Seeking turntable upgrade advice

Thanks for the reply, Doug.

The reason I was considering a 265 is because I know someone who is selling one used. However, I have followed up on Ebm's suggestion to contact Highwater Sound and I was extremely impressed with Jef. I'm thinking that seeking out a TW Acustic Raven One may be a better overall purchase.

(thanks, Ebm!)

Riley804: You're absolutely right. I had a ton of issues when I first got into analog. It wasn't just related to my TT though - my first cartridge was whacky as was my Rhea (which had to be repaired). For a long while I wasn't happy, but over time I've learned a fair amount and lately I've been enjoying analog a lot; I just feel I'm not getting the full benefit of my cartridge with the arm I have.

Sonofjim: I hear the 5As often as a friend of mine has a pair. I adore them to be honest - they just wouldn't work out for me in my room (I move my speakers between HT and 2 channel mode and the 5As aren't conducive to that. I am very happy with the Sophia's as a compromise. I recently switched to the latest line of Pass amps and am very happy with them (XA 100.5's).

I did try to purchase a Galibier but finally gave up (I think Thom is just too busy). I too am interested in TW, and while I have yet to locate a dealer for them, I have a hunch they may be out of my budget. I recently visited a friend who had an SME setup and it sounded wonderful. I didn't know analog could be that quiet.

In any case, I'm looking to find a good table that I get my hands on sometime soon (as opposed to 6 months from now).

Regarding the Doshi: it's an impressive unit, but not for me. Mine is now for sale.

Doug,

When we met, the problems with my analog rig (as I saw it) were:

- low frequency ringing
- slight lack of high frequencies

The ringing was heard by all, the lack of high frequencies wasn't, although I often heard the comment that my tonearm was holding things back.

I tried various things to get rid of the ringing (damping etc) and even asked VPI for advice. Their answer was to increase VTF to 2.5 or higher. This did help but wasn't a total solution.

Having dealt with other issues in my room (which is still not as lively sounding as I'd like) and improved the playback chain, I now want to change my tonearm so I can take full advantage of my cartridge. It's really as simple as that - except for the fact that my table is a VPI and restricted to VPI tonearms (please correct me if I'm wrong). I've purchased a Tri-planar arm and now I need to find a table that is a good match.

I'm not sure I understand everything you're saying about harmonics, but my take-away is that you're suggesting I get a less than detailed tonearm because my system or room can't handle harmonics.

What erroneous conclusion have I arrived to with the Doshi other than it's not to my taste in my system? It's a highly regarded piece of equipment and I'm not saying there's anything wrong with it. Btw, the mismatch for me was not due to the phono stage, but rather the line stage. I spent a fair amount of time and money playing with isolation and tubes, trying it in other systems to get a good feel for its character and I think in my situation I'd be better served by something else. That's allowed, no?

This thread was simply about trying to find a TT match for my Dynavector XV-1s cartridge and Tri-planar arm, not the Doshi.

Thom: for the record, we spoke at least twice - both times you said you would follow up with me in the next few days and both times I never heard back from you. I'm not criticizing the way you operate, but having no idea when I could successfully place an order (let alone receive a unit) is not for me. It's now been a few months and I've given up. Our conversations were very enjoyable and I have no doubt the quality of your products is top notch.

SonofJim: You're are most correct - the SME's are expensive! I'm now considering a Teres 265. Any caveats with this choice? Phono is a Manley Steelhead and preamp is an unknown.

What gives you impression I have distorted harmonics in my system, Doug? You haven't heard it... I'm confused.

I might be close minded here, but I'm not convinced that you can compare tables when they're in completely different rooms and systems. How much of the character of what you're hearing is the table versus other components including cartridge etc. I wouldn't be able to process all that.

I really like hearing and getting to know a component in my own system.

I took the plunge and purchased a TW Acustic. I'm confident that I'll be getting a good table and I should be satisfied given it'll be a serious upgrade from what I'm currently listening to. The bonus is that I'll have it very soon and have great dealer support.

Thom: Good advice, just not as fun. :-)

Doug, out of curiosity, while the 265 may be step down from the Galibier, Reven, your 320 (and maybe SME?), would it still be a step up from my Scoutmaster considering it allows me to change the tonearm?

Teres doesn't offer the 320 anymore. The next model up from the 265 is the Certus (450) and I'm guessing it is out of my budget.

OK, I see where you're coming from now. The only area where you're confused is:

"As we heard with your TT/arm/cart in my system, your rig actually produces clean harmonics. The "ringing" comes from other components which can't handle those harmonics."

The ringing was as clear in your system as it was in mine. Zero difference. Perhaps I'm using the wrong term - maybe I should use 'resonance'. Do you recall listening to Steely Dan and hearing the snare drum produce a resonating sound that sustained during silences on my TT but not yours? I could tap my TT base and the same (pitch) sound would occur. Some suggested adjusting the damping fluid, but others suggested that the tonearm was holding me back. In any case, it was clearly independant of room and other equipment.

In any case, I’m pretty happy with my harmonically challenged system. Having changed every component in the past 3 months (including cabling, power conditioning) it’s resolving to the point that I can finally hear differences in cables and electronics and am enjoying the life sized soundstage and detailed imaging. Recently I’ve had the pleasure of auditioning some of the best preamps available and discovering each has its own set of strengths and weaknesses and how important synergy is. Too fun, not to mention educational.

It will certainly be enlightening to find that when I change to a superior tonearm, instead of my analog source sounding as good or better than my digital, I’ll suddenly want to sell all my LPs. Oh well, live and learn. 

"My guess is that you could spend a million dollars on a turntable and you could not get it to sound good."

Not sure I understand you. It already sound very good and I am enjoying what I have. Now that I'm not being limited by other aspects of my system, I want to get something even better. What's wrong with that? Isn't that what we audiophiles do?

I've learned that just because something is reviewed well doesn't mean it's going to sound good in your room, with your equipment etc. I've also learned that changing more than 1 piece of equipment at a time is not the way to go. I don't see how listening to different turntables in different setups is going to tell me anything. The mere difference in loudspeakers will be enough to throw off any comparison. If you can get around that in your auditioning, then more power to you - I couldn't.

Ebm - I got a Raven One. I had already purchased a tonearm (Triplanar) which I'm very excited about.

Mrmitch: are you saying that the TW Acustic is known for being more musical than analytical?