I see the issue with ABX blind testing


I’ve followed many of the cable discussions over the years with interest. I’ve never tested cables & compared the sound other than when I bought an LFD amp & the vendor said that it was best paired with the LFD power cord. That was $450 US and he offered to ship it to me to try & if I didn’t notice a difference I could send it back. I got it, tried it & sent it back. To me there was no difference at all.

Fast forward to today & I have a new system & the issue of cables arises again. I have Mogami cables made by Take Five Audio in Canada. The speaker wire are Mogami 3104, XLRs are Mogami 2549 & the power cords are Powerline 10 with Furutech connectors. All cables are quite well made and I’ve been using them for about 5 years. The vendor that sold me the new equipment insisted that I needed "better" cables and sent along some Transparent Super speaker & XLR cables to try. If I like them I can pay for them.

In every discussion about cables the question is always asked, why don’t you do an ABX blind test? So I was figuring out how I’d do that. I know the reason few do it. It’s not easy to accomplish. I have no problem having a friend come over & swap cables without telling me what he’s done, whether he swapped any at all etc. But from what I can see the benefit, if there is one, will be most noticeable system wide. In other words, just switching one power cable the way I did before won’t be sufficient for you to tell a difference... again, assuming there is one. So I need my friend to swap power cables for my amp/preamp & streamer, XLR cables from my streamer to my preamp, preamp to amp & speakers cables. That takes a good 5-10 minutes. There is no way my brain is retaining what I previously heard and then comparing it to what I currently hear.

The alternative is to connect all of the new cables, listen for a week or so & then switch back & see if you feel you’re missing anything. But then your brain takes over & your biases will have as much impact as any potential change in sound quality.

So I’m stumped as to how to proceed.

A photo of my new setup. McIntosh MC462, C2700, Pure Fidelity Harmony TT, Lumin T3 & Sonus Faber Amati G5 & Gravis V speakers.

dwcda

In the early 1990s I was working with automaker teams to reduce fuel system noise inside the cabin.  They would do DBX testing of fuel systems with 4 jurors sitting in the car inside a hemianechoic chamber.  The procedure was to run the system with engine off first and then with engine on.  Back in the day automakers had warranty costs related to noise so they were taking it pretty seriously.  Then the Lexus brand showed up.  Their new car reset the paradigm for interior comfort.  The body used doubled panels with tar sandwiched inbetween and double laminated glass.  The Ford team evaluated the new Lexus.  Suddenly, the 0-10 subjective rating system that they used dropped a couple of points on average.  Everything is relative.  

First rule of audio:  Your system sounds great, until you hear a better system.

First rule of acoustics applied for audiophiles : Your system sound great, the price does not matter here, if all acoustics parameters in the system/room are balanced then no one lacking or in excess relatively to the others parameters ...

Learning what are these parameters in acoustics matter...Learning how To act on them and with them matter...

For sure the best design in the world will cost more than any relatively low cost system... But if you are in a race to create the best system in the world by only upgrading the gear pieces the probability are high that you will stay ignorant with the essential in audio : acoustics...

People who are ignorant use a common place evident fact as " the costlier the better the design" to describe my recommendation as self delusion...😁

They ignore the power of acoustics...

How did they now my lost cost modified speakers using Helmholtz principle are trash ? And not a super deal way better than many relatively costlier one with no apparent defect taking into account his design limitations, ( i cannot go under 50 hertz with these speakers marked 85 hertz in the non modified specs)  how did they know that ?

They are the deluded one ...

😊

 

 

In every discussion about cables the question is always asked, why don’t you do an ABX blind test? So I was figuring out how I’d do that. I know the reason few do it. It’s not easy to accomplish. I have no problem having a friend come over & swap cables without telling me what he’s done, whether he swapped any at all etc. But from what I can see the benefit, if there is one, will be most noticeable system wide. In other words, just switching one po

 

This is extremely simple.

Step a)

Put blindfold on friend outside the music room (so he has no idea what is inside).

 

Step b)

When blindfold is on, hold his hand and waltz him to the seat, sit him down.

 

Step c)

Start swapping cables 25 times.

 

Step d)

- He's gonna hear the swapping sounds (as he sits blindfolded) while you swap away behind the gear. So, you can also "pretend swap" at times, i.e., unplug cables (give him the 'sound of swapping') and not swap, by plugging em back into the same sockets (tricky tricky 😑). 

 

If he gets it right, 23 out of 25 times it is a pass.

Otherwise, it's a fail.

How is this so complicated? It is very, very straightforward.

How is this so complicated? It is very, very straightforward.

You quoted my post and ended the quote before the reason it's difficult was stated...

But from what I can see the benefit, if there is one, will be most noticeable system wide. In other words, just switching one power cable the way I did before won’t be sufficient for you to tell a difference... again, assuming there is one. So I need my friend to swap power cables for my amp/preamp & streamer, XLR cables from my streamer to my preamp, preamp to amp & speakers cables. That takes a good 5-10 minutes. There is no way my brain is retaining what I previously heard and then comparing it to what I currently hear.

The human brain can retain & compare audio for about a fraction of a second. If it takes 5-10 minutes, or even 1 minute to swap cables, your ability to remember what you heard and compare it with what you're hearing now is effectively zero. 

Don't believe me? Take this test... 

 

Compare the sounds and see if you can tell the difference. But when you're comparing, wait about 5 minutes between listening to each test.