..and there are no stat dynamic limitations on the 10D. Truly mind boggling. I can play large symphonic music with the huge drums at very high volume - you name it. They take it. They violate every premise of stats. Know why? Roger Sanders is a genius. |
Bombaywalla, the speakers do have a very tall and wide (not unrealistic) sound stage. I heard my friends Magico Minni II a while back and while he loved them, I felt there was only have a height of a sound stage - thats how the sanders stats spoiled me. Now, remember, the stats are upgraded from what Roger had in 2013. The new aluminum bass driver makes a world of difference. As for the width of the sweetspot - I have a rediculous barco lounger for my chair - its big and wide and I dance in it while I listen. No vice and no sitting in an imaginary position. I am dancing in my chair. Left to right, up and down. I also upgraded the digital crossover from audiosmiles. with the 2 magtechs and tara labs the one IC and speaker cable, I know theres better, but I cant really imagine it. Take a look at my pics on my system page. The speakers are almost 6 feet and Im a short guy so they are above my standing ear. |
07-06-14: Cerrot
The sweet spot is the sweetest spot. It sounds three demensional, involving, incredible. It is not bad at all out of the sweetspot ..... that's what I thought too when I listened to them at RMAF2013. The room was very active & I managed to get a seat almost in front of the right speaker. I listened on both Fri & Sat & both times the room was full & ended listening out of the sweet-spot. So, a question, Cerrot: I'm curious to know approximately how wide the sweet-spot is? Does one have to keep one's head in a vice to the 3-D, involving & incredible sound? Can one move one's head around, say, like Stevie Wonder does when he's singing & still reap the 3-D, involving & incredible sound? My wife thinks the sound is awesome from the front door of the sound room... this seems to indicate that the speaker has pretty good vertical dispersion as well because when she's standing her ears must be above the top of the speaker? Thanx for the feedback. |
The sweet spot is the sweetest spot. It sounds three demensional, involving, incredible. It is not bad at all out of the sweetspot but I don't listen out of the sweet spot. My wife thinks the sound is awesome from the front door of the sound room, but, again, thats not where we listen from. These stats totally take the room away from the equation. |
That would break the laws of physics to have a flat panel speaker that sounded the same everywhere. Maybe more similar in more locations in a given particular room, but exactly the same everywhere is an absolute impossibility.
Stepping into the practical world, I've heard them many times and they positively, absolutely, did not sound nearly the same as I moved around a bit in the listening position.
I had to return several times, at a couple of different shows, to get the sweet spot position so the sound was not heavily biased toward one speaker.
Now I'm sure we will get fanboy comments about how I'm wrong, and how the setup was not right (even though the designer set them up and was demoing them!).
Nice sounding stat. But immune from listening position woes? Ridiculous. Stat dynamic limitations? You bet. |
Hi Cerrot, thank you for your reply. Do I understand you correctly that there is no difference in sound quality if you sit in the sweet spot or anywhere else? |
I have had Rogers speakers since 2001; started with the Eros Mk II and now the 10D and the size of the sweet spot is succh a no-issue. The sound is awesome EVERYWHERE I sit. truly amazing. They take away the room and jst give you whats on the recording! Compared to artin Logan - you will feel like you DIED AND WENT TO HEAVEN. |
Hello, I do not mean to change the topic of the OP, but have a question for this group. I am contemplating upgrading my 12 year old Martin Logan Ascents and am considering Roger's 10c or 10d model. my only concern is how wide is the sweet spot and how different (worse) do these speakers sound if I am not in the sweet spot. thank you for your help. |
I listened briefly to them (I assume they were the 10d model) at The Show in Newport Beach last weekend. Very, very impressive. The system they had set up there retailed for approximately $25K, including a cheap digital setup and cheap cables, or so I was told. Big, fluid, musical sound with not a hint of glare or harshness in my brief audition. One of the best sounds at the show I thought...Stevie Ray was in da house!
Bummer that the warranty on the speakers and amps is non-transferable though. |
Roger is now showing his new 10D's on his website. It has a new aluminum driver with a revised transmission line. I received my pair (I am an original Eros Mk II owner)about 2 months ago and am over the moon with them. You guys may want to give them a listen. |
Let us know when you get them broken and give a short review. |
I am saving up for Sanders ESLs, in the meantime, I am using MG 3.7s that just recently arrived, had MG 1.7s for 2 years. I sold my Ayre VX5e and bought the Magtech two weeks ago.
Wow, explosive dynamics, transparent, detailed but still musical. A much more live you are there sound than the lower powered Ayre. The Magtech is an audio bargain.
I hope to purchase Sanders ESLs by Christmas. Happy Listening! |
Curriemt
I had heard about the amp, which was called the itube, but there were only a few made, and none to be found. The designer began marketing them under the brand name western reserve. There is actually a review of it on Six Moons.
I contacted the designer, and although he was no longer in business, he was able to make one for me. I have had it now for six years, and it has worked flawlessly with sound that really makes the stats sing. This is one I'm taking to the grave with me! |
Czapp,
There's actually no search involved. I'm quite happy with the Magtech. My question was purely out of curiousity.
I am, however, intrigued by your amps. You see, I owned the Innersound 3.5 when Roger was developing those amps. I was hoping to give them a try at the time. Didn't know that they actually became a marketed product. Glad they worked out for you.
I drove the Innersound panels with both solid state (the ESL) and tube amps (Atma-Sphere M-60 and Rogue Zeus). The OTL struggled a bit, but the Zeus was excellent. |
I have the Innersound Kayas, which were designed by Roger, and in many ways are very similar to his current speakers. For the panels I am using a tube amp that was designed for these speakers, but barely made it to market before Innersound closed. I had tried several different solid state amps, but never was captivated like I am with this combination of tubes and electrostats. I believe there are a few tube amps out there that can deal with the extreme impedance dips. One that I thought was fantastic was David Bernings OTL. Not sure of the model, but it was a 70 watt stereo amp, and had no trouble driving the Kayas. I've also heard that the CAT
Amps can handle them. Good luck in your search
Carl |
I have the 10C system, and I also use Magtech's for both the woofer and panels. Previously, I had used NAT Audio Generator Monoblocks for the panels.
I like the idea of tubes for the upper and SS for the lower, but the zero maintenance of the Magtech is sort of a no-brainer. |
