Shoot-out Klyne 7xp3.5 vs IO Signature

Hi Lewm,

We are getting side tracked here on this thread! I already have solen film bypasses on the output electrolytics. The value of the output caps is in excess of 600 uf if memory serves... I always planned to get a pair of these:

http://www.eci-capacitors.com/PDFs/UL30_Series_21.pdf

Never got around to ordering some.. the form factor is larger so I would have to be creative to mount them without modifying the chassis. All the caps in my amp have been changed from the awful Goodalls to modern films for reliability.

Cheers,

Nkj, You might get significant improvement in the sound from the Futterman H3 by bypassing the electrolytic output caps using high quality film caps. If you have an original H3, an even better thing to do would be to get rid of the old lytics and replace them with some state-of-the-art low-ESR types that are now available, like Panasonic TS-EDs or FCs (depending upon the voltage rating needed) THEN bypass those new lytics with some good film caps. I predict this will ameliorate the grainy quality you hear but will also have unanticipated benefits across the board.

Thank-you, Syntax, for your observations.

Lewm,

I have certainly had the Futterman in the line-up. Funny, even with this 40year old + piece of equipment you can see very clearly in to the illusion. It is uncanny. The Futterman is grainy but suits the quads well. I have never had an explosion or failure either so I have not experienced the pyrotechnics some speak of with this amp.

It's voltage regulation and bias seem to hunt around a bit, but this is more a function of the tubes and their reflection back to the circuit. I really like that amp. I used to own acoustat model threes and acoustat X's (sorry I sold them, warts and all). I have heard regularly, big dyna audios, revels and audio physic and for all the limitations of the quads, not ready to give them up yet. I like the Verity line-up and might consider it in future. Never, heard Sound lab (would love to!) I know I would love them.

One combo I have not tried yet is the Klyne with the Berning.. now talk about punchy bass!

Regards,

Care to elaborate Syntax?

Additonally, how would you describe the Phantom vs. Triplanar, vs. Grandenza from a practicality, robustness and tone perspective?

From the technical point, the XONO has higher gain, but that was the only advantage for me.
The Klyne has the HFC network and it can go with 47k for any MC, and this is a huge advantage.
Or you can load the cart. with some resistors.
Sonically the Pass is very clean but thin and dead. It sounds mechanical in comparison.
It remembers me to ML25, detailed but cold.
There are endless Phonostages out there, but when you want to find the „Real Thing“ (no coloration, real sizes, right body, etc...), there are not more than 5-8 out there. It is complicated and marketing can replace everything today...

The Triplanar VII is a excellent unit with its good cable and when using Cartridges below 10gr.
With heavier carts it simply looses information in the high frequency area, it is a bit lifeless and the "airy speed" is not there anymore (compared to other Arms, for example the Phantom, DaVinci or very heavy Arms).
I know, some use this Arm with Koetsus and are happy, but to be honest, there is better out there....
It simply can't compare to the next in this case.

The Phantom is much better in this, based on its very heavy block, it can handle lots of different cartridges (I used a few from 4-14gr) at a superior level.
The Adjustments are outstanding and Bob Graham made with this Design a major step forward. Very innovative and no weak points (except possible mismatches with wire or colored turntables)

The DaVinci is remarkable, because it works with every cartridge I tried (from 4gr-14gr) on maximum level. Comparable to the Phantom, but with a little bit different sound.

To the sound
I like the Triplanar, it is good to listen to. With the right cartridge it goes out of way. but it is not among my top units.

The Phantom Arm is very precise and the results can vary based on the connected Phono cable. The differences can be huge (I tried XLO Sign., Siltech, Purist, IC-70 Graham Phono, Kondo Phono cables and some others with it).
The Phantom has an excellent - complete - frequency range, linked with an absolutely amazing holographic Speed in the lower Frequencies. Very precise, super soundstage, the right height and body...
You get what you feed (but it can be negative too)

The DaVinci is the right one for the LISTENER, wide and deep soundstage, a relaxed and precise reproduction with all information that the cartridge can give.
A Sit-back-and-refuse-to-get-up-Arm.
Record after Record ....

Hope it helped

cheers

Nkj, Great system. Have you tried the Futterman H3s on the Quads? Our tastes in equipment are somewhat congruent, as I am using Atma-sphere MP1 preamp and Atma amps to drive Sound Lab M1s and have owned Quads, KLH9s, Futtermans, etc. My closest audio buddy in this area uses Berning ZH270s (a pair in mono configuration) to drive Acoustats. This is not so off-topic, since it convinces me you may be on to something with the Klyne.

Care to elaborate Syntax?

Additonally, how would you describe the Phantom vs. Triplanar, vs. Grandenza from a practicality, robustness and tone perspective?

Looking for a new arm on the 301.. thanks,

Anyone here ever compare the Klyne to the Pass Xono?

Yes, I did.
In my System.

Lewm,

I should really post my system. For now:

· Oracle V
· SME V
· Garrard 301 here:
http://gallery.audioasylum.com/cgi/view.mpl?u=127&f=DSC00407.JPG&v=f&UserImages=127&session=&&moniker=AJ&invite=&w=675&h=506
· Koetsu Rosewood Signature Platinum, Lyra Helikon, Benz Ruby 2
· Aesthetix Io Signature, 2 supplies, with volume controls
· Wyetech Topaz 211C
· Berning ZH-270
· Quad ESL Piquet refurb. and Quad USA monitors
· Valhalla cables

An admiration for vintage too with:

· Futterman H3
· Citation II
· Marantz 2
· Others

Music taste run to jazz, vocal and will rock out from time to time. The bass "quality" with the Esl’s is quite good.

Regards,

Nkj, Would you care to tell us what amp and speakers you are using, what music you prefer, etc? As far as I can tell your system is not posted. Thanks.
Anyone here ever compare the Klyne to the Pass Xono?

Nkj,
I have the identical opinion.
Happy Listening.

Hello,

I've had the Klyne for a little while and actually have been too busy to report back. The Io has a sense of stage space and air that is expansive it's lowest resgisters on my system are slightly plump. The top end of the Io does not sound unnatural but some may argue that it is not hyper extended and have a shimmering quality. My system is quiet. With the Io I have no noise problems.

The Klyne is clean clean, with an extended top end and and very defined punchy lower register. It does not have quite the expansiveness of width of the Io. It's stage depth is very good. This is an exceptional solid state unit that I could easily live with and from a form factor point of view certainly is preferable to the Io. It does not grand stand and draw attention to itself. Very refined with great user adjustable features that will play with audio neurotics fears for some time.

I am keeping both for now and continue to build my opinion. On the used market, if you can find one, I would recommend the Klyne.

NKJ, I had a Klyne 2.5 and thought it was fantastic. I eventually ended up with a custom tube pre with eq settings (simple JE Labs RCA circuit w/no feedback).

At the same time I had the Klyne, I had two other solid state phonos: Dynavector P75 and ASR Mini Basis w/chip upgrade. The P75 finished third in these comparisons (as would makes sense when looking at price). The ASR had a nice fat tone with truly amazing dynamics (best I ever had from phono playback) but sounded mechanical. I felt the Klyne was perfect sounding but eventually ended up with a FF tube pre w/eq so that I could play my 78s and early monos.

Can't wait to hear about the comparison...

Nkj-curious what your thoughts are vis'-a-vis' the Klyne 7px/Io shootout now that you've had a few weeks.

Just for full disclosure, I own the Klyne-but don't mince words!

I know the Klyne 7 Phono 3.5.5 pretty well. Some of my friends own it.