Tube PHONO preamp interference - RFI, EMI, bad grounding?


Hello!

My tube phono is picking up interference most probably from the air. It's EAR yoshino 834p, using three 12AX7 tubes. It's sounds pretty amazing and I willing to try everything to keep it. 

Here is a sample of the sound - 

 

The rest of the setup is ARC LS16 mk1, Classe CA200, Chord Qutest, Technics SL1200 with Nagaoka MP200, Tannoys D700

I have tried many things already -

- grounding the phono to the preamp, grounding the phono to a socket, covering the phono with a pot, saucepan - no change

-plugging the phono preamp alone into an integrated (Bryston B60) and removing other stuff.

- the important part is I have taken the phono to two other places and it worked perfectly fine, even with the cheapes cables.

- I haven't had any problems with previous phono preamps which were all solid state. 

- if I unplug the turntable the signal fades to about 50%

- if I try different RCA cables, there's not much of a change even they are shielded (audioquest mackenzie, supra etc.)

- the signal also fades when I grab the cables. Also works if I grab or squeeze the output cables. 

- I have tried to wrap the cables into aluminum foil, I have noticed a difference but it's still unlistenable.

- I have tried pluging in a 5 meters long RCA output cable and walked with the phono preamp around the room. It's simply like carrying an antenna. Placing the phono on the floor helps but again, the interference is still present. 

 

Do you have any suggestions what else to try? Is there some kind of grounding that would prevent the phono preamp acting like an antenna? 

I haven't tried a new set of tubes yet. 

I think the 12AX7 are simply too sensitive to all the mess in the air. The ARC LS16 preamp was catching the same signal very quietly when I took it's cover of. 

Thanks!

Filip

128x128filipm

OP,

 

My condolences on your plight. In hearing your first recording, my reaction is that is digital… digital signals sound like that.

 

As for the ARC amp… I assume you tried plugging into the power conditioner. It doesn’t sound like a ground loop. But if all components are plugged into the same circuit, that is eliminated.

On the ARC amp. Can you use an insulator and push on it and stop the buzz?

 

Good luck. I would borrow components (even cheap ones) and swap them out… to identify to verify it is the EAR. Then just swap it out. Sorry to hear of your predicament.
 

 

@filipm ok - sounds like a plan. Good luck to you!

FYI - one last thing - that 33 ohm value you found between the phono shields and the chassis on the EAR does not sound right - all the phono stages I have have negligible values (0.1 ohms) like your REF150 between shields and chassis and ground. I looked up the schematic of the EAR and suspiciously R16 is a 33 ohm resistor, and more suspiciously R16 was recently replaced. I am not an expert, but in the schematic it doesn't look like it supposed to be attached to ground. I'd recheck that one.

That noise to me sounds like something is generating on the building AC power service line or on the apartment circuit. I would like to see what's else is on the same circuit. Sounds like a motor driven fan or compressor and even a celling fan or something turning. "Maybe even the buildings boiler room generator or vibrating power massage chair"!

The vibrating chair was only for humor but something is oscillating on this circuit...

Bill M

 

 

 

That noise to me sounds like something is generating on the building AC power service line or on the apartment circuit. I would like to see what's else is on the same circuit. Sounds like a motor driven fan or compressor and even a celling fan or something turning. "Maybe even the buildings boiler room generator or vibrating power massage chair"!

The vibrating chair was only for humor but something is oscillating on this circuit...

Bill M

 

 

 

I have measured the impedance between the ground plug on the inlet and the grounding pin of the chassis (or any screw) - it’s 33.2 ohms.

REF150 - the impedance between the ground on the inlet and any screw on the chassis - 0.01 ohms (0.00-0.02)

@filipm 

IF the first statement is correct and about the EAR (and succeeding posts suggest this is so) THEN the EAR is incorrectly grounded.

So we need to double check:

The ground pin of the IEC connection should tie directly to the chassis of the EAR. To not do so puts the unit at odds with EU directives for voltage safety.

The 33 Ohm resistance would then occur between the chassis (or ground pin of the IEC connection since they are the same) and the ground of the RCA connectors.

So here's another measurement to take. What is the resistance between the RCA connectors and the chassis? If zero Ohms or very nearly so, I think we found the problem despite remonstrations from EAR.