Agear - yes I did. I drove the 1.2miles from my house to Brett's and listened to the Behold and to the Ascendo. The Behold was not for me. Very accurate and hiFi sounding to my ears. And it requires a whole Behold system. The Ascendo was actually very good. It didn't have the low end punch I am looking for though. I'm not sure if their higher end speakers would offer that. But he didn't have any others in display.
I definitely am drawn to a truly full range speaker with deep extension, accurate reproduction leaning towards the forceful side; with a sense of impact and scale that some speakers sacrifice to reproduce the lower frequencies with more accuracy and a sense of finesse. I almost see it as live vs studio... Live is scale, impact and dynamic while the studio recording is more accurate with finesse and the gentle skilled hand of a studio engineer to properly reproduce every nuance.
I also definitely like my speakers with a sense of midrange texture that some may consider colored. Not overly warm or truly colored, but the harmonics that the low midrange creates that are emotion and soul. The speakers that reproduce the source with accuracy and finesse are, to me, frequently lacking texture, complexity and that sense of engaging emotional involvement that is the reason I love this hobby.
Don't get me wrong. I expect my SYSTEM to be accurate and offer finesse and subtly in its reproduction, but I expect to accentuate those characteristics with my DAC/electronics and cables.
To me, thus far in my system, the Coltane Tenor has come the closest to doing that perfectly. |
"I promise this thread will end up back on the DAC track when the speaker decision has been finalized."
Shouldn't this be done in the speaker forum??
Cheers george
|
Matt, if you do get a chance to listen, make sure its a newer one with the floor Bassplate "Bodenplatten".
I see you are a basshound! LoL
Good thread and I agree with Gear that the segue into other audio areas is well appreciated. |
To my ears and on my system the lavry gold was the most emotional / musical dac compared to all the others I heard at the time that I bought my dac 2 years ago. sorry delayed response but I don't usually post much .. |
08-02-15: Mattnshilp
I definitely am drawn to a truly full range speaker with deep extension, accurate reproduction leaning towards the forceful side; with a sense of impact and scale that some speakers sacrifice to reproduce the lower frequencies with more accuracy and a sense of finesse. I almost see it as live vs studio... Live is scale, impact and dynamic while the studio recording is more accurate with finesse and the gentle skilled hand of a studio engineer to properly reproduce every nuance. In other words, you want to be this guy: https://iconicphotos.files.wordpress.com/2010/05/images_maninchair.jpg?w=700&h=297Is that a Jersey thing? |
Lol. Yes. I want to be that guy. But with a good stereo, a more comfortable chair, a margarita in my hand and a beautiful women on my lap.
Go Joisey!
;) |
Ha! I knew it. I share your sonic bias. Live but organic. I have heard a lot of stellar systems and reproduction, but I get bored as the auditory illusion is weak (sounds like a stereo). One tricky thing is amp/speaker synergy. I have struggled with that part as much as anything. If your speakers are see through transducers, amp changes are glaring. I have weaknesses for a lot of different types of speakers, and I am single driver fan. The best midrange I have heard out of a speaker in a show setting was from the Voxativ Impeggios (hooked up to a vintage Lector tubed CDP and 2W DHT mono blocks) at the 2011 Axpona in Atlanta. It was beautiful. Of course, when we popped in Jazz Party from Duke Ellington, it fell apart. Voxativ now has a newer speaker with a dipole sub: http://www.6moons.com/audioreviews2/voxativ/1.htmlSteve Hoffman owns the first pair in the US whatever that's worth.... The Trenner still has my personal interest. It may be worth at least hearing the Ra to get a taste of their house sound. "Supposedly" live and dynamic sounding. The Isis is still probably the right model given your Jersey roots. They just need to choose a better name.... |
Matt, have you auditioned the Aerial Acoustics T20 V2?
I know They have been recently discontinued but a friend of mine just picked up one of the last pairs and they sound much better to me than all his speakers before.
For me, the only speakers I have heard that could be mistaken for live music on some recordings. |
The ISIS are big and really load the room.
Fischer und Fischer Granite speakers are another one to consider, but not sure if even LauferTecknic carries them. |
Matt, i find your speaker quest very interesting; I definitely am drawn to a truly full range speaker with deep extension, accurate reproduction leaning towards the forceful side; with a sense of impact and scale that some speakers sacrifice to reproduce the lower frequencies with more accuracy and a sense of finesse. I almost see it as live vs studio... Live is scale, impact and dynamic while the studio recording is more accurate with finesse and the gentle skilled hand of a studio engineer to properly reproduce every nuance.
I also definitely like my speakers with a sense of midrange texture that some may consider colored. Not overly warm or truly colored, but the harmonics that the low midrange creates that are emotion and soul. The speakers that reproduce the source with accuracy and finesse are, to me, frequently lacking texture, complexity and that sense of engaging emotional involvement that is the reason I love this hobby. it is interesting because the things you seek are attributes of the speakers you just got rid of, the EA MM3's. it's hard to settle for less than we already had. not to say that there was not legit reasons to switch, no speaker or speaker-room relationship is perfect. but the MM3's are 'big-boy' speakers and a hard act to follow. i owned Kharma Exquisite Reference 1D's for 3 years, then had other Kharma's. they very much remind me of the Martin Coltrane. i also owned Marten Dukes. then eventually i ended up with the EA MM3's for 5 years. i can see where those speakers do come close to the MM3's in some ways, but are not quite capable of the whole picture. they have that transparent and refined ceramic mid-range, and that 'Kharma' coherence. but they don't quite get the total weight and tone in the mid range of the MM3's since they don't quite have the heft in the bottom end. it will be fun to see what you end up with. good luck on your quest. i can relate to your reasoning's. |
Mike, I think Matt liked the MM3s but they overloaded his room..... |
I heard the granite speaker twice in two different rooms. Didn't do it for me.
I spoke with the T&F dealer. He insists the Isis are too big for my room and the Ra would do me just fine. He says they go down to 25hz without an issue but the web site says 40hz. He seams to think the Ra are the greatest things since sliced bread. I need to look into the Ra more to see how low they go.....
I'm going to try to hear the Nola Metro Grand Reference (which is rear ported unless I look at the only sealed enclosure model which is, I think, too big for my room and almost $75k). But worth listening.
I'm also going to take a ride to Philly to hear the Joseph Pearl 3.
I have heard the Aerial 20 and I thought it was a tad bright. They are coming out with a new 12 or 13T (don't remember which # is it) and it may be bottom ported and it will use a soft some tweeter. About 9-12 months out. I own a pair of 10T's and I love them. They live in my Family Room and I will never given them up.
I just need to decide if a 2.5 hour drive is worth it to get my ears on the Ra and BMC speakers..... |
Hi Mike.
I'm sort of honored you are posting. I feel like we've hit the big time if we caught your attention with this thread. Lol. I have to admit I have been following your build since you had the Kharmas in your room, years ago. You are the reason I needed to hear the MM3's and that I was willing to actually buy a pair just to hear them since there was no other realistic way to hear them.
That said, I was not disappointed with their performance and they do everything I wanted. But the size of the speakers and my room size limited my ability to place them properly to get the most out of them. Jon Tinn was amazingly helpful and a true gentlemen; he really helped me and went the extra mile to guide me in placing the speakers properly. In the end, my room ended up requiring their placement in a nearfield setup that sounded absolutely stunning. But I felt like they were headphones considering their size and my proximity to these huge towers.
If I had been able to pull them further off the front wall I would have had way more flexibility in their placement.
So if someone wants a stupid deal on a pair of MM3's let me know. |
Matt since you are willing to shell out some, why not these:
http://lumenwhite.com/silverflame_d_uk.html
I know the designer and he is verrrry talented (brilliant, actually)and is a pioneer. A real perfectionist.
Full range! 20-35K
time coherent, phase coherent, resonance coherent
Pretty efficient too and I knw they have won several best in shows. |
Even better the White lights
premieres
the "white light anniversary" reference monitor loudspeakers at the munich high-end
show 2015 celebrating 15 years of innovation in high end audio design.
introduced in 2000, lumen white`s original "white light" reference monitors became instant legends, rated "best in class" (audio art, taiwan), "one of the best audio components of all times" (stereo sound, japan), an "ultimate, absolute reference in every category" (fedeltà del suono, italy), and as offering "sonic realism which may prove impossible to surpass" (hörerlebnis, germany).
the "white light" reference monitors featured the world`s first all-ceramic driver array, radically advanced pressure- and flow-dynamics optimized, air-damped, instrumentgrade tone-wood cabinets, purist crossover design and further advancements of the art.
5 years in the making, the latest iteration of flow- and pressure-dynamics modelling, a completely new, custom designed driver array and continuous advancements of our signatory loudspeaker technologies have prepared the stage for lumen white to introduce a new generation of our reference monitor speaker designs, the new technology plattform to be premiered in a special "anniversary" model of the iconic "white light" monitors format.
the "white light anniversary" reference monitors premiered in a mythical white macassar finish at the high end 2015 show in munich, together with the latest generation of lumen white`s acclaimed, limited edition "mystere" air bearing turntable system.
http://lumenwhite.com/news_uk.html |
08-03-15: Mattnshilp
I spoke with the T&F dealer. He insists the Isis are too big for my room and the Ra would do me just fine. He says they go down to 25hz without an issue but the web site says 40hz. He seams to think the Ra are the greatest things since sliced bread. I need to look into the Ra more to see how low they go.....
I have heard the Aerial 20 and I thought it was a tad bright. They are coming out with a new 12 or 13T (don't remember which # is it) and it may be bottom ported and it will use a soft some tweeter. About 9-12 months out. I own a pair of 10T's and I love them. They live in my Family Room and I will never given them up.
I just need to decide if a 2.5 hour drive is worth it to get my ears on the Ra and BMC speakers..... Bob told me they have used the Isis speakers in smallish hotels rooms? I think it may be setup dependent. I am interested in the Ra as well and was actually going to fly down to TX to hear them (Bob has the entire lineup at his home). My MO was finding a speaker for a standard living space. The wife wants to move in the next year or so, and I need a speaker that can be easily used in a normal living room (crammed against a back wall) with small creatures running about. She HATES my current granite monoliths (which are superb speakers but look like sepulchers). I asked about the bass on the Ra as well, and although they measure to 40 Bob claims they spit stuff out in the 20s due to their horn loading. I also like the idea of a high efficiency, wide baffle design with directivity that "limits" the room. I have Viva amps and they often mate those two at shows. I like Aerial. They are one of the few companies that is able to make ribbons sound tonally correct. Great speakers but I have only heard older models. I have always liked High Water's rooms at shows. The Cessaro horns are nice as are the Horning stuff.... |
T&F are great speaker builders, but I see the RA is indeed listed at 40hz , f-6db. The Isis is 28. Perhaps as Gear says it could be the room setup. The ISIS loaded the good sized mini-conference room at Zurich show and Andreas was not there and asked me what I thought. When I told him, he seemed genuinely disappointed, so it could have been a setup issue indeed. Andreas is a straight shooter who I trust.
Golden ratio. |
Gear, I have your email addy, so I can send you some pictures of the Zurich room with Isis to get an idea. I can also send pictures of the Fischer& Fisscher Granite sopeaker and the Rowen with the LMT tweeter.
Matt, sorry buddy, but you didnt send you contact details and you cant post any pix here. IF AGear has it he can Fwd. |
Norman, specs are deceptive. Some panels (Audio Analysis) have bass extension into the 20s but it is perceived as thin due to the physics involved. The same holds true to the Ra apparently. Bob Clarke has measured into bass output into the 20s. Proof is in the pudding I guess.... |
T&F certainly has made even more pro measuremnts and put in on their website. I am sure all these speakers roll in the 20s but the SPL trails off dramatically, and hence the -6db at 40hz!
I have heard the RA, Pkharoah and Isis at shows and can tell you the bass otput of the Ra is really full range and clobbers the others.
Got my email yet? |
Lumenwhite are rear ported, unfortunately.
I will try to get to the Ra as soon as possible. He is not available until early September. I will hear the Avalon and Joseph Pearl 3 by then....
Also trying to hear a Salk SS8 or 10 as soon as I can. |
08-04-15: Wisnon
T&F certainly has made even more pro measuremnts and put in on their website. I am sure all these speakers roll in the 20s but the SPL trails off dramatically, and hence the -6db at 40hz!
I have heard the RA, Pkharoah and Isis at shows and can tell you the bass otput of the Ra is really full range and clobbers the others.
Got my email yet? For sure. I emailed Andreas about it as well, and he made similar statements to those that Bob made.... No email yet? |
For the record, when we make recommendations to Matt as regards to speakers, we all need to remember his natural habitat and vernacular. When he says "bass," what he really means is something that will rattle the side panels of his El Calmino while cruising down the turnpike juiced up on malt liquor.... |
Agear - for your information i don't have an El Camino. I have a Camaro! Lol.
Actually, I have a Porsche and a Jeep.
But I will admit I had a Mustang GT in high school with four 10" subwoofers. Oh yeah baby! I worked in a car stereo store back them and did a killer install. It's always been in my blood. |
Matt .. You should listen to the JBL Everest DD67000.. I think it's exactly what you're looking for |
OK Matt,
I am just putting them out there for you. It seems the Rowen speakers would work well for you, but unfortunately they ONLY sell in Switzerland. They are built to be placed anywhere in real homes and bass response is tamed as the Swiss mostly build with concrete and the owner HATES bass reflex design.
If I think of other suggestions, i will let you know.
Gear, i sent a HUGE file with like 6 pictures...Mmmh, i will check and try again. i found 3 with the ISIS room. i will also see if 6Moons took any... |
Matt, 2 more names for you...
Backes & Muller (german)
and Ypsilon Phaeton (greek and superb sounding).
Ypsilon here: http://www.6moons.com/industryfeatures/highendsuisse2014/1.html
and the money shot on the ISIS room in Zurich here:
http://www.6moons.com/industryfeatures/highendsuisse2014/2.html
Unkind writeup from Srajan here (about the looks):
Playing to the dichotomy of fugly but great sound, Audio Sphere's Enzo Nolli, Swiss importer for Jeff Rowland, had set up a vinyl-fronted rig ending in Trenner & Friedl's Isis. Except for lacking handles and hinges to open in the front, those struck Ivette and I as two fat refrigerators which the Austrian makers clearly expect will set up shop in domestic living rooms. Oy. Whilst dimensioned according to golden ratio proportions from multiplex Birch Ply, these 120 x 50 x 35cm 3-way sarcophagi with horn-loaded compression tweeter would never be allowed in our digs. Which actually is too bad. This room made our second-favorite sound. To produce this type of sock'em slam and density absolutely requires a big woofer. At 15 inches per side, the Isis complied. "Raise the Pharaoh" in a nod to The Mummy would be a suitable alternate to the old "Rock the Casbah" motto. |
Rowen speakers here...interesting read if nothing else. Bipolar radiators.
The s10 and all the "A" range up to the topline a20 have the 5 octave LMT driver (unique tech):
http://rowen.ch/en/data/rowen_a20.php
ROWEN Symphony loudspeakers
http://rowen.ch/en/ls_symphony.php
The optimal integration of a loudspeaker into the living room landscape not only requests particularly high demands at its aesthetics, it raises fundamental audio spatial problems with room acoustic issue, which we cope through the full Bipolar technology. With the ROWEN Symphony line we succeeded in getting substantially closer to a concert-like rendition of music under living room conditions. With this circularly radiating sound columns ambiance and performance stage appear so authentically that the atmosphere of the concert hall becomes experience in your living room.
Boxes simply equipped with loudspeakers at the front only partly consider the acoustic conditions in the living room. They act only within the basic tone range as circular emitters. Reflections at walls, ceilings or floors cause overvaluation of the basic tone portions in terms of energy. The frequency linearity for direct sound and ambient three-dimensional sound are therefore not congruent. This problem is taken in account with our Symphony line with the so-called full Bipolar principle. The entire Frequency spectrum is rendered evenly to front and back, giving these loudspeakers circular radiation characteristics.
We are convinced that additional effort of the doubled equipment with high and mid tone is inevitable, if highest standards are to be met at the rendition of sound. With the full Bipolar the frequency linearity of the Direct sound and the ambient three-dimensional sound is almost congruent. This results in open and clearly transparent sound characteristics with fine, natural brilliance and warmth of music rendition. The models of the Symphony Series play each kind of music with large implicitness. Listening to music at home gets a new dimension – the one of a concert hall.
With the Symphony loudspeakers (excepting S2) the belated extension to the ROWEN Bi-Active-technology is possible. The increase of dynamics and detail fidelity delivers musicality and the character of a live performance even more clearly. With an increasing listening experience and the requirements grown accordingly you can let the ROWEN Loudspeakers gradually grow along.
|
08-04-15: Mattnshilp
But I will admit I had a Mustang GT in high school with four 10" subwoofers. Oh yeah baby! I worked in a car stereo store back them and did a killer install. It's always been in my blood. From 2000-2006, I owned an E34 M5. I had some car audio jocks drop in an Eclispe deck, Audiocontrol 3.1 over/equalizer, PPI amps, a Kicker sub, and top of the line Focal speakers. It was killer. I did more "dedicated" listening in my car and honestly enjoyed it more than my audiophile rig at the time (BelCanto 1.1>>Audible Illusions L1>>Belles 150A Hot Rod>>Cardas GR wires>>Merlin VSM MMs). |
|
Matt, what are your room dimensions again? |
Gear, size wise was about the same as the Zurich room. See my link to 6moons.
Better room treatment in Newport though, with curtains, etc. Zurich was more exposed wall, etc. |
08-05-15: Wisnon
Gear, size wise was about the same as the Zurich room. See my link to 6moons.
Better room treatment in Newport though, with curtains, etc. Zurich was more exposed wall, etc. I saw the link. They used Viva DHT amps and not Rowland in Newport. Matt has a dedicated 9' x 14.5' x 9' room +/- treatments, so he should be fine IMO. Matt, did the MM3s overload your room or was it more of the setup limitations? |
In the 6moons shot you see a chair. There is the first row of 3 plus some walking space behind, so the room is quite deep. Bear that in mind, as it was not a small room, more medium sized.
I will see if I can find a shot of the Warsaw room, where there was no overload.
Sarcophogal looks, so does not solve YOUR WAF problem GearD. Matt wants bass banging potential and these can deliver and perhaps too much!
I am starting to think that the Rowen A20/A12 or S10 would likely be perfect for him. The 5 octave LMT has Heil like speed and finesse and the dispersion pattern of the bipolar config would make placement easy. NO Bass reflex allowed! Unfortunately, not sold outside CH unless he could convince them to do a direct sale, but of course no support locally. Prices at dynavox.ch
Rowen amps are sweet. The top power amps will deliver 4K wpc into 0.5 ohms and they use negative output impedance to compensate for line loss and X-over loss. Unbreakable.
Fun thread Matt, let's have some of your well reasoned out comments. I am having fun throwing things at you and seeing of anything will stick. LoL |
Agear - 15'x18.5'x9'
The MM3 did not, in fact, overload the room at all. They are sealed, powered woofers. The restriction was placement only. When I dialed them in they were stunning. I just didn't like the 6'x6'x6' triangle that worked best with my short room. The 15' width is not the issue, it's the 18.5' length.
I need to find time to get to the Ra to get a feel. I am trying to get my ears on the Joseph Pearl 3 and the Avalons as well. I found the speakers, I just need the time to get to them to hear them.
Wisnon - thanks for the list of eclectics. I research and look into every one of them. |
Thanks Erik. I heard JBL's at Newport. Interesting. I'll look for a local dealer. |
I see Matt. That's too bad. The MM line is nice, and they are not gurly mon speakers as I think Mike is implying here: 08-03-15: Mikelavigne
Matt,
.... the MM3's are 'big-boy' speakers and a hard act to follow.
i owned Kharma Exquisite Reference 1D's for 3 years, then had other Kharma's. they very much remind me of the Martin Coltrane. i also owned Marten Dukes. then eventually i ended up with the EA MM3's for 5 years. i can see where those speakers do come close to the MM3's in some ways, but are not quite capable of the whole picture. they have that transparent and refined ceramic mid-range, and that 'Kharma' coherence. but they don't quite get the total weight and tone in the mid range of the MM3's since they don't quite have the heft in the bottom end.
I have had near field setups in smaller rooms in the past, and while they work, its not completely satisfying irregardless of the speaker. |
TBG - what other speakers were on your short list before jumping on the BMC wagon? |
Matt,
My pleasure. I see that you do look into everything and that is satisfying to me, as you give a fast and honest assessment against your wants and needs.
Good fun and we all get to see and mull over new discoveries. |
Updated list (these are my serious considerations at this time):
T&F - Isis/Ra
Avalon - Isis/Time
BMC - Arcadia
Joseph Audio - Pearl 3
Avantgarde - Duo Grosso
Vandy - 7
Marten - Coltan
Rowen looks interesting. But unavailable in the U.S.
Backes & Mullet also looks interesting. But I can't read German so the web site is tough to navigate and it looks to me like their speakers have either rear ports or rear facing passive radiators. I don't think that would work.
Ypsilon Phaeton - neither the website nor the U.S. Ypsilon distributor have a speaker listed for Ypsilon. No Phaeton to be found.
JBL - I remember hearing JBL systems a few times. I found them to be dynamic and big but lack subtlety and refinement. |
TBG used to own Tidal Contriva Diaceras a few years back and loved them then. I recall his enthusiastic post where he said they were the only speakers he knew that presented no compromises.
A buddy in Holland just got the new Tidal Flagship L'Assoluta and is loving them. They have diamond drivers everywhere and he says they are absolutely transparent. Tidal seems to be one serious speaker company.
Gear, the MM3s are HUGE. They show with Dart gear here in Geneva, so I know them well enough. Beasts.
Matt what about the MM Mini2??? That is super as well and I have heard them in a whole day session last Feb with Dart gear. Much smaller footprint and same house sound and the big and little brothers.
Failing that...Vapor Perfect storm or Derecho? |
Tidal are all rear ported. So they are out.
Vapor Perfect storm is too big, they are huge. Derecho is a lower model. The Joule would be the one that fits my room.
Salk SS10 is in the same genre as the Vapor Joule although I don't honestly think that either the Joule or the SS10 is in the same class as the others I'm looking at.
The MM3 is their reference level speaker. Although I loved it, I liked the sound of the Marten Coltrane Tenor more. And I am trying to find a speaker without a powered woofer.
Although I love sound of the Avantgarde, it really is designed to sound best with a very good low power SET amp (or low powered solid state like the First Watt) and it has a powered woofer. With a low power SET, the powered woofer makes sense. With my powerful Burmesters that have world class low frequency performance using a powered woofer makes no sense. |
I have a pair of Nola Metro Grand Reference Gold speakers coming on Sunday. Which is good because I crated up my Muzik's and my MM3's, and I returned all the other speakers I had. So I am actually speakerless right now.
The Metro's are rear ported. But the dealer and manufacturer feel that since the woofers are two small, very fast 6.5" woofers, that the rear port will not interact as poorly with my room. I'm not sure I believe that, but they are willing to put them in my room to prove it. They are very aware that I am skeptical, but I certainly won't argue as they are supposed to be great speakers. Also, if I do like the voicing but the woofer ports are an issue, the next larger model up (The Baby Grand Reference Gold, which is still a reasonable size for my room) are sealed enclosures. They are, of course, also twice as expensive. |
Matt, I wish I had your direct contact info. More efficient, but so be it.
Best for AG speakers will be a very fast high bandwidth SS amp like a Goldmund Job225 or Telos. I know becuase of a good Boston pal who hated his AG Duos for years till he accidentally borrowed an amp from a mutual pal. Now for the first time in years he is loving it.
As the bass was powered, it didnt make sense, because for the first time the bass was keeping up with the horns. When I spoke to the AG guy at the Zurich show, he said it made sense as the bass amps ONLY cover up to 150hz and the rest is being done by the main amp.
The Ypsilon speakers sounded exceptional. Look at the pictures on the 6Moons Zurich show coverage link I posted above. Short write up at theaudiotraveler.com as well.
EA has a MM7 which is their new Top of the line. Same as MM3 but with Bass drivers added on top....even more HUGE.
If you can somehow find the Phaeton, grab a listen!
Thanks for the fast feedback. |
My apologies Matt its not the Phaeton (that is the amp) its the Eratos! My bad.
Not only were they showing the brilliant integrated Phaethon 110wpc integrated which had been previewed in Munich and should start to export by November, they also had their very first production speaker called Eratos built from 10-year old aged solid wood.
A docked two-box three-way, the pièce de resistance here is Ypsilon's home-rolled ribbon tweeter obviously tapped off their own transformer. Their designer claimed a colossal 15mm of linear excursion and a 2'900Hz crossover point with a for this driver type shallow filter slope of 12dB/octave. Having petitioned these folks for a review sample of the Phaethon already in Munich, I'll reserve sonic comments for the formal occasion later in the year except to say there's good reason why this exhibit opens my report.
http://www.6moons.com/industryfeatures/highendsuisse2014/1.html
http://parttimeaudiophile.com/2014/05/29/high-end-2014-ypsilon-audio-introduces-phaethon-integrated-amp/
http://ypsilonaudio.de/lautsprecher/erato-ls-100/ |
Wisnon - pm sent
I know of the MM7. It's their statement product. Four huge towers. I think the MM3 is their "realistic" reference product.
Ypsilon doesn't have any speaker on their web site, nor does the U.S. Importer. No matter the name. It's just not there....
AG speakers are great. I'm hesitant because of my 11' listening distance and my smallish room. I think my Burmesters are fast enough for the AG and up to the challenge.
I set up an audition for the Pearl 3 next Tuesday. I'm hoping to get to hear the Avalon within a few weeks as well. |
Hey Matt,
You likely mentioned this, but why are you having bass issues with a rear ported speaker? IME, it can be quite a useful tool, in that the closer to the front wall, the more low bass energy you have, to a point. Rear ported speakers can get muddy sounding bass if too close to the front wall. Maybe this is your issue?
Are you locked into a speaker position? Seems as though you have some freedom. Your room is just a bit smaller than mine. Mine is 17 1/2ft X 22 1/2ft X 10ft high, and I have had no issues with rear ported speakers here. I just pull them out into the room until I get the right balance of punch and low end, then tune the room accordingly to make it all balanced. Given your room size, I think the 60hz area is likely your biggest problem. Missing some slam? The traps likely helped this allot, but you might need more trapping.
Bass is the number one issue with getting a system to sound right though, so I can understand your frustration.
One thing that I would do in that room, where that drop ceiling/soffit area behind your listening chair is... I would deface the front of it and stuff that with all the insulation I could get in there, then cover the face with a big speaker grill of sorts. This will go a long way into balancing that room more. |
Mattnshilp I think you would like the Boenicke W8SE or W20. Heard the W20SE at CES a few years ago and they were great. |
Wisnon just asked me off thread what SQ I was looking for. Here was my response:
SQ - as I explained, I want tight accurate base with finesse and refinement but I want impact and scale. I want to feel
It. I want the second and third harmonics from the base that makes the music engaging. I want leading and trailing edges that are accurate but not overstated or blunted.
I want mids that are full and textured. I want complexity and layers and nuance. I want highs that don't shriek and make me wince. Just extended properly reproduced highs with clarity and detail with an inner core of music and depth.
Most importantly, I want my feet to be tapping and I want to be emotionally engaged. I don't want to think about the next song I'm going to hear because I'll be to caught up in the one I'm currently listening to. I want my eyes closed and my body & soul swaying and bobbing to the music, no matter if it's a crappy MP3 or hi-Rez or vinyl.
Is that asking too much? |
JWM - I had a pair of Boenicke W8SE+ in my room for several weeks and I enjoyed them. But they didn't give me the scale and dynamics I am after. And the W20 is rear ported, actually rear horned. So it won't work for me. |
