I moved from a Panasonic Plasma (last production model) to an LG OLED. Let me assure you, you will notice a difference. I thought the Blacks on the Plasma were good. The blacks on the OLED are so inky good, they put a LED on it to let you know when the set is off! |
The only other company making a "high end" 4K player is Cambridge Audio.
Nobody else, except us here, are buying Disc anymore. Best Buy has announced that they are no longer going to sell CD's anymore and are reducing the shelf space for DVD\Blu-ray sales. I was in BB this morning and they had no 4K players on display and they had a normal Blu-ray player hooked up to the 4k Sony projector in Magnolia.
At the beginning of 2017, Netflix had over 93 Million subscribers, but only 4.1 Million rent physical discs; that less than 5%! I myself am doing about 50% of my media viewing through streaming and I own a DVR. The Networks are forcing us to do this because they can cut out the Middleman. And, if they don't let me watch it at my own convenience, screw them, I'll consume my media elsewhere.
I own 2 Oppo Players and I'm very satisfied with them. I rent five movies/month from Netflix and two 4K movies/month from 3DBlurayrental. I stream about the same amount from Netflix/Amazon/HBO/Comcast etc. I subscribe to about the same amount of Shows online as I record on my DVR.
I used to purchase about 10 CD's/month. Now I purchase about 2-3 physical discs and download about 3-4 a month. It's more convenient to download them and I can get a lot of stuff in 24/96 or 24/192 FLAC.
Remember, we are a very small club here and we're shrinking every day. The next time you start to forget that, look around and ask yourself "How many people are listening to music on their phone and how many have an Astell & Kern player in their Pocket?" Ask yourself "How many people are using generic Apple earbuds or 'High End' IEMS?" |
I'm going to disagree with the "Phone company whats to make a huge profit, so people buy them" mentality and say it's because people want convenience. Consuming music on a phone is incredible easy whether it be through iTunes of Google Play. BTW, all companies want to make a profit. That's how they stay in business and that's how employees continue to get paid.
I paid $320 for my LG V20+ SK Edition unlocked NIB about a year ago. I paid $400 for for my wife's LG+ V30 a few months ago. I pay $9/month for my plan and $3.40/month for my wife's plan (Talk & Text, no Data). Some people have to have the latest and greatest phone at pay full price, or more, on the day it's released. If you overpaid for your phone, well that's on you. And, if you're paying Hundreds for a Cell Plan, maybe it's time to look around for something more economical.
I'm sure that there's a lot more profit in my "audiophile" EIM's then in the Phone or Plan. I have JH Audio, Campfire Audio and Periodic Audio IEM's that were all bought direct. So, that would mean that there probably at least a 40-50 Point line. At the 40 Point mark, there's more profit in my JH audio IEM's then the cost of both Phones. There might be enough to also go out for a nice Dinner. Remember, Audiophile companies tend to be niche, sell less product, and have higher prices.
Let's get back to the topic of this thread. After seeing the announcements for Oppo, I called them to get the reason for their exit. Quite simply, they found that manufacturer Blu-ray Players as an unsustainable model. They sell less Players every year, while cost continue to rise. So, they decided to take what money they had left and put it toward supporting the product that they had already sold; the Honorable thing. The other products they sold were just a small part of their revenue stream. BTW, they were surprised about the Sonica, but it was just too late. We can debate this over and over, but every year less and less people buy physical media. Every year there are less and less "High-End" CD, SACD and Blu-ray players and transports. Right now all the buzz is about Computer Audio and Streaming.
Now, I have to take my leave. My Custom Horse drawn Coach Builder just called and he has some design considerations to discuss. Yes, I found the last Builder of Custom Coaches and you can't have his Telegraph number. |
Basement,
Do you understand how much it cost to do a production run? They have to order hundreds if not thousand(s) of the units from their supply. Up until they made the announcement of their closing, they were not selling everything they made. The only product that was hard to get was the Sonica DAC. Dealers and Oppo were sitting on a lot of Disc Players. The announcement caused a run on the 205's which sold out in about 10 days. I'm going to guestimate that there where about 200+ 205's. I know that about 30-50 were sold through Best Buy/Magnolia.
The cheaper 203's took about a month to sell out. I'm assuming that there were more 203's available. Sonica WiFi speakers are still available.
The announcement motivated a lot of people that were sitting on the fence to finally make a purchase.
Oppo was loosing money over the last few years. They were not selling enough product to cover their overhead (salaries, rent/mortgage, insurance, utilities, etc).
Ask yourself how many people do you know that own a 4k Blu-ray Player?
Hey, if you don't believe what you read here, then call Oppo. I've actually spoken to them twice in the last month; they've always been upfront and forthright.
BTW - On google maps you can actually see the Oppo Facility. Also, they are still taking reservations for 203's and 205's for a potential final run. |
Jeffrey,
Yes, if ISP’s start throttling/blocking competitors the whole streaming thing could go belly up. Then we would have a few years of market disruption before a new way of listening/purchasing music/movies would evolve. Even radio would be effected by this. We’ve become so depending on the internet it’s scary to think of it going away. Could you imagine having to make the decision between listening to the latest Favorite Musician tune or paying your Visa bill? Oh god, we would have to go back to writing and mailing checks and letters. No, stop, the horror! Excuse me, I need to get a frosty beverage.
I don’t like to speculate or assume anything, so when I see something I don’t understand, I pickup the phone or fire off an email.
Audiostick,
When I spoke to them, they said they had enough money in the bank to do another production run of players. Then, because disc players are moving so slow, they would have to wait a year or two or more to sell them. During that time, they would have to hope enough players sold each month to to make expenses. Or they could take that money, downsize the operation, and keep their current customers happy, and their remaining employees paid, for the next three years.
To be honest, when the Oppo 4K players were announced, I called up my dealer and said "I’m excited, put me on the list for one." And then, when they started to ship, I found out that there were no streaming apps. I was using some of those apps in my current player, and was disappointed about that. I spoke briefly with my Oppo dealer about this. And then, I drug my feet for about 6 months before I actually purchased the player. I wonder if I’m just a little responsible for this mess.
I’m sad to see Oppo close it’s doors. Over the years I’ve seen many audio companies that I liked come and go. I’ve spoke on the phone with many of them, met them at shows and dealers, and made some friends. When I look at what’s left of High End Audio, I just want to cry. Life move’s on, things change, learn to deal with it.
Mirolab,
You're hearing about it after the Trade War started. The decision was made months ago. When I purchased my Unit about 6 months ago, my Dealer actually hinted at it. I had called to purchase a Subwoofer, and he said "If you're still on the fence about the Oppo, you better make your decision soon while I can still get product." I ordered the Oppo later that day. |
Basement,
Call Oppo.
BTW - Just got off the phone with my Oppo Dealer. He told me he was selling about 1 Unit/month. Then Oppo made the announcement and he couldn't get enough of them.
Also, I've heard through the grapevine that the Cambridge Audio CXUHD was using the same MediaTek platform/parts as the Oppo 203. The CXUHD does not have analog outputs. If you look at the two players, they look very similar. I have not verified this with CA.
Sony has the UDB-X1000ES for $699 which is based on the Sony UDP-x800 at $299 retail. |
Jeffery,
I spoke to Oppo about the reasoning for dropping the apps. First, it was a challenge to try to keep them up to date. The other issue was the licensing fees. They didn't think that most people really used the apps all that much and it wasn't worth the hassle and expense. They actually recommended that I buy a Roku. I picked up a Roku Premiere+ for streaming duties. It's OK, but the audio quality is disappointing. Roku does do a good job of supporting the device and keeping things up to date.
Most TV and Blu-ray manufacturers only support the built in apps for a few years anyway. After that, you end of purchasing a Roku anyway. Someone goes out and buys a $10000 TV and three years later you tell them that they have to strap a $100 Roku to it for Netflix and they look at you like you're crazy. It's either that, it toss your TV and buy a new one. |
Tutetibiimperes, Yes, agreed. The problem with all these little streaming boxes is they don't support any kind of hi-res audio or even CD quality audio. All these boxes boxes down-sample to DD, DD+ or Dolby Atmos; these are all compressed formats. They don't even give you the option of 2 channel uncompressed stereo. As Junzhang10 points out, the 105 supports hi-res audio from some streaming sites/services. The 103 supported some of those sites/services also. So the perfect combination: - A Roku, AppleTV, FireTV for everyday Video streaming
- 4k Blu-ray player for Best Video/Audio quality from physical media
- A dedicated audio streaming device for audio streaming from services and local sources. Play-Fi and a few others support 24/192.
- Oppo 105 or a computer for those few sites that support hi-res Audio and Video.
I have a 105, 203, Play-Fi and Roku. Unfortunately, they are not all in the same system. I so want all these features in one box. I know it's not really practical and would probably be compromised. |
J,
Thanks, but the 105 is not in the same room room as my computer. |
T,
Looks like you're right. ATV 4k can output 16/44.1 if audio quality is set to "best". Otherwise, everything is mixed to DD. I'll have to do some more research on my Roku, but I think it's similar to ATV. The Nvidia shield does to hi-res over HDMI. I'll have to look into that. Thanks for the heads up.
|
Wolf,
I have over 3000 CD's, In FLAC on my Phone, all which are playable through the head unit in the car. Why would we want to go back to the days of in-dash CD's players or truck mounted Changers; they were a pain in the ass. I no longer have to worry about Jewel cases and alphabetizing my CD's to make them easy to find. I now have my entire library in my pocket and I can listening to it anywhere.
Pretty soon, the same will be true of Video. That's why OPPO got out when it did. |
@vpi ,
I was responding to @wolf_garcia post about in-dash CD Players no longer being installed in new cars. While I have a decent sound system in the car, I realize that it is not an ideal listening environment. I have Bluetooth 5.0 capability in the car and in my phone, so it can handle my 24/192 Lossless FLAC files with no problem. My point was that constantly loading and unloading discs/disc changers was a real PITA.
As for using my phone as a playback device, it has an ESS SabreDAC ES9218P D/A converter that supports 32/384 and DSD256. For IEM's I use JH Audio Layla's and Campfire Audio Vega's. At the gym I use Periodic Audio Be's. I have a very,very, very large memory card plus the internal storage for my music. It makes a great portable rig for the gym, waiting rooms, grocery shopping or just chilling in the back yard enjoying nature. I don't own any earbud thingy's.
I do have a dedicated listening room. It was tuned/designed by Rives Audio. Speakers are ML Summit X's which are soon to be replaced with ML Renaissance 15A's. I own both an Oppo 105D and a 203. I was going to order a 205, but just cant justify it.
I watch about two movies a week on Blu-ray, and two movies a month on UHD-Bluray. I never spin CD's anymore. New music purchases are either downloaded or ripped and then transferred to the music server and phone. I have a whole plethora of music streaming devices.
I too moorn the loss of Oppo. I too agree that they made great players and a very good price point.
Less and less people are buying/renting video disc every year. Less than 4% of Netflix subscribers still get discs in the mail. Best Buy and Target are drastically parring down the number of CD's they carry. Best Buy is having a hard time moving $79 UHD-Bluray players. Let's face it, Disc Spinners are a dying breed. I really enjoyed the tweekie nature of vinyl and reading the jackets and liner notes; I never developed that romanticism with CD's.
Hope this clarifies things.
All the best,
|
@wolf_garcia
You joke, but in the 50's and 60's there were actually record players for cars.
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I do occasionally miss playing vinyl. I really liked my Linn Sondek, CJ Sonographe and Ariston. However, I don't miss the Delphi Oracle MK4. It was sooo finicky and prone to vibration. I remember spending a lot more time setting up to play a side than it actually took to play a side. After dropping the stylus, I would tip toe over to the listening chair and very gentle sit down. I eventually purchased a very heavy Rockport TT stand. Flooring was subfloor over concrete slab. The next step was to tear up the floor and re-do it; I wasn't going there.
BTW - Delphi still makes their reference CD turntables. |
