Putting together a reference level system. My Source is predominantly standard 16/44 played from a MacMini using iTunes and Amarra. Some of my music is purchased from iTunes and the rest is ripped from standard CD's. For my tastes in music, my high def catalogues are still limited; so Redbook 16/44 will be my primary source for quite some time.
I'm not spending DCS or MSB money. But $15-20k retail is not out of the question.
Upsampling vs non-upsampling? USB input vs SPDIF?
All opinions welcome.
And I know I need to hear them, but getting these ultra $$$ DAC's into your house for an audition ain't easy.
Looking for musical, emotional, engaging, accurate , with great dimension. Not looking for analytical and sterile.
Dave, thanks for understanding. Yes, you know my background, lol.
BTW, I must share that when I was out to sea for 11 months at a time, I owned a pair of Stax Lambda Pro's with their portable, battery operated or plugged in amp that plugs into a 1/4" jack (the amp is for sale if anyone wants it, lol) and the first ever CD, Sony ES 501. It was bliss at the time. Bought the CD player at ships store (told my buddy who ran the shop to go get one, lol). I bought every CD that was released for that whole cruise. I didn't have much time to listen, but I sooo appreciated having that to help me get through those years.
Guys, there is no doubt that some mods can elevate the performance a great deal. That said, it's not going to beat out any of the DAC's that are being discussed in the thread as he's looking for the best and not just good ones. There are many really good DAC's 5k and below right now and they are there for every taste. Again, a new thread for that would probably take off. Plenty of DIY's on the boards and it would be very interesting to talk about the mod and how it sounds vs XYand Z. This just really isn't the thread for it is it?
Dave and byang, please don't take this wrong, but I honestly come read the threads to get away from the political stuff. I'm a retired Navy Commander and stay well versed on things, but this place shouldn't need to have to deal with that. I'm sure you guys understand and I hope you aren't made at me for bringing it up. I was emailed and messaged by two lurkers on this thread and it's only been within an hour or so of the back and forth. Thanks
Dlcockrum, Humm,cnn. Who‘s owner of cnn? He dumped his chinese wife right? You think i agree anything nonsense little Cumo makes on cnn?
Regarding mod, as mr chen claimed, only good judgement should be based on golden ears,if and only if, no other way. Money is not, approach is not (tube vs solid state), feature is not even a fact for audiophilers. I perfect ok that none of my amps and lp turntables have remote control. So, why some device makes bettet sound? In dac case, in dgital domain, once power is clean, clock is acurate, data stream just feed the same dac chip w/o any difference (nowadays, chip makers reduced to very few anyway). So the answer is how analog signal get filtered and amplified from dac chip analog output pins.cheap approach is ic based low quality circuit used in tv and computers, those design should not used in high end audio. But selling audio equipment is a buisiness, cnn like media feed all kinds of crab to confuse consumers. Use your ears, not looking at price tag to decide which one is better.
As oppo dac goes, it is my attempt to play both cd and dsd lp achieving files with a mobil phone app. I actually would be happy if it is half good as my assemblage. Now it exceeds my expectation:it has latest dac chip, it uses one of my fav voltage amp ic 4562, its usb interface is decent.i just fixed the weak spots of power supply and coupling crab(good preamp should never use capacitor coupling unless western electric ultrapath design for tube amp). Btw, my korg dsd recording has same issues and more(bad ic chips in signal path), so i have some experience to deal with unnecessary coupling. In korg case, i just short the caps. My phono stage line out is transformer coupled, no reason why recorder needs coupling caps in front.
Klh007, Thanks for your suggetion.i will try transformer based mod for sonica dac, Replace iv and buffer ic circuit with high quality microphone transformers. Tube mod in such a small package is very challenge. I built all my tube preamps and power amps, the key for a good pre amp is regulated /shunt power supply, which take a lot of space.
Btw, the hidden gem of redbook cd dac is old bbrown 1074 dac chip based assemblage dac. I have one heavily mod w blackgate/silver mica and opa637s. Chinese audiophile writer mr chen had high praise for it(w/o my mod version).
It's easy to see why Dan Wright has chosen to mod w/tubes both the OPPO 205 and Sonica, great foundation for advancements. You might want to start a thread detailing your mods and experience with the Sonica.
Klh007, This is my own mod after open the dac up and figure put why factory version has compressed and slow high frequency response. Oppo used cheap diodes and capacitors in a 800 dollar retail price dac which is understandable. I introduced fast diodes and 6800p silver mica bypass caps in power supply which make sound much smooth and faster. I want to remove all those unnecessary coupling caps w/ shunt circuit and replace rca plugs with telflon ones which require majr surgery. For now, just bypass cheap couling cap w/ cooper coil and teflon caps, resulting fast and coherent sound for my violin concerto cd and dff collections. Total cost so far including above components and teflon post, crazy glue and teflon 22ga wires is about $250. Of course labor and research is free for myself.
Consider Wadia 521. It does not have Hi Rez capability hence perfect for Red Book CDs. It is the last of the Wadia models before Fine Sounds took over and has the great Wadia sound. Terrific bass with midrange and tops to match. Solid sound and build
T&A makes awesome stuff. The MP 3100 HV appears to be an SACD/CD Player/DAC that also streams Tidal and such. I don't see Roon ready on its web page/reviews/manual. The dealer who sold me my Davinci 2 is a T&A dealer I'll ask him about the MP 3100 HV. Thanks.
If you are still looking, check out T+A music players. The best CD I have ever heard, and by a wide margin is their PDP 3000HV. Simply crazy it is so good. My MacBook Pro and my Aurender also sound phenomenal through it. It is the only digital product that surpasses my vinyl set up. T+A also has a new music player that streams Tidal (and others) and is Roon ready with flawless performance, the MP 3100 HV.
Matt, I'm down with that, lmao. Seriously, this is exciting.
Wison, thanks. the butter thing isn't true. I look into everything as you can imagine. There is hardly anything that helps with myelin. I'm about to start a new drug that was just passed. It's a twice a year infusion. Hope it works. Anything else you are spreading Matt? LOL...
Guys, I've heard two battery run units. One was a phono. I can't remember the name right now..wait, ti's Sunderland. No dynamics compared to other SS phono stages. Very low noise floor. The other was a preamp and I can't remember the name. I do remember not loving it at all. It was like plugging your mono amp into some of the power strip deals on the market. JMHO, but I haven't heard many of the units out there.
The new Playback Designs DAC series coming out looks really intriguing. The Merlot was excellent. But you can see where budget held him back from bringing it to the next level. A cost no object DAC from Playback will undoubtedly be a player! (No pun intended).
My Shunyata upgrade is complete. All new Sigma NR power cords throughout and a new Denali D6000 grace my racks and outlets.
The Davinci 2 is resting on my rack as well, as is the Lumin S1 with the N10 just below it.
I'm burning the Davinci 2 in for 500 hours and letting the S1 settle in for a week. Will compare the S1 and N10 late next week. And then when the Davinci 2 is fully cooked I've got a treat for you guys. How about a shootout between the Sound Gallery SGM server, Baetis server, Aurender N10, Lumin S1 and a fully loaded 32 Core Memory Player with built in SoTm USB card and reclocker!!!! Oh yeah baby!!!!!
Cstooner soorry to hear about the surgery, but even more so about the MS. For the latter, I hear that eating farm fresh organic butter may help with the re-myelination of the nerves? Worth a shot and if nothing else is healthy and delish.
Matt, that's actually kind of funny and a great analogy, lol. Thanks for the laugh. Yes, everything makes a difference in digital.
Wisnon, I wish I could be there, but I have knee surgery in Sept and won't be cleared to travel anywhere for at least two months. Having MS really slows down my recovery times. Plus, being the Fall, I'd be in OK for football if I could travel, lol....It's too bad as I've love to hear that demo.
Charlie Hansen told me on CA that there will be a Roon server that's non computer based being released in the Fall. I'm going to find out more. It's not going to be an Ayre, but we will see.
Looks like there will be a lot of servers coming out in the next couple of years. Things will need to shake out a bit for servers.
MacDude - you make a good point. But i believe that proper conditioning and good cables can compensate for a lot of the hash from the AC line. I don't think that battery power is the panacea that some think it to be. But your point that the same DAC could sound very different with different conditioning or source voltage is correct and well made.
Jh901 - if Budweiser is the king of beers then pretty much ANYTHING would be the king of CD players. Budweiser adjusted the definition to lower the bar significantly! 😂😂😂
I feel digital is so dependent upon the quality of our mains power. So we are all hearing different things from the same exact DAC based upon our power quality.
I have a Bakoon DAC-21 that is off the grid.
It has the lowest noise floor and distortion I have heard in my system.
And it seems a bit silly now to have spent tens of thousands of dollars on power and ground conditioning. When in the end it still doesn’t stack up to a well designed DAC that’s off the grid.
Hopefully we will get more DACs like the Bakoon or the LIO DAC that is completely decoupled from the A/C with its dual capacitor bank design.
BTW, Cstooner, I will make it to Sarasota, so if you can make it, it will be my great pleasure to meet you in person. I am taking advantage of the fact that I will be in Philly for the first 2 weeks of Oct with my family and will pop down to Fla for the weekend to visit a friend who recently moved there from Switzerland.
It should be big fun, and I will finally get to meet Mike, Rob and Gopher at last. There will be other famous forumites there too. Lukasz will be there too, of course.
There will be a big Lampi Product launch(es) in Suncoast Audio- Sarasota, Fl on Sat Oct14.
The New Lampi Pacific Dac with Active Triode loading, completely redesigned power supply system with 4 tubes supporting them, and completely overspecified power. Physically, I hear the Dac will be double the GG size and will be waaay more dynamic (if you can imagine that). Best guess for the price for the SE basic version is about $22K.
In addition, the recently released Lampi SuperKomputer2 will be feeding the beast. It too has completely redesigned power (took a year to complete, I am told) and no parts are commercially available, all proprietary. Fanless, with ultra-light Lampi mobo embedded Linux and roon supplied engine. I suspect US price will be circa $8.5K, given confirmed EU price of €7K pre-VAT. Audiophile Bill in the UK is testing it now and is in love. He told me he will buy it for sure. Wish I had the spare moolah, as he had me salivating...
Matt will post soon I'm sure, but he's getting the Sound Gallery's (I may too) in to listen to. It's got great press. Can't wait to hear his thoughts on it.
Whether he did or not (honestly, I am not sure whether his last post is just saracasm or not), he did bring up a good potential opportunity to further improve the Comet’s sound - vibration control. I tend toward using conductors to transfer vibration to a dissipative interface, so I thought the hard metal bearings on the bottom of the Comet that are direct coupled to the chassis would be ideal, but perhaps improvement is possible through experimentation. I have had great success with Symposium platforms as a dissipate membrane.
Also, since the Comet uses an external power supply, isolation (not rubber!) of vs conductance from the DAC itself might be beneficial. I plan to test these things next.
Matt - looking forward to your thoughts on the DaVinci.
Playback Designs has a new "Dream series" coming which will include an SACD transport with integrated Syrah server (MPT-8) and a new DAC (MPD-8). Will be out of my price range, but this is the functionality I'd like. Wonder if this new DAC will best Merlot appreciably? Keep in mind.
Hopefully, PS Audio will consider the integrated server concept.
glory, Did you use any of dlcockrum's solutions? What USB and which footers did you use to get the Comet synced to your system? I also noted tha Mike of Verastarr held back and didn't even mention he's developed a few improvements for the Comet.
Thanks for the comment Jason. The Wells Audio gear is VERY good and VERY unknown. They make some of the best high end headphone amps on the market as well. Their Majestik integrated is amazing and their stereo amps are just flat out awesome. Larry, from Distinctive Stereo, introduced me to them. I had never heard of it before. Worth an audition for anyone looking for a great stereo amp or integrated in the $4k to $14k range. And I can't overstate how much I love Merrill Audio's Veritas monoblocks. I happily owned them until I upgraded to my Burmester 911 mk3 monoblocks.
As an update, I have upgraded every power cable in my main system from Shunyata Alpha digital, analog and HC to the all new top tier Shunyata Sigma NR power cables. I also have replaced my older Shunyata Hydra AV conditioner with the newest Denali D6000s. The guys at Shunyata know my system well (I’ve been a big supporter and long time customer of theirs) and they recommended the D6000s over their more expensive conditioner for my system. Because of its physical layout (rack on side, amps up front). The power cables are here. The D6000S is arriving Wednesday. I can’t wait!
Alwo, my Davinci mk2 has arrived at the dealer and he will be delivering it on Wednesday.
So lots to report coming up.
I also secured a Lumin S1 and will be comparing it to the Aurender A10 at the office and the N10 in my main system. THAT should be a fun comparison!!!
Thank you for sharing your opinion and your results, Matt. The context of different findings in systems of varying resolution is important here as you say.
Color me misinformed, but I thought the Merlot was $6500-
With the Comet Plus at $3500- there’s not a huge difference in price here.
Both are excellent choices in their price point. But I consider the Comet a HUGE value for the money, I mean H U G E!!! The Merlot is properly priced and is an excellent DAC for the money.
I don’t think I would suggest someone with a $95k system to audition a Comet Plus as their primary DAC. The Merlot would do their system proud. But I will openly admit that in my small Wells audio/Scansonic sub 10k office system, the Comet did sound a scootch better then the Merlot. And the A10 internal DAC sounded better then both. I was shocked. But go figure......
Interestingly, we did swap power cords and USB cables to make things as fair as possible because everyone was so surprised with the results. It didn’t make a difference. We used a cheap crappy belkin usb and the TotalDAC USB. And a few different power cords. I do think that the Comet (like most DAC’s) requires massive hours of burn in to truly sound its best. And this Comet was well burned in.
As I say, opinions vary and the only way to hear if something works in your system is to try it out.
Hi Matt, long time reader, first time poster (I think... actually maybe I have posted in this thread once already?). So glad to hear you love the Wells Audio Innamorata. They truly are good aren't they? I own the Innamorata Signature. It's twice the price but talk about special. So clean and so musical with absolutely no transistor artifacts to speak of, yet with all the tube like harmonics one would ask for... I too am surprised the Innamorata amps are not considered more. Just another excellent audio company that not a lot of people are aware of, I guess. I hope you enjoy it for a long time. Jason
First, I have read may of your posts, glory, as they frequently pertain to products of interest to me. Your opinions of products/manufacturers are strictly binary (1 or 0) and your posts are unfailingly condescending to others. Not just a bad day here and there as happens to us all, but always.
Second, I own the Exogal Comet Plus. I have found it to be a product that requires time to appreciate and was tipped on that by the friend that recommended it to me prior to my purchase.
I have also found it to be perhaps the most sensitive component I have owned to cabling. Different power cords, USB cables, and even upstream Ethernet cables (in that order) will swing it significantly in a favorable or unfavorable sonic direction. Its sonic character becomes that of the accompanying cord/cable to an comparatively large extent. This, to me, indicates its intrinsic neutrality/transparency/revealing nature, but it is what it is regardless of labeling. I regret that Exogal chose to discourage buyers from experimenting with cords/cables in the product manual and suggest that Jeff reconsider that position.
My usual favorite line of power cords, the "tunable" Synergistic Research active type, drives it from semi-warm to ice cold depending on the model. The usually overly-bass-ripe Tesla T3 UHC power cord is the best I have yet tried with the Comet as it adds low-frequency heft to its sound, which I feel to be the primary challenge in getting the Comet to really sing.
The very fast and ruthlessly revealing WW Platinum Starlight 7 USB cable between my Aurender and the Comet was unlistenable (however that USB cable was magic with the Modwright Elyse). Substitute the Shunyata Venom USB and the sound is somewhat dull, as it was with the other DACs in the comparison. Then, a Curious USB and the porridge from the Comet is nearly just right.
After then comparing three upstream Ethernet cables between my router/modem and my Aurender using the Comet, the excellent SOtM dCBL-CAT7 ethernet cable with its built-in noise reduction network and NASA-level connectors, I found to be not organic enough for the Comet, the SR Ethernet Active UEF SE about the same, but the gray UEF tuning bullet vs the overblown-sounding silver one was very good at adding some needed warmth, yet the Purist Ethernet cable is the best combination of the bunch in this chain in my opinion. Organic, musical, detailed, balanced, beautiful. VERY good cable period, that Purist, and the least expensive (and complex) of the three.
I still, to this point, find that the Comet slightly lacks "Meat on the Bone" harmonic texture and can sound lean compared to robustly rich (in a good way) DACs I have compared it to. However, it showed such promise as a potential keeper from nearly the very beginning in resolution, detail retrieval, PRAT, listener involvement, and tweakability that I will recommend it to those that cannot buy a $$$ "plug and play" DAC and enjoy/are willing to work with it regarding ancillaries.
Look here everyone, Lets give credit where credit is due. Glory, what DAC retails fr $3K that is even close to the engineering inside the Comet plus its very Analog presentation ? You are comparing it to a $10K DAC for Petes sake.Which by the way has plastic feet.. They are Apples and oranges. I know its nice to realize you are living in the Stratos, but to laugh at the Comet is not fair nor a comparison whatsoever. Methinks Ive got a $6500 DAC that is absolutely as good as and possibly better than Rockna to my ears in my room with whatever electromagnetic pull is at this GPS coordinate plus all my mental hangups about how audio "should" be or sound..aaaand OCD.. When Jeff first asked me about how I liked the comet I was like... mmmmmehh.. then said something about my $15K balanced differential 45 triode DAC and the 3 others, but after opening his piece up to inspect, I honestly called him Yoda. Exogal are freaking design Jedis. I have never once in my life seen a piece of gear so brilliantly laid out and put together. Its nothing short of a genius product. You called it a beginner DAC.. I think you nailed it. Its about the smartest market position I could think of with all us tweaky fogies going to pasture. We use "my dads stereo" not the cool, hip product for the times. These guys nailed it square in the kisser. Brilliant, I applaud the Comet and Ion. So I bought them.. Because they are so cool. and portable, and light, and clean..etc.. They are there to loan and or backup. I was going to buy them even if they were never used. Just to remind myself how to think when I design gear. So take a chill pill brother on whacking the company of guys that as far as I am concerned, started high end digital... didnt you ever hear some of those insane WADIA DAC’s ? dude...its one of the founding fathers.. Respect. Honestly If I were to go through the build with you and show you how and why things were dome a certain way... youd get it.. I called him yoda because as usual I was busting balls right off the cuff about certain elements.. one was the plexiglass bottom. Plexi holds static energy. not so good for DAC’s.. So as I was giving him a hard time I faintly remembered metal sphere feet, but my lips kept bumping.. then I said to him, dude, if you freaking set those metal marbles through the plexi into the ground plane, (which by the way is the ENTIRE bottom of the unit), I’m just calling you Yoda.. sure enough.. grounded .. OK, I surrender... I am your student oh Obi Wan.Teach me the ways of an audio CEO. So the Comet is the bomb little beginner DAC that will open this market to the people just starting the hobby... the fresh blood... While we all put on our Beaker glasses and I make some Beaker Wire and try to hear the difference between 68 degrees in my room and 68.3. Laugh at my ass man.. I’m the OCD purist freakster bozo.. These guys are the real deal. True smart businessmen taking our ridiculous hobby serious thank God.. So anywho... I’m off to plug in a magical voodo slab and listen for the leading edge of a music piece and try to determine if it was as defined as before, or did I hear it ever so slightly relax and move rearward. Then I’m going to contemplate if thats something that will keep me in my chair or if I’m going to get fatigued which would just be such a bummer.. but wait, perhaps I could open up the box and poke around in there and stick some stuff here and there...hmmmm lets see what material ???... I know ! Rare earth elements!! Yes ! Thats it ! I know from science class some of them react and shit, so let me go Google research that until the sun comes up and my eyes are bloodshot and Ive ordered hundreds of dollars of stuff from God knows where....LOL, laugh at me bro, laugh at me.. Not these guys..
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