@lordmelton 'digital noise' ... meaning ... bits or bytes get lost or altered during transfer from one end of the cable to the other end? In that case we would not be able to transfer a software file without errors. But we are ... gigabytes without error. I wonder why with audio we start to lose bits?
AES/EBU cable shootout
As I had promised (please refer to Grimm Mu1 thread and Fee for Audition thread under Digital for more context), I am going to share my experiences using different AES/EBU cables in my system. I am going to gloss over the general question of whether cables, especially digital cables make a difference. I am always careful in choosing my components, and unless something makes a tangible improvement in sound, I will never pay for something. If something makes an improvement, I do evaluate if it’s worth the asking price, and only then do I purchase it. So it’s up to you to decide if something is worth the price that you pay for. Also, please note that, these findings apply to my system in my room and may not translate into the same findings in your system.
Now let’s go into what I heard in my system. I had the following AES/EBU cables. The Mogami cable, Shunyata Omega cable, Nordost Odin 2 cable and the Sablon cable. Unfortunately I was unable to obtain the Jorma design cable as I was unable to reach the cable company either through phone or email. I am not aware of any other dealer who carries it near me.
There is a significant difference between the basic Mogami and the rest of the cables. The difference is easy to discern in the bass. There is simply more texture, dimensionality, and clarity that is missing in bass with the Mogami cable. This is unfortunate as this is the cheapest cable. The rest of the cables are closer to each other. It takes a bit of back-and-forth of listening to discern the differences.
First up was the Shunyata cable. This is an excellent digital cable which is extremely natural sounding. Everything sounds clear with a nice sound stage. The sound stage extends beyond the speakers with a nice depth to it. There is a sense of fullness to the sound, more fleshed out, but in a very natural way. This is the first cable that I had for evaluation (this belongs to my friend). I will be very happy with this cable, if it were my only option. This cable retails for around 4.5 k.
Next step was the Nordost Odin 2 cable. I understand that there is a significant jump in price as this cable retails for over 12 K. The difference between the Shunyata and the Odin 2 cable is more subtle. The primary difference is in the sound stage. The sound extends well beyond the speakers and front to depth soundstage is increased compared to Shunyata. There is also more detail and air at the top end. There is slightly more dynamics with the Odin 2 cable on back-and-forth listening. Please note, these differences are not in your face but subtle. Whether this is worth the price difference is something only you can decide.
The last cable that I had was the Sablon cable. The other cables measured 1.5 m but the Sablon was 1 m. I could not test if the length of cable makes a difference as I did not have the same cable in different lengths. (Please refer to Grimm Mu1 thread for context.)
The Sablon cable brings a lot of nuance to the entire spectrum of sound. The bass is taut and has a lot of finesse. String instruments reveal a good amount of inner detail, whether it’s plucking or bowing. Percussion sounds realistic. It nicely brings out the textures and extremely accurate with regards to tone and timbre. The mid range is extremely clear and well presented, which is one of the strengths of this cable. The top end is clean and extremely accurate. It has an uncanny ability to make the softest sounds really fleshed out and clear. If are a Pink Floyd fan “Hello Colonel, how are you tonight” never sounded this clear, it’s like you are on shrooms.
This is how I would compare the Shunyata, Nordsost and Sablon. The system plays a huge role in laying out the differences. The bass is similar in all the three cables, they go deep, feel taut and have a lot of textures. It’s the midrange and highs that sound different. Nordstrom has a very neutral and sweet presentation that is very inviting. It sizzles in the top end and has superb dynamics. The other two cables cannot touch the Nordost in the highs. The Sablon shines in the midrange. It has one of the most accurate midrange sound and sounds really organic. The nordost is close but Sablon wins the midrange. The Shunyata is close to the other cables but does not sound better. So what did I choose? The sizzling dynamic Nordost or the realistic sounding Sablon?
I always believed that the highs are most important for music to sound alive and imparting the feeling of being there. But Sablon changed my opinion, it’s the midrange that gives the sensation of live music. The Sablon made the music sound more alive than other 2 cables. The difference with Nordost is subtle but definite. The other important thing especially for me was tone and timbre. I play violin and I value tone and timbre (reason for the choice of my speakers) as the most important attribute.The Sablon again wins this. Of course the price is the icing on the cake. So I have decided to buy the Sablon. Of course, in your system and for your ears, the outcome may not be the same. My recommendation is to try before you buy especially considering the price of the these cables.
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@rudyb I guess the simplest way to explain this is is digital noise, due to the fact that there isn’t any scientific data to support audible differences. Sometimes when you stream video or watch DVDs you may experience digital noise, it’s the blocking out of parts of the picture. You can still see what’s going on but you’re losing small parts of the video. That’s the best way I can explain it. Lesser systems and cables etc., will lose parts of the picture/sound but these losses will only be profound in revealing systems. Hope this helps, but about 50% or people can’t hear a difference. They’re just cloth eared, just like the people who eat to live compared to those who live to eat. |
Yep …. There is a reason why many audio fest exhibitors select NORDOST ODIN as their primary go-to choice of cable for their stratospheric highs and resolution , , along with CARDAS CLEAR BEYOND / CLEAR for those who prefer a slightly more warmer & silky smooth presentation but on par in detail, transparency, slam, and dynamics. the ODIN is truly a wondrous piece …. But its prohibitive cost is a slam barrier to most enthusiasts in this forum, without prejudice to any bespoke disputed or embraced conclusion of whether the cost to performance value matrix in terms of “ is it worth it “ makes sense to its buyer. |
“If I gave the impression that these sound restrained in the upper frequencies, I am sorry but that’s not the case.” @svenjosh no you didn’t give that impression at all, I was just interested as to whether there was any difference on these fronts at all. I’m decided, I am going to buy a Sablon AES! @svenjosh it does make me wonder how the Sablon XLR analog interconnects might perform against your Odin 2 analog interconnects…. Any chance you can see if Mark would send you a demo pair? Just wondering if you might find similar findings as with the comparison of the digital cables. |
Thanks for sharing your impressions about digital cables. Cables do make a difference and a system like yours, one doesn’t need to strain hard to discern the differences between cables. I experienced similar transformation when I switched from a basic digital cable to Acrolink 6N-D5070 II digital cable. BTW, I just looked at your system. You deserve props for putting together a magnificent system. I am very familiar with Shindo sound…..still regret selling my Monbrison to this day. Couple of questions, 1) Are you using Shunyata PC’s instead of stock ‘grey’ cord on Shindo gear, 2 ) Have you tried Mr. T in your system The biggest challenge back then was finding suitable speakers that can be driven effectively with a fine amp like, Western Electric 300B Limited. Now that I have heard WVL (Chicago), Cessaro (Opus - I) and Horning (Aristotle or Eufrodite) speakers at my dealer, the possibility of all Shindo system is something worth pursuing in a very near future. |
This is the Mogami cable I used https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B079JPY5PV?psc=1&ref=ppx_pop_mob_b_asin_title |
@ghdprentice I wholeheartedly agree with your impressions on the interconnects as i have the Odin 2 interconnects for both my analog and digital. The Nordost gave a significant (component level) upgrade in my system. It was extremely complimentary with my tube gear. (un)fortunately the differences with AES cables are not as striking as the interconnect cables. I believe the Nordost that I demoed was already broken in, not sure how many hours though. |
@nyev the Sablon and Omega were similar at the top end. Both portray natural extension and decay. If I gave the impression that these sound restrained in the upper frequencies, I am sorry but that’s not the case. Unless you hear the Nordost, you will find both Shunyata and Sablon to be perfectly natural without any roll off. As far as soundstage depth, the Sablon has an advantage especially with vocals and acoustic music as its strength is midrange. There is a subtle but distinct difference in soundstage depth and width. The Sablon is slightly more nuanced and presents a beautifully layered sound that’s addictive. |
OP,
Thank you very much for your observations on these cables. I really appreciate your comments.
I was fortunate enough to spend a couple weeks with a set of Nordost Odin 2 interconnects. I observed the same things that you did. But after a few days I started noticing a whole new level of refined detail I had never before heard. I guess high end audio has alway been like this… layer after layer of nuance as you learn and improve equipment. I was really quite surprised at what these interconnects revealed about my equipment… the complete layer I was not hearing. Unfortunately, my average component cost was about $20K and the interconnects were $17K, I just couldn’t do it without considering what improvements I could get by putting that money into better components. I will say, the Nordost Odin 2 are truly world class interconnects. |
@svenjosh thanks so much for this comparison! Really helpful. Congrats on arriving at an informed and cost effective decision. Two questions I have: 1) Can you comment on the upper frequency differences between the Omega and Sablon, along with how each does with presenting “air” and a sense of unconstrained, free-flowing top end? If a component doesn’t do well in this area it’s game over for me, and that is what I found was lacking when testing the Aurender N20 in my MU1 thread. Sounds like the Nordost clearly wins in this department but wondering if you could comment on how the Omega and Sablon compare in this area. And, 2) How do the Omega and Sablon compare when it comes to soundstage width and depth?
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