I don't know if any of you have the SPs Rack with acrylic shelves. If you do, get rid of the acrylic and get their new Grids to replace them. StillPoints keep costing me lots of money, but bring em on! |
Glaucon, yes the Ultra SSs are better than the AL versions. I directly compared them. You would never consider buying the AL once you heard the SSs, unless your supper would not exist were you to buy the SSs. The SSs obsolete all prior isolation. The ALs do not.
But the SSs now are obsoleted again by StillPoints. The Ultra Fives are hideously expenses at $650 each! But under a $10k turn table they allow it to sound like a $40,000 turntable. In fact I have heard a $150,000 turntable that was very good but nowhere near what I heard with them under my tt. |
Podeschi, you will be awed by the Ultra Fives under the turntable. I must say that four or clearly better than three if you make certain that all four are engaged with the component. I had the advantage of having those under the tt screwed into a StillPoints Component stand. Since there are no height adjustments on the Ultra Fives, you need a flat bottom to your tt.
I have heard that the Ultra Fives are clearly better than the Magico QPods even under Magico speakers. |
Jpan, try the StillPoint Ultra Fives, if you dare. |
Jpan, given your recommendation, I looked up the Strange Attractors. I understand how the StillPoint Ultras work, but I must say I don't have much of an understanding of how the Strange Attractors work. They say the resonant energy is "refract, dissipate, and reflect the vibrations off a sequence of boundaries." I know manufacturers have to have proprietary secrets but this is too vague. They also show a black cone which would seem to go into the aluminum top housing. The cone would seem to be a composite material.
Can you tell us more about where you compared the Strange Attractors with the StillPoints Ultras and what the shelves were under both? |
Gbmcleod, I think my problem originates from the power of the Ultra Fives. I have used them on top of many components with great but expensive benefit, but in some instances they do harm. It also seems to depend on what is under the component. Ultra Minis and Ultra SSs are okay but not Ultra Fives.
I really have no explanation for the problem with the HB Designs Acrylic PowerSlave.
I should note that in the vast majority of cases, the various StillPoints Ultra are marvelous. For their impact per cost, the Ultra Minis are clearly a best buy. I would not try them under 80 pound amps or speakers, however.
I have noticed incidentally that Minis are isolators under components. The ceramic balls isolate the component from the base of the Minis. I have had mixed results with the Ultra Fives and have yet to try the Ultra SSs. I think this is important for the same reason that getting cables off the floor are important, namely static electricity. |
Jpan, your's is probably a more common path to assessing the benefits of isolation feet than mine. Initially, I had no interest in the original StillPoints and learned that the new Ultras were quite different. Then I had the chance to hear speakers with and without them under them. I bought eight. These were the Ultra SSs. I removed the spikes from my speakers and screwed on the StillPoints. I was really in disbelief about the improvement. Gradually, I got more and more of the Ultra SSs and each and everywhere I put them, I got a great improvement. Ultimate I had 32 of them! Yes, this represents a lot of money but together they gave me more improvement than even a $100,000 amp would give. I concluded that after listening to the Ultra SSs that no other isolation device was anything but a toy. I literally have boxes of other devices that no longer have any value to me.
Then came the Ultra Fives. Are they five times better for having five of the "technology" units versus one for the Ultra SSs? That is really hard to say, but if you were ever to hear them under your speakers where you previously had the Ultra SSs, you would do whatever you had to to be able to get the Ultra Fives. And under your turntable, wow! |
Podeschi, and Ultra Five (much, much better. |
Podeschi, did you get the SP Ultra Fives? What are your impressions? |
Gbmcleod, the magic of great realism in sound production is quite fragile as you suggest. However, it includes many things you don't mention such as the speakers, your position, whether the power cords are on the floor, whether the speaker wires and ics are close to power cords, etc. And there are limitations, of course, such as what others think of the system you have laid out. My wife said, "I'm tired of having a sound laboratory in my great room."
Presently, I am working with the room treatments which are so critical in my very small listening room in New Mexico. It is 10x13x8 feet. I found that one of my Zilplex resonators was one eighth of a inch lower than that on the other side and was moving the sound stage toward the other side. These things are very powerful although they are just one half inch in diameter silver bowls.
I should also say that seldom having the isolation devices in each of the four corners of a component is the best location for them. If you have great latitude for placement, put one under the main transformer. Trial and error is the only game in town. |
Gbmcleod, I find the use of SP Ultras, including the Minis varies greatly depending on the ac filter used. SP Ultra Minis could not be used under my HB Designs Acrylic PowerSlave as it isolation feet are too long and difficult to remove. I put two SP Ultra Fives under it, and it was a disaster. They robbed the sound of all dynamics, much like rubber and soft woods do.
I tried the Ultra Fives also under the High Fidelity Wave Guide unit on its rails and found no benefit, but directly under the unit worked quite well. I tried to use the Ultra Minis but it was just too precarious.
I have used SP Ultra SSs under several ac devices with great success. These include the Sound Application, the Synergistic Research Power Cell Mk I and Mk II.
I would imagine that the amount of vibrations allowed within the filter affects the effectiveness of the isolation feet. |
Tubegroover, I didn't say the Ultra ALs were superior or the equal of the Ultra SSs. It was the existing special feet on the HB Designs Acrylic PowerSlave that were better than the Ultra Fives.
I use the OEM aluminum feet under my LSA1s in New Mexico and have not tried the Ultra Minis there as I don't want to know they are better. The OEMs have no resale value as only manufacturers could get them. |
Gbmcleod, I guess there must be an interesting story behind your using your wife's name in posting.
I agree totally about keeping the cables off the floor. This is one area where reviewing gets to be a pain. I often end up with a snake's nest of pcs, ics, etc. behind my rack despite perhaps cleaning up everything maybe three times a year.
I was unaware of Einstein's remark, but will always remember a EE professor telling me that Ohm's law and a few others "totally" covered what happened in a circuit. Having been a grader in a physics course, I responded that I didn't think that was true. The look on his face convinced me that EE wasn't going to be a major I could tolerate.
On your room remarks, I would urge you to try Zilplex resonators. I have a big room in Texas and a very small room in New Mexico and both benefitted greatly from these guys placed where Zilplex says to place them. I have tried perhaps twenty other devices ranging from reflective mirror and absorbers to tubes, Tibetan bowls, digital equalization, etc. The Zilplexes are clearly the best at least in my two rooms. Obviously trial and error is our only way to assess the influence of anything, other than perhaps hosing down our system. : ) |
Fleschler, I have seen many vibration devices come and go and have boxes of them. I had thought it was all merely a matter of what resonance point pleases you, but Star Sound Technology's Audiopoints proved this to be more complicated than I thought. Their brass Audiopoints sound better than any other brass point I have tried.
Halcyonics active isolation units, however, have no resonance frequency at low frequencies. And StillPoints' Ultra series seeks to convert all vertical resonances into heat. The Halcyonic units are too expensive and the SP Ultra Fives are expensive.
So we now have mechanical ground versus isolation devices, with the question being, which sounds better. I do know that on my TriPoint Troy Signature, the Star Sound "mechanical grounding" was better. |
Gbmcleod, years ago when my friend was the US importer of the Duntech speakers and had a room in McCormack Place in Chicago when the CES was still there, his room had heavy reinforced walls and was 50 x 30 with 12 feet ceilings. He was using the Sovereigns with FM Acoustic electronics. The sound was just outstanding for what was available at that time.
I would love to have that room. My big room is 28 x 18 x 11.5 and my small room is 13 x 10 x 8. Why would I bother with this small room? It is in our small home in the mountains of NM and was my only choice. Have I improved it with other devices? You bet you I have.
The room is very important, but commonly few of us have a real choice. So saying what you said is true and largely irrelevant. |
Ebm, I sold all of my Roller Blocks long ago. I thought the original Aurios were much better. |
