Why receivers aren't worth the "competetive price"


With all the attention and interest (not to mention market share) that AV receivers get (even more so than speakers I presume), I have to wonder if anyone really cares about absolute sound quality for thier HT setup's!?!
I look at Bose, and how well they do, and tell myself "Marketing is everything!"...hummmmm.
Surely, if it's packaged well, reviewed heavily, advertised even more aggressively, etc, it's gunna be more succesful as a product, or in this case, a product line.
Let's face it, people like receivers! I've probably outsold receivers 20:1 over the years, over better separates based products in this business. And I mean, to be true, I'll conceed, that the allure of an all-in-on, "do-all" little sexy black box with nobs is a fun item to think about, tinker with, and have sitting in a rack. It's a strange pheonomina really. I've been there myself in the past,and have owned a few receivers personally...mostly, however, when I was just getting into all this stuff.
I mean, sure, don't get me wrong, receivers offer a lot of perceived value for what they offer, and for reasonable pricing on occasion. I'll grant that.
But truth be told, my experience over time has proven to me, time and again, that when it comes to absolute sound quality for today's HT/music multi-channel systems, separates still FAR OUTPERFORM receivers by a wide margin! Basically, a good separates system STOMPS the receiver in sound quality, even punishes it!...far more realistic, musical, pure, dynamic, resolved, better signal to noise, channel separtion, soundstaging, you name it! At least that's what I've found to be a "Biblical truth" in AV.
I've matched the biggest flagships from Denon, Yamaha, Marantz, Integra, B&K, even, yes, Arcam in the past with even modest power budget separates,(even drving receivers from their pre's is a step up!) and it's almost clockwork...the separates is just better. And to me, soundquality is EVERYTHING when it comes to the audio side of the equation. So to that end, I don't get it. Why aren't more people buying separates?! I mean, some of these receivers these days are more than $4500, even $6000!! Good night! Personally, I'd never pay even $1500 for ANY RECEIVER, cause I know the differnce, and I love audiophile grade sound. It's like Haggendas over store brand blue label ice cream, to me.
On more than a few occasion, just to check what the state of the current "receiver market" is doing, I've taken some of the hot market receiver pieces, and played with 'em, just for kicks and giggles, and my own edificaiton and knowledge. And every time, the receivers on their own have dissapointed...nothing special usually. Usually the amp sections are SEVERELY COMPROMISED, and the preamp section is lacking. And although the resolution has gotten better in these things lately, the overall sound qualiy still leaves it on the proverbial table! Personally, every time I play my system, I'm reminded of how good it is on the "non-receiver side of the fence!"
Anyone care to comment on "their receiver experience", possibly who've owned better separates, or separates based AV systems in the past? Otherwise, I'd like to know from you "receiver guys", what is it about owning an AV receiver, that does it for you!?!
flrnlamb
The letting go that JONT above discusses is a real good point.

I find when I get a new TV I am hyper for a week or so and then magically I see the good and ignore the flaw/s. Not so with my audiophilia nervosa!

The point about the big box retailers is also valid. So many people will buy $399 HTIB systems for Christmas this year and think they got a great buy without knowing what could be. Ignorance is bliss. Makes me crazy.

I too have heard the proud homeowner crank his Bose system while wearing the look of pride. Or the car salesman proudly reveal the premium Bose system. Aaaaarrrgh!

I've tried to argue the point. Don't know if it has done any good.

Bob Wood

http://www.GreatHomeTheater.com
"Even a lowly mass-market system bought at Best Buy will be able to produce 95% of what you could hear from the most exotic equipment. It's that last 5% that sets an audiophile apart from the mass market consumer."(Perkadin)

Ehem....
Really?!! 95% for best buy gear, ey? Hummmmm...guess I should reconsider things here...don't know what I was thinking evidently...
"It's like Haggendas over store brand blue label ice cream, to me."

Funny enough, they teach the Haagan-Daz story in markting classes in many University. It was regular old "milk sugar and water" and they weren't selling so well, so they made a fancy bucket for it, doubled the price, and marketed it as a "premium" ice-cream - with much success.

Gee, do you think there are any parallels in the HiFi industry?
Cool!...about the Haggendaz story that is.
Well, it may just be milk,sugur, and water. But it's the best combo of milk, sugar, and water I ever tasted! Maybe they put some "mojo" or something in it...you know, sprinkle it with some twice-blessed water, er something er other...lol
Whatever they do, it's better than the other store bought combo's of milk, sugar, and water. That I think many would agree.
Infact, the Haggen-daz ice-cream bar has won many a "face-off" with competetive bars from what I remember. Anyway, I likes it...
However, if Perkadin above is correct about Best Buy's stuff being 95% of the audiophile gear, I think everyone here should stop what they're doing here on the A-Gon, and just plunk down a few hundies for a complete HT in a box system from BB. Save a ton, get the same results...
Sounds good to me.
It's not the packaging, amongst other things it's the butter fat that makes it premium.