We should reject hard-to-drive speakers more often


Sorry I know this is a bit of a rant, but come on people!!

Too many audiophiles find speakers which are hard to drive and... stick with them!

We need to reject hard-to-drive speakers as being Hi-Fi. Too many of us want our speakers to be as demanding as we are with a glass of wine. "Oh, this speaker sounds great with any amplifier, but this one needs amps that weigh more than my car, so these speakers MUST sound better..."

Speakers which may be discerning of amplifier current delivery are not necessarily any good at all at playing actual music. 

That is all.

erik_squires

@erik_squires wrote:

Then I’d really like to know what you think happens when your reach the maximum excursion of a driver. Either they have limited excursion, and therefore compression, or they have infinite excursion and no compression.

That’s indeed what I’m talking about in regards to mechanical compression, but how often do we reach, let alone exceed X-mech? My point is, before that happens the driver’s suspension has a range of motion within which compression per se as a mechanically induced phenomenon isn’t relevant. What’s arguably more relevant mechanically is hysteresis (or magnetically, hysteresis distortion) as that which happens through the range of cone movement, but that’s hardly a compression issue, no?

Although: smaller (<10"), low eff. woofers certainly makes their effort in reproducing the range <40Hz at elevated, but hardly prodigious levels be known, and when you’re used to a pair of corner loaded, high eff. tapped horns fitted with 15" pro woofers in 20cf. enclosures where the cones barely more than a few mm’s at bonkers SPL’s, it’s all the more obvious. With smaller hifi woofer cones working hard it’s likely a combo of mechanical noise and -compression, as well as the onset of thermally induced compression.

I wish I could find them but I remember seeing tone burst tests showing that thermal compression could happen in a tweeter in less than half a second. You could see the first tone burst perform perfectly, and then half way through the second compression sets in.

Interesting; I take it what could also be referred to as thermal modulation as a more dynamic phenomenon. It’s a shame this area isn’t more well documented, leaving us with the more general ’thermal compression’ description and correlation as heat build-up in the voice coils over longer time.

which compression per se as a mechanically induced phenomenon isn’t relevant.

@phusis I don’t claim to be an expert in all measurements but this seems not to go along with what I’ve seen or measured.

At some point significantly below Xmax I believe there begins to appear evidence of compression, both within the FR and distortion.  I'm not sure how we could attribute any/all of it to thermal without tone burst testing. Take a look at the SoundStage speaker measurements, just about any of them, since they are the only mag I know of that takes compression measurements regularly.

The alternative is to own amps that will drive anything.  I was lucky enough to buy several Class  A amps that were stable into 1 ohm loads early in my audio hobby - a pair were driving the heck out of Apogee Scintillas at 1 ohm setting. 

 

This thread got seriously above my IQ this page, I've been able to play in waters previously too deep because my family took care of me in their passing and I was living within my means before that. Anyhow I learned the hard way about how dull and lifeless a pair of speakers can sound without enough juice. 

 

Here's where I get confused and I hope somebody can explain it in simple terms. Why does huge power matter when I'm listening between .5-5 watts? My speakers sounded dull and lifeless until I turned the volume past 90 db so I swap out my 300wpc and replace with a couple mc 611's and suddenly low volumes sound dynamic? Shouldn't any amp have power to spare at 1 watt?  I've shipped several very highly regarded speakers out because 250 wpc wasn't enough to 'wake them up'. I only mentioned the mac model because IDK if output transformers on a SS amp are a factor in my question.

@steve59 

https://youtu.be/AhB8uL12gtk

this may help...

... also don't confuse input sensitivity of an amplifier with its power output