What are we objectivists missing?


I have been following (with much amusement) various threads about cables and tweaks where some claim "game changing improvements" and other claim "no difference".  My take is that if you can hear a difference, there must be some difference.  If a device or cable or whatever measures exactly the same it should sound exactly the same.  So what are your opinions on what those differences might be and what are we NOT measuring that would define those differences?

jtucker

Showing 2 responses by erik_squires

I'll give you guys a mystery of my own.  I got into upgrading speakers for a little while and the results were fun and educational.

I used a DATS V2 to measure replacement parts.  I believe Focals use Solen as their OEM and IMHO it shows.  I really prefer the sound of the almost as inexpensive Mundorf MKPs instead.  Anyway, I replaced the tweeter caps after measuring the original and new caps for capacitance and equivalent series resistance (ESR).  Both were very very similar.

For about 4 days after replacement I kept hearing weird surround sound effects.  I would hear sounds from the recording appear to happen below and behind me.  Later on this cleared up and never happened again.  The resulting sound was less harsh and more mellow than the original caps.

The weird sound effects I have always chalked up to head related transfer function (HRTF) effects.  The idea that the right comb filtering can make us hear things happen in 3D space.

HRTF effects are complicated.  If I wanted to measure or prove/disprove this was happening I'd need to have recorded the sound and compared the frequency response and phase responses of the before and after.  If that measured the same I'd chalk it up to my hearing, but to this day I think HRTF would explain what I heard and capacitor break-in behavior a lot more than uF and ESR.

My take is that if you can hear a difference, there must be some difference.

In my case, yes, but in your case I have no idea, you could be fooling yourself. 😂

 

If a device or cable or whatever measures exactly the same it should sound exactly the same.

The problem I have with this argument is that it believes our existing, common measurements are all that could tell us anything about sound. I do not believe this to be true, at all. Most of the measurements audiophiles are familiar with were developed 30 years ago or more. Yes, we can measure them with more precision, but their definitions haven’t changed.

These measurements were made before high speed data collection was available and data retention and processing was a lot more expensive than it is today but unfortunately we have not really taken much of this into account in developing new measurements.

Let me give you a super simple example. Vibration control. AFAIK no one has a standardized measurement of the effects of sound on electronics but measurements and tests could be trivial.

Another kind of testing might be to measure the output at the speaker terminals with different speaker cable and compare the spectral and phase characteristics of the signal. Instead we have people spouting nonsense about theories of wave propagation through insulators that have absolutely no measurements behind them. Hell you should record it and put it in a youtube.

Before anyone asks me, I am not your lackey. I don’t get paid to do this kind of work, that’s for the magazines and gear makers to do. I’m just saying that overall the state of testing has stagnated 30 years ago and it’s a real shame.