I've heard stories about Herbert Von Karajan being able to distinguish between live and recorded sound coming from the speaker by detecting TT slow-down during orchestra "forte". These are just stories - I have no reason to believe them, hut I'm far from being Karajan. Piano overtones don't follow exact multiples of frequencies so pianos are tuned stretched - sharp at trebles and flat at basses to avoid beating. Would it cause beat with other instruments producing exact multiples of 440Hz? There are likely more errors like that in complexity of symphony orchestra and detecting 30min beat oscillations seems to be very far fetched.
Source of Fremer's "1 arc second" claim?
In the latest TAS April 2025, page 34, Fremer reviews some Technics TT, and repeats his claim that "listeners in blind tests could hear arc second speed shifts". where one revolution ~1.3 million arc seconds. Anybody have any idea where this is coming from?
Basic math will make you wonder whether any listener can hear a difference between chamber a' = 440.00000 Hz and 440.00004 Hz, rounding the 1.3M to an even 1M. When tuning my violins, I can hear 2–3 cent difference, where 800 cents = 1 octave = doubling of frequency. At 2 cents, that is over 1 full Herz difference. Even playing a cord with tones at 1 Hz difference will result in an oscillation at 1 Hz, i.e. peak to peak 1 second. For easy math, assume even a 0.00005 difference, which would lead to an oscillation with frequency of 20,000 seconds = 33 minutes. Good luck hearing that.
"Golden Ears" being able to hear ten times better than a normal human, why not. But 20K better? We are off by several orders of magnitude. Maybe I don't understand that he is talking about, but I consider it complete BS.
Maybe it has to do with consistency (accuracy vs. precision), but then the a different unit needs to be used that includes time in the denominator. But even then the math/physics don't add up.
If anybody can provide any insights, LMK. Thanks!
The alternative is rather unflattering for Mr. Fremer.
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@kijanki The whole "equal temperament" piano tuning is a whole other story, with splitting the comma. There is a nice book "How Equal Temperament Ruined Harmony", interesting read. For those of us who appreciate natural trumpet and other harmonics driven instruments such as tromba marina. I completely agree that the complexity of music completely obliterates those tiny frequency differences. Heck, vibrato (if you must use it as an ornament) by far exceeds 1 Hz. My question, though, is: Anybody have any idea where Frermer comes up with this? |
Audiophile/phools possess hearing skills superior to any mammal. Some even treat this hobby as if they as playing an actual musical instrument 😂! One time at an audio show, the exhibitor played LP I had with me. In the group of listeners were a few high falutun, self absorbed/proclaimed "experts" The group made all those audio adjectives, and how great the recording and system was. I was hearing a lopsided presentation? Looked around and noticed the left speaker cable was disconnected! Respectfully, I waited until the music finished and pulled the exhibitor aside to inform him.... I have massive tinnitus and 7KHZ hearing defict.
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