay with the MXe, love them, and not be looking for the next upgrade, especially one that would require selling the MXe. I look forward to hearing the Duelands..... |
paul, the speakers sound very different with the master bam and rcs in place. i tried an experiment and i liked what i heard. increased mass and rigidity work well with the more robust sound of the master products. it was time because of them. the mxr and the master products were in development for a long time. there is no doubt in my mind that the mxe is better with them. you will be fine.
best, b |
i previously owned the VSM-MXe's, and sold them recently to a friend. this past week, i received the VSM-MXR's, and this past weekend set them up. i'm very early in the break-in, but right out of the box the MXR's are a different animal. they're both more authoritative AND more articulate in the low end. my rock albums sound better than ever. i've ordered the master BAM and rc's as well, and will be looking forward to setting those up when it comes my turn.
i'll be happy to post more as the MXR's break in. |
Seems like the benefits of mass and rigidity, to whatever degree they are so, or were ever an issue for the various iterations of the VSMs, has been known, or should have been known, for a long time, why implement that now? Whereas the Dueland seems to be the implementation of something that was not possible before, till Bobby found and realized signficant improvement in these capacitors - a new technology, that simply was never avaiable before. That is an upgrade that makes sense to me, and one that was not available during the previous 20 years of the VSMs evolution. |
Here is an Email Bobby sent me re: The difference between Mxe and the new MXr.
jim,
the cabinet material has been changed to a better sounding one imho. the sand chamber is larger and the double baffle on the front of the cabinet extended to the top of the sand chamber. the cabinet weighs more by a few pounds. when you add mass to a speaker cabinet it usually drives the q down so the bass sounds more extended. with the firing plane/baffle being more rigid the speakers sound like they go deeper and with more kick. better pitch defintion imho too. less resonace on the front baffle makes the hf sound more focused and precise.
ok?
best regards,
b |
Tab110,
Want to......................probably. Going to.....................never say never :-) |
Jon,
Just order. You know you want to. |
Bobby,
Great.
What are the difference in a nut shell? |
jim, the editor of fedelta del suono in italy will be doing a comparison because he owns both the mxe and mxr. |
Don,
Please do tell us the difference between MXe vs MXr?
Thanks,
Jim |
don, more like 8 weeks if all goes as planned.
remember the curing time.
paul, imho, you will be very pleased with the improvements the master products bring. some like don, need to know they have every percentage point of what is possible.
you are both right.
i used the mxe with master products in denver and had the best show ever.
best regards,
b |
I think I'll live with the MXe with MasterBAM for a long while. If I'm not happy now, then happy is too elusive and too much of a moving target. Of course, it is good news for those buying new that might have an even better version of one of the great speakers of all-time. |
Hi All: Sold my MXes with SuperBAM and just ordered the MX-rs with Master BAM and RCs.Will probably take 4-6 weeks to get them. Don |
We're all gonna do it...sooner or later. I think Donaudio has his up for sale to aqurire the MXr. |
|
Tab110s,
Refresh our memories...........MXr, larger port, different cabinet, more mass damping???
Jim |
Who's gonna be the first Merlin nut to have the new MXr(I'm planning on going to RMAF this year)? |
800+ hours and they are really singing. The drivers are in perfect balance and the sound continuos top to bottom. This has resulted in very long fatigue free listening sessions that are most enjoyable. |
At around 200 hours now, and just wanted to chime in with my latest impressions. System is singing!!! There's always been a feminine quality to the refinement of each incarnation of the VSM that I've heard. Now, on top of that, they're ballsy! Perfect alchemical marriage of male/female qualities. Merlin indeed! |
|
paul, yes the bam likes the buffering and i designed it to be used that way. but undertand that we have many using the bam between a pre and power or with a passive line stage and preferring it that way. it still is a matter of taste to a point, but i know yours and you will prefer it used the way it was intended to be. passives and digital amps work well with underdamped speakers as you know. the vsm/bam limits the bandwidth to the resonant frequency (28 hz) of the woofer so there is no 2nd and 3rd order distortion. in essence the slower boomy bass that is caused by these distortions is gone and that is why the vsm/bam combination likes the tube buffering.
ok?
best regards,
b |
Bobby, does the BAM need the buffering, is that why Passives just don't work right with the BAM? |
Boy, when you get them for your BAM, I have to imagine it is going to make a significantly great impact as those capaitors will proceed the entire chain execept for the source. Can't wait to hook them up. |
I upgraded the RCA networks to the new caps without upgrading the BAM. I will upgrade the BAM later but these impressions are only for the RCA upgrade. I enjoy the new caps and agree with what everybody is saying. I also think they add more timbre to the instruments, more detail but in a good way. More body if you will. The upgrade is noticeable and is more than worth it. |
paul, for the vsm speaker and the bam, tube line output stages do a better job of this function especially if it is a great one. ss can buffer it too but it will sound more damped. think of the sound between great tubes and the best ss.
ok?
b |
Yea! Nothing else needed. |
Bobby, is the issue having a buffer stage, or having a tube buffer stage? |
yes he has a fila paul and the fila has a passive pre.
but the fila is one of the only passives that i have heard that sounds right. not thin and lean. if it is for this reason then he does not need a buffer stage and if he has multiple sources then we can add inputs to his sbam. so he can be taken care of either way. on the fila i use the cdp into the bam and the bam out to the cd input.
best, b |
Tabl10s, are you talking about an integrated without a tube linestage? |
